LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Printable Version +- Cincinnati Bengals Message Board / Forums - Home of Jungle Noise (http://thebengalsboard.com) +-- Forum: Off Topic Forums (http://thebengalsboard.com/Forum-Off-Topic-Forums) +--- Forum: Politics & Religion 2.0 (http://thebengalsboard.com/Forum-Politics-Religion-2-0) +--- Thread: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias (/Thread-LE-Leaks-show-treatment-of-pro-BLM-protestors-vs-conservative-militias) |
RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - GMDino - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 09:43 AM)bfine32 Wrote: I actually expanded on it as I saw my reply was "Dino-like". But the point remains. The question is moot. Do you want to compare it to the shooting in the Wendy's parking lot instead? You'd have more of a point there. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - bfine32 - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 09:46 AM)GMDino Wrote: The question is moot. Do you want to compare it to the shooting in the Wendy's parking lot instead? You'd have more of a point there. Nah, I think George Zimmerman and those Houston guys are a better corollary. Citizens policing their neighborhoods against wrong doers. Unfortunately. the vast majority of citizens do not receive training on escalation of force. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - GMDino - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 10:09 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Nah, I think George Zimmerman and those Houston guys are a better corollary. Citizens policing their neighborhoods against wrong doers. Unfortunately. the vast majority of citizens do not receive training on escalation of force. Just like the police in the Wendy's parking lot were trained... Much more similar cases where there was someone being aggressive and then fleeing...if the Seattle case involves fleeing like you say....one shot and killed by well trained in escalation police and the other by "thugs". RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Sociopathicsteelerfan - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 03:11 AM)Dill Wrote: When asked for linkage between a Far Left Security Force (your term) I believe you started using this phrase in this thread. I've never used this term in my life because it's inaccurate. It's properly spelled far left extremist vigilante thugs. When you can get basic facts right again let me know and we can resume our discussion. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - bfine32 - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 10:12 AM)GMDino Wrote: Just like the police in the Wendy's parking lot were trained... Yes, law enforcement officers are training in escalation of force. Self-appointed cops are not. We'll just let those who read determine which cases are more corollary. I'm gonna go with yours and Fred's heroes of George Zimmerman and those Houston guys. Hell they felt threatened and shot. They're not like that wimpy ST. Louis couple that only threatened to shoot when they felt they were threatened. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Sociopathicsteelerfan - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 09:43 AM)bfine32 Wrote: I actually expanded on it as I saw my reply was "Dino-like". But the point remains. Here's what happened based on available facts. CHOP self described "warlord" issues firearms to "security force". Security force patrols CHOP openly carrying rifles (which I believe is illegal in WA) Reports of shots fired from a silver SUV, later amended to white Jeep. CHOP "security" actively hunts down said Jeep. CHOP "security" riddles Jeep with bullets, killing one occupant. Clear audio recording of the incident reveals statement made after initial flurry of gunfire, "Oh, you're still alive", then a several second pause and a final gunshot is heard. Police arrive to investigate and find that the scene had been "heavily tampered with". Everything else is speculation. Now, exactly like George Zimmerman, CHOP "security" created the scenario in which deadly force ended up being used. So, regardless of whether you think the shooting itself was self defense or murder you cannot excuse, unless you wholeheartedly approve of vigilantism, the sequence of events that led up to the shooting. I am fascinated by some of our far left members almost literally tripping over themselves to defend this blatant act of vigilantism while simultaneously raking law enforcement over the coals. Peak clown world. (07-21-2020, 10:12 AM)GMDino Wrote: Just like the police in the Wendy's parking lot were trained... Please tell us again how you don't hate law enforcement, it rings hollower with every post you make. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - GMDino - 07-21-2020 https://www.oregonlive.com/portland/2020/07/feds-right-wing-media-paint-portland-as-city-under-siege-a-tour-of-town-shows-otherwise.html?utm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=oregonian_sf&utm_medium=social Quote:Feds, right-wing media paint Portland as ‘city under siege.’ A tour of town shows otherwise RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - bfine32 - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 10:34 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Here's what happened based on available facts.When you actually see it written out like that; I find it hard to defend the CHOP "security". Hell, the Left was outraged because a crowd trespassed on a couple's property and all that couple did was threaten violence. