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+---- Thread: Trump admin to end separation policy (/Thread-Trump-admin-to-end-separation-policy)
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - fredtoast - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 02:50 PM)PhilHos Wrote: If Time wants to report there's a problem, maybe use a picture that accurately represents said problem.
So you don't think any kids cried when they were separated from their parents?
What if they used a drawing? Would you say that was "not real? What if they used a stock photo of a crying child or an actor? What difference would any of that make?
I can't believe how easily Trump supporters can be distracted from the real issues.
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - PhilHos - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 03:08 PM)fredtoast Wrote: So you don't think any kids cried when they were separated from their parents?
I'm sure many did. Probably lots of pictures of that. Shame Time couldn't find one.
(06-25-2018, 03:08 PM)fredtoast Wrote: What if they used a drawing? Would you say that was "not real?
Drawing would be fine as long as the drawing was depicting a child being separated from its parents. No, I would not say it was "not real".
(06-25-2018, 03:08 PM)fredtoast Wrote: What if they used a stock photo of a crying child or an actor?
Probably not a good idea but it wouldn't be as bad as taking a real picture of a real child really crying and tryinig to make it seem as if the child was crying because of something Trump did.
(06-25-2018, 03:08 PM)fredtoast Wrote: What difference would any of that make?
Oh, I don't know, journalistic integrity; which is important to most of us. Clearly not to you, but then again, that's your right as an American citizen.
(06-25-2018, 03:08 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I can't believe how easily Trump supporters can be distracted from the real issues.
I'm no Trump supporter, but you don't think it's possible to have an opinion on multiple issues? You don't think it's possible to hate Time being disingenuous and also dislike Trump's immigration separation policy?
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - fredtoast - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 03:59 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Oh, I don't know, journalistic integrity; which is important to most of us. Clearly not to you, but then again, that's your right as an American citizen.
Again with the straw man.
Time did not make up the crisis at the border. That is what I care about. What picture or drawing they use does not make any difference to me. Only the people who fall for Trumps deflection of blame care much about that.
The picture does not change the story. The picture does not change the issue. The picture is just something Trump has used to get his followers a reason to blame the media instead of him.
However if you want to talk about "integrity" what about Trumps claim that it was impossible for him to do anything to fix this problem just 3 days before signing the executive order to fix it. That was a flat out lie. If Trump supporters really cared anything about "integrity" then they would be turning away from the President instead of attacking TIME magazine.
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - bfine32 - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:07 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Again with the straw man.
Time did not make up the crisis at the border. That is what I care about. What picture or drawing they use does not make any difference to me. Only the people who fall for Trumps deflection of blame care much about that.
The picture does not change the story. The picture does not change the issue. The picture is just something Trump has used to get his followers a reason to blame the media instead of him.
However if you want to talk about "integrity" what about Trumps claim that it was impossible for him to do anything to fix this problem just 3 days before signing the executive order to fix it. That was a flat out lie. If Trump supporters really cared anything about "integrity" then they would be turning away from the President instead of attacking TIME magazine.
But perhaps folks don't Blame Trump for the child separation; I know I do not. He simply enforced a law to draw attention to an issue. Anyone doing any deflection is someone that deflects from someone crossing our border illegally while there are law abiding citizens trying to migrate the legal way. They are doing that by saying: "Look they're taking away their children!!!". While ignoring the illegal activity that lead to that point.
There is no strawman in suggesting Time used a photo that calls into question journalistic integrity and falsely stated the child on the cover was separated.
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - Bengalzona - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 03:59 PM)PhilHos Wrote: I'm sure many did. Probably lots of pictures of that. Shame Time couldn't find one.
My understanding is that the administration has blocked media, photos and videos from current facilities and from border operations. In Arizona, a bi-partisan coalition of state politicians had to solicit the admin for access to a facility holding detainee children this weekend. They were not allowed to take pictures. When one of the congressmen tweeted that kids were being kept in cages, her phone was taken from her.
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - fredtoast - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:14 PM)bfine32 Wrote: But perhaps folks don't Blame Trump for the child separation; I know I do not.
It was his policy. He claimed it would work as a deterrent. And he was the one who corrected it when it went bad.
But obviously he had nothing to do with it.
Just more "fake news", right?
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - Bengalzona - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:14 PM)bfine32 Wrote: There is no strawman in suggesting Time used a photo that calls into question journalistic integrity and falsely stated the child on the cover was separated.
I believe the operative word is "implied" as I don't think they made the claim in writing. But that is just media in the 21st century. This is the same process by which Fox News or any other media outlet imply one story is 'more important' than another story by placing it as a headline and, in some cases, not airing the other story at all.
Welcome to the Pandora's Box the Reagan and Bush admins opened by backing down former FCC regulations.
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - bfine32 - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:20 PM)fredtoast Wrote: It was his policy. He claimed it would work as a deterrent. And he was the one who corrected it when it went bad.
But obviously he had nothing to do with it.
Just more "fake news", right?
He did not create the policy that crossing the border illegally is a crime. You spend to much time in the echo chamber you accuse others of being.
But what I said is I don't blame him for the separation; I blame the law breaker.
No one here has suggested he had "nothing to do with it". He had a lot to do with it. One thing was to try to deter folks from crossing illegally as the way the policy was currently being enforced there was no deterrent,
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - Bengalzona - 06-25-2018
Out of curiosity, is anyone arguing that separating mothers and fathers from their children is a good thing?
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - bfine32 - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:26 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: Out of curiosity, is anyone arguing that separating mothers and fathers from their children is a good thing?
Depends on the mother and father, But yes it can be a good thing.
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - bfine32 - 06-25-2018
Out of curiosity is anyone claiming that illegal immigration is a good thing?
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - Bengalzona - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:27 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Depends on the mother and father, But yes it can be a good thing.
And you trust the government to make that call?
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - bfine32 - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:29 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: And you trust the government to make that call?
Sure it happens all the time for the betterment of this child's welfare.
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - Bengalzona - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:37 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Sure it happens all the time for the betterment of this child's welfare.
Okay. But do we trust the government with deciding who should or should not have firearms?
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - bfine32 - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:41 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: Okay. But do we trust the government with deciding who should or should not have firearms?
I can see this is a one way conversation. I do believe many requirements to own a firearm are decided by the government be it federal, state, or local.
I will say the constant one line questions have grown tiring and this is the 3rd one of yours that I have answered while you have not answered my one.
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - Bengalzona - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:47 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I can see this is a one way conversation. I do believe many requirements to own a firearm are decided by the government be it federal, state, or local.
I will say the constant one line questions have grown tiring and this is the 3rd one of yours that I have answered while you have not answered my one.
I gave three questions, you gave three answers (statements). Thank you.
What is your question?
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - fredtoast - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:25 PM)bfine32 Wrote: He did not create the policy that crossing the border illegally is a crime.
That is not the policy I am talking about.
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - fredtoast - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:28 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Out of curiosity is anyone claiming that illegal immigration is a good thing?
No.
Trump has been against illegal immigration since the day he took office. Maybe you should educate yourself as to why it became such a huge issue in just the last couple of weeks.
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - Bengalzona - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:28 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Out of curiosity is anyone claiming that illegal immigration is a good thing?
Businesses here in the U.S. that solicit the cheap work source.
RE: Trump admin to end separation policy - bfine32 - 06-25-2018
(06-25-2018, 04:51 PM)fredtoast Wrote: That is not the policy I am talking about.
Oh, he also didn't make up the policy where kids cannot be detained with the parent.