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+---- Thread: Decency, Trump and Obama. (/Thread-Decency-Trump-and-Obama)
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - hollodero - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 09:47 AM)michaelsean Wrote: The Nordstrom affair? You mean when he tweeted he thought they treated his daughter unfairly?
Yup. I know it's not a big thing, but it's officially abuse of power. He tweeted it out with the official POTUS account too, hence used it for personal benefit. If say our chancellor did that, he would have hung himself in that very moment.
Maybe, maybe an instant apology and deepest regrets and all that could somehow do damage control, but doubtful, especially if there was some history involved. And especially if he additionally had a spokesperson giving a "free commercial" for daughter items. How that could not result in some serious consequences, I don't know. That is Romanian democracy style.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - BmorePat87 - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 10:53 AM)hollodero Wrote: Yup. I know it's not a big thing, but it's officially abuse of power. He tweeted it out with the official POTUS account too, hence used it for personal benefit. If say our chancellor did that, he would have hung himself in that very moment.
Maybe, maybe an instant apology and deepest regrets and all that could somehow do damage control, but doubtful, especially if there was some history involved. And especially if he additionally had a spokesperson giving a "free commercial" for daughter items. How that could not result in some serious consequences, I don't know. That is Romanian democracy style.
I would say the biggest concern is the fact that he knows he can publicly criticize a company from the official POTUS twitter account and temporarily tank their stock.
Then again, in Nordstrom's case, they quickly recovered. Maybe dropping Ivanka was good.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - GMDino - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 11:05 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: I would say the biggest concern is the fact that he knows he can publicly criticize a company from the official POTUS twitter account and temporarily tank their stock.
Then again, in Nordstrom's case, they quickly recovered. Maybe dropping Ivanka was good.
This is what I think most sane people understand.
When reality star, frequently going bankrupt business man Donald J Trump tweets (repeatedly) that he has "very good sources" that President Obama is not naturally born US citizen that is just the ravings of private citizen who craves attention.
When duly elected POTUS Donald J. Trump tweets that he "was just told" or he "just found out" that President Obama ordered a wire tap of his private residence THAT is something that carries more weight given his position of power.
I say often, but it is true: Words are just words. But some words carry more weight given their historic context or the source of the words.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - michaelsean - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 10:53 AM)hollodero Wrote: Yup. I know it's not a big thing, but it's officially abuse of power. He tweeted it out with the official POTUS account too, hence used it for personal benefit. If say our chancellor did that, he would have hung himself in that very moment.
Maybe, maybe an instant apology and deepest regrets and all that could somehow do damage control, but doubtful, especially if there was some history involved. And especially if he additionally had a spokesperson giving a "free commercial" for daughter items. How that could not result in some serious consequences, I don't know. That is Romanian democracy style.
I personally didn't have a problem with it, but say I did. What kind of consequences do you think there could be?
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - GMDino - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 11:16 AM)michaelsean Wrote: I personally didn't have a problem with it, but say I did. What kind of consequences do you think there could be?
He could have been "counseled" about it I guess.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - hollodero - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 11:05 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: I would say the biggest concern is the fact that he knows he can publicly criticize a company from the official POTUS twitter account and temporarily tank their stock.
Then again, in Nordstrom's case, they quickly recovered. Maybe dropping Ivanka was good.
That might be a concern, it's not amongst my biggest ones regarding this instance, and it doesn't even make top 50 regarding overall concerns with Trump. It's not really important to me. (What Dino just said, for example, is more concerning.
It's not the point I tried to make though - which is, it's an official abouse of power to use an official POTUS account for private stuff/personal benefit. And you just let it slide. Even let Kellyanne free commercials just slide. What is that?
So my "concern" regarding Nordstrom, how obviously the occasional ethics breach and misconduct is just overlooked so the liberals don't get their success - as if it were solely about that.
It's abuse of power, simple as that! Again, this is Romanian democracy style, not western democracies style.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - bfine32 - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 10:53 AM)hollodero Wrote: Yup. I know it's not a big thing, but it's officially abuse of power. He tweeted it out with the official POTUS account too, hence used it for personal benefit. If say our chancellor did that, he would have hung himself in that very moment.
Maybe, maybe an instant apology and deepest regrets and all that could somehow do damage control, but doubtful, especially if there was some history involved. And especially if he additionally had a spokesperson giving a "free commercial" for daughter items. How that could not result in some serious consequences, I don't know. That is Romanian democracy style.
Actually Trump tweeted it on his personal account (it was later re-tweeted on the POTUS page). Either way, it was probably stupid to do; however, I'm not sure it is abuse of power as he didn't demand they continue the line.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - oncemoreuntothejimbreech - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 11:26 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Actually Trump tweeted it on his personal account. Either way, it was probably stupid to do; however, I'm not sure it is conflict of interest as he didn't demand they continue the line.
So it's another incident of poor judgment in a pattern of poor judgment.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - hollodero - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 11:16 AM)michaelsean Wrote: I personally didn't have a problem with it, but say I did. What kind of consequences do you think there could be?