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Sociopathicsteelerfan - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 10:29 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Yes, law enforcement officers are training in escalation of force. Self-appointed cops are not. We'll just let those who read determine which cases are more corollary. I'm gonna go with yours and Fred's heroes of George Zimmerman and those Houston guys. Hell they felt threatened and shot. They're not like that wimpy ST. Louis couple that only threatened to shoot when they felt they were threatened. The killing you're referencing took place in Georgia, not Texas. Otherwise, spot on. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Sociopathicsteelerfan - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 10:43 AM)bfine32 Wrote: When you actually see it written out like that; I find it hard to defend the CHOP "security". Hell, the Left was outraged because a crowd trespassed on a couple's property and all that couple did was threaten violence. Indeed. The response by some on this board is even more amusing when you consider that some of the same people openly derided the protesters in Michigan who peacefully and lawfully open carried at the state capital. Not a single law was broken or arrest was made but the same people who are now defending vigilante murder couldn't stop screaming about these protesters "actively intimidating" state law makers. Maybe if the Michigan protesters had shot up the place they'd have issues their stamp of approval? Or maybe they don't disapprove of violence and intimidation as long as the perpetrators of said violence and intimidation have the correct, i.e. far left, politics? Like I said, peak clown world. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Belsnickel - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 10:43 AM)bfine32 Wrote: When you actually see it written out like that; I find it hard to defend the CHOP "security". Hell, the Left was outraged because a crowd trespassed on a couple's property and all that couple did was threaten violence. In all seriousness, the people in CHOP almost immediately showed how stupid they were with all of this. They almost immediately created a system for law enforcement that was far more aggressive and egregious in their use of force than the law enforcement agencies they have problems with. There was harassment of people for exercising their freedom of speech. Then, when they want to claim autonomy they demand the city and state help them out with things. It was the most asinine thing I've ever seen. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - GMDino - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 11:01 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: In all seriousness, the people in CHOP almost immediately showed how stupid they were with all of this. They almost immediately created a system for law enforcement that was far more aggressive and egregious in their use of force than the law enforcement agencies they have problems with. There was harassment of people for exercising their freedom of speech. Then, when they want to claim autonomy they demand the city and state help them out with things. An ill thought out plan poorly executed, no doubt. People caught up in the moment chose very poorly and hopefully that will awaken some people before they try such a thing again. But I doubt it. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Sociopathicsteelerfan - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 11:01 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: In all seriousness, the people in CHOP almost immediately showed how stupid they were with all of this. They almost immediately created a system for law enforcement that was far more aggressive and egregious in their use of force than the law enforcement agencies they have problems with. There was harassment of people for exercising their freedom of speech. Then, when they want to claim autonomy they demand the city and state help them out with things. Outstanding post and 100% true. Their version of law enforcement racked up a list of brutality and shootings that would create a firestorm in the media if it was committed by actually sworn law enforcement. Which makes the lack of extreme condemnation from the media all the more strange. (07-21-2020, 11:03 AM)GMDino Wrote: An ill thought out plan poorly executed, no doubt. I'm sure the parents of the murdered teenager would use different words to describe it. Quote:People caught up in the moment chose very poorly and hopefully that will awaken some people before they try such a thing again. But I doubt it. If only you extended the same consideration to law enforcement officers that you extend to far left vigilantes. Quite sad really. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Dill - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 10:21 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I believe you started using this phrase in this thread. I've never used this term in my life because it's inaccurate. It's properly spelled far left extremist vigilante thugs. When you can get basic facts right again let me know and we can resume our discussion. LOL "basic facts." You can't appeal to a standard you yourself constantly flout. I'll walk you through it. Your post # 65 led me to "Far Left Security Force." (07-17-2020, 08:08 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Also especially tough when you live in a city in which the far left feels entitled to set up "autonomous zones" and murder people with their own security force. A "Far Left Security Force" would be a "security force" set up by some entity called "the far left." You were my source here. You weren't calling your "far left security force" a "criminal vigilante mob" until your post #87. (07-19-2020, 03:14 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Quote:*Far Left Security Forces. Speaking as a "professional LEO" on a thread about bias in Police/DOJ threat assessment, you decided your original term--"security force"-- did not express your pre-judgment accurately enough. Now your term of preference is "left extremist vigilante thugs." "Basic facts" constituted by adjectives. