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+--- Thread: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... (/Thread-One-could-say-Zac-is-one-of-the-greatest-Bengals-coaches-ever)
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RE: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... - Awful Llama - 01-16-2023
(01-16-2023, 06:16 PM)TheCincinnatiKid Wrote: Back to the topic, I mean at some point the stats talk for themselves right?
- First back to back division titles.
- First road playoff win. Which was followed up within a week by another.
- First road AFC Championship.
- First 3 win postseason.
- First back to back seasons with a playoff win.
Obviously you can attribute different levels of credit to different parts, but ZT is the head coach and deemed responsible for it all. He obviously doesn't achieve this with Brandon Allen, but at the end of the day it also takes more than Joe Burrow to do all this, and ZT has helped build most of the roster.
If he wins a SB it's a non-argument.
You make a compelling argument. I'd go even further and say that at this point, given the stats you listed and even being short of a SB title to this point, he's already the best. So if I remove any nostalgia I may have from the equation:
1) Zac (for the reasons you mentioned)
2) Sam (One AFC title, two AFC Central titles, three playoff wins)
3) Forrest (One AFC title, one AFC Central title, two playoff wins)
4) Marvin (Four AFC North titles, seven total playoff appearances)
5) Paul (Two AFC Central titles, three total playoff appearances)
As you mentioned, if he wins a SB, then that should erase any remaining doubt.
RE: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... - TKUHL - 01-16-2023
Paul and Sam were two of the most innovative coaches ever. Same with Walsh who should have had his HC chance here. I’m not ready to say Zac is a better coach than any of them. We were ready to run him out of town 2 years ago. Maybe having a great QB and defense is hiding some if Zac’s flaws, who knows. I will say Zac seems to have a good eye for talent as well as Duke. Zac has a great relationship with the players and they all seem to like him. You can just tell these players will bust their butts for their coaches, and with that anything is possible.
RE: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... - JaggedJimmyJay - 01-16-2023
Five candidates:
Paul Brown - 55-56-1 (.495), 0-3 postseason
Forrest Gregg - 32-25-0 (.561), 2-2 postseason
Sam Wyche - 61-66-0 (.480), 3-2 postseason
Marvin Lewis - 131-122-3 (.518), 0-7 postseason
Zac Taylor - 28-36-1 (.438), 4-1 postseason
As of right now I think it’s a really tough call. Gregg, Wyche, and Taylor have a case. I probably give it to Gregg for now? I could change my mind given the day of the week.
Note: I refer exclusively to Bengals tenures and to success on the field. Additional tenures and innovations are ignored.
RE: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... - Sled21 - 01-16-2023
(01-16-2023, 04:56 PM)Clark W Griswold Wrote: I think the reason a lot of credit doesn’t go to Zac is because of his QB. Burrow is a guy who’s got that confidence/borderline arrogance that the whole team embraces.
The interesting question is what how many playoff (SB?) wins would Marvin have if he had Burrow as his QB? Same team just switch out Palmer or Dalton for Joe B and I think they at least win some playoff games.
You act like Palmer wasn't the hottest thing going when hr was drafted. Were you not a fan then? Like him or not for quitting, for a number of years he was one of the hottest QBs in the league.
RE: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... - Soonerpeace - 01-16-2023
(01-16-2023, 09:03 PM)JaggedJimmyJay Wrote: Five candidates:
Paul Brown - 55-56-1 (.495), 0-3 postseason
Forrest Gregg - 32-25-0 (.561), 2-2 postseason
Sam Wyche - 61-66-0 (.480), 3-2 postseason
Marvin Lewis - 131-122-3 (.518), 0-7 postseason
Zac Taylor - 28-36-1 (.438), 4-1 postseason
As of right now I think it’s a really tough call. Gregg, Wyche, and Taylor have a case. I probably give it to Gregg for now? I could change my mind given the day of the week.
Note: I refer exclusively to Bengals tenures and to success on the field. Additional tenures and innovations are ignored.
Taylor is a long way from being declared the best ever Cincy coach. 4 seasons is just not a big enough sample size.
RE: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... - Soonerpeace - 01-16-2023
(01-16-2023, 07:37 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I had been heavily in the fire Zac side after his 1st 2 seasons but I'm in the he's a good coach now. My concern for him is still the offense. This defense is beyond special and probably the best one I've seen with this team ( but only been a fan since 2005 ). We are gonna start losing pieces and I don't think this offense will be good enough to win with out them. Not trying to be a downer just trying to look at it from a different perspective. I just think we have too much talent and the offense isn't that creative at times.
Glad after listening to Joe’s comments on Zac and the offensive coaches game prep and then Dan Orlovsky the other day I feel they are way ahead of the rest of the league.
RE: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... - bfine32 - 01-16-2023
The greatest Bengal Coach ever was Bill Walsh. But for some reason, Paul Brown didn't want him to be a head coach
RE: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... - jason - 01-16-2023
(01-16-2023, 10:14 PM)Sled21 Wrote: You act like Palmer wasn't the hottest thing going when hr was drafted. Were you not a fan then? Like him or not for quitting, for a number of years he was one of the hottest QBs in the league.
A number of years = maybe 3 years. Palmer had a late career resurgence in Arizona, but his peak here was short.
RE: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... - JaggedJimmyJay - 01-16-2023
(01-16-2023, 10:24 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Taylor is a long way from being declared the best ever Cincy coach. 4 seasons is just not a big enough sample size.
I think it’s enough. Otherwise you’re eliminating Gregg as well. These are Super Bowl coaches that I don’t think should be disqualified.
RE: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... - JaggedJimmyJay - 01-16-2023
Perhaps the single best case for Zac Taylor is that he’s the only Bengals HC to ever win a road playoff game (and he has two of those).
RE: One could say Zac is one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever..... - Luvnit2 - 01-16-2023
(01-16-2023, 07:37 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I had been heavily in the fire Zac side after his 1st 2 seasons but I'm in the he's a good coach now. My concern for him is still the offense. This defense is beyond special and probably the best one I've seen with this team ( but only been a fan since 2005 ). We are gonna start losing pieces and I don't think this offense will be good enough to win with out them. Not trying to be a downer just trying to look at it from a different perspective. I just think we have too much talent and the offense isn't that creative at times.
An offense and a defense starts in the trenches.
Our OL when healthy was not top 15, now that we have lost 3 starters, our OL is in bottom 3rd. It makes a good running back, receivers and the QB look average when the OL stinks.
Yes, we have a talented QB and skill players, but an average to bad OL now due to injuries.