First, it's not so much about you or me having a problem with it. The law should have a problem with it. I don't know about your personal conduct policies for a POTUS though. I said it already, here it would probably result in suspension proceedings. And no political party would get behing that behaviour, which is why one of our politicians would probably be done. Reason: Malpractice, abuse of office, using official platforms for pure personal benefit. It would not be acceptable.
Now on a personal level, I think Trumps erratic behaviour is a danger to the country and the Reps should have used that to try to get rid of Trump. Or not. But at least a severe clap on Trump's fingers, at the very least, would have been in order. What bfine suggested maybe, a "censure".
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - michaelsean - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 11:39 AM)hollodero Wrote: First, it's not so much about you or me having a problem with it. The law should have a problem with it. I don't know about your personal conduct policies for a POTUS though. I said it already, here it would probably result in suspension proceedings. And no political party would get behing that behaviour, which is why one of our politicians would probably be done. Reason: Malpractice, abuse of office, using official platforms for pure personal benefit. It would not be acceptable.What I am saying is we don't have any kind of mechanism to do any of that. Hell Harry Truman threatened to beat up a guy who gave his daughter a bad review in a musical.
Now on a personal level, I think Trumps erratic behaviour is a danger to the country and the Reps should have used that to try to get rid of Trump. Or not. But at least a severe clap on Trump's fingers, at the very least, would have been in order. What bfine suggested maybe, a "censure".
No, he did not. I mean, yes he did, but he retweeted it on the official account.
And I did not claim conflict of interest, but abuse of office.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - hollodero - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 11:48 AM)michaelsean Wrote: What I am saying is we don't have any kind of mechanism to do any of that. Hell Harry Truman threatened to beat up a guy who gave his daughter a bad review in a musical.
I see. Strange. (I say strange without knowing exacly what mechanisms we had. It would be a political outburst, for in a broader picture we would regard it as corruption. No one - meaning no one in parliament - could get behing that without damaging his own reputation.)
That Truman thing is amusing... and not exactly the same thing. Although I would argue it's deeply troubling as well.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - bfine32 - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 11:39 AM)hollodero Wrote: No, he did not. I mean, yes he did, but he retweeted it on the official account.
And I did not claim conflict of interest, but abuse of office.
Yeah, his office re-tweeted. In my mind when you act in a conflict of interest you are abusing your power. I just found the terms to be interchangeable in this instance. I will correct my earlier post.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - bfine32 - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 11:33 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: So it's another incident of poor judgment in a pattern of poor judgment.
Yep.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - oncemoreuntothejimbreech - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 12:09 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Yep.
Poor judgment + questionable ethics is a bad combination.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - bfine32 - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 12:35 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Poor judgment + questionable ethics is a bad combination.Yep. What is the plan/ To remove every Politician that has exercised poor judgment and questionable ethics?
He's who we elected. Folks knew the day that they went to the ballot box who he was. All these civilian clambering for impeachment have no clue what it takes. Start breaking some laws or ignoring the Constitution (not one's interpretation) then we'll talk. My view is right now he needs to just be told formally to slow your roll.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - Griever - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 01:11 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Yep. What is the plan/ To remove every Politician that has exercised poor judgment and questionable ethics?
He's who we elected. Folks knew the day that they went to the ballot box who he was. All these civilian clambering for impeachment have no clue what it takes. Start breaking some laws or ignoring the Constitution (not one's interpretation) then we'll talk. My view is right now he needs to just be told formally to slow your roll.
they need to question him under oath about the wiretapping before any sort of investigation
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - Belsnickel - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 01:11 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Yep. What is the plan/ To remove every Politician that has exercised poor judgment and questionable ethics?
He's who we elected. Folks knew the day that they went to the ballot box who he was. All these civilian clambering for impeachment have no clue what it takes. Start breaking some laws or ignoring the Constitution (not one's interpretation) then we'll talk. My view is right now he needs to just be told formally to slow your roll.
Any time someone violates the Constitution it is based on interpretation. Some are just more cut and dry than others.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - oncemoreuntothejimbreech - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 01:11 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Yep. What is the plan/ To remove every Politician that has exercised poor judgment and questionable ethics?
He's who we elected. Folks knew the day that they went to the ballot box who he was. All these civilian clambering for impeachment have no clue what it takes. Start breaking some laws or ignoring the Constitution (not one's interpretation) then we'll talk. My view is right now he needs to just be told formally to slow your roll.
Where have you read me mention impeachment?
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - michaelsean - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 01:32 PM)Griever Wrote: they need to question him under oath about the wiretapping before any sort of investigation
They need to question Obama, and then wait for Drudge to reveal the blue dress with the hidden microphone.
RE: Decency, Trump and Obama. - bfine32 - 03-09-2017
(03-09-2017, 01:37 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Where have you read me mention impeachment?
Nope, that's why I said "all these civilians" and not "you".