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Dill - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 10:34 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Here's what happened based on available facts. When I actually see it written out like that, I wonder where the info about a "self described warlord" issuing firearms to a "security force" comes from. Who reported "shots fired" and to whom? Why such aversion to sourcing such material facts, or acknowledging gaps in the record? "Shots fired" is still rather vague. Was someone shooting at the security force? Innocent passersby? I am still asking where these facts are available. Fred, Dino can you help? (07-21-2020, 10:34 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Everything else is speculation. Now, exactly like George Zimmerman, CHOP "security" created the scenario in which deadly force ended up being used. So, regardless of whether you think the shooting itself was self defense or murder you cannot excuse, unless you wholeheartedly approve of vigilantism, the sequence of events that led up to the shooting. Is the bolded then "speculation"? I don't approve of vigilantism wholeheartedly or even half-heartedly, by "security forces" or police. Even so, I think I can "excuse" a shooting, even a police shooting, if it was in self defense. Why should the effort to collect and establish a factual record before rendering judgment be cast as "far left members . . . tripping over themselves to defend this blatant act of vigilantism"? Why isn't the "professional LEO with investigative experience" helping to provide a sourced factual record rather than rushing to play judge and jury? RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Sociopathicsteelerfan - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 11:32 AM)Dill Wrote: LOL "basic facts." You can't appeal to a standard you yourself constantly flout. This entire post is unnecessary. I could explain that using the words in direct conjunction as a term is not the same as referring to the "security" forces of the CHOP as "far left". But you already knew that and made this post anyways. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Sociopathicsteelerfan - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 12:15 PM)Dill Wrote: When I actually see it written out like that, I wonder where the info about a "self described warlord" issuing firearms to a "security force" comes from. Google is a thing, try using it. I'm not here to educate you on the basic facts of what happened at CHAZ/CHOP. If you want to engage on the subject educate yourself on the basic facts before attempting to do so. At the very least don't expect me to hold your hand through the process. Quote:Who reported "shots fired" and to whom? Why such aversion to sourcing such material facts, or acknowledging gaps in the record? Please refer to a post I made above, it should clear all of this up. Quote:I am still asking where these facts are available. Fred, Dino can you help? I can't tell you how amusing this sentence is. Quote:Is the bolded then "speculation"? No, it's a fact. Quote:I don't approve of vigilantism wholeheartedly or even half-heartedly, by "security forces" or police. Even a police shooting? Very generous of you. I didn't know you were a George Zimmerman defender, this topic has revealed some very interesting things about our fellow posters. Quote:Why should the effort to collect and establish a factual record before rendering judgment be cast as "far left members . . . tripping over themselves to defend this blatant act of vigilantism"? Why isn't the "professional LEO with investigative experience" helping to provide a sourced factual record rather than rushing to play judge and jury? Again, please see above, all of this is answered. Also again, please educate yourself about basic facts before attempting to pursue this topic further. I know I would appreciate it and I'm sure others reading the thread would as well. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Belsnickel - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 02:23 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Google is a thing, try using it. I'm not here to educate you on the basic facts of what happened at CHAZ/CHOP. If you want to engage on the subject educate yourself on the basic facts before attempting to do so. At the very least don't expect me to hold your hand through the process. While the rapper handed out firearms from the back of his Tesla and proclaimed himself the leader in the area, I don't know if he ever referred to himself as a "warlord." I know that right-wing media labeled him as such, but I don't recall ever seeing him claim the title himself. Edit: according to this, Raz "disputed the title." https://wjla.com/news/nation-world/chops-violent-end-in-seattle-casts-doubt-on-autonomous-zones-occupy-protests RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Sociopathicsteelerfan - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 02:28 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: While the rapper handed out firearms from the back of his Tesla and proclaimed himself the leader in the area, I don't know if he ever referred to himself as a "warlord." I know that right-wing media labeled him as such, but I don't recall ever seeing him claim the title himself. Appreciate the correction, Bel. The handing out rifles from the back of his car isn't in dispute, as you say, as there is video evidence of it. RE: LE Leaks show treatment of pro BLM protestors vs conservative militias - Belsnickel - 07-21-2020 (07-21-2020, 03:14 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Appreciate the correction, Bel. The handing out rifles from the back of his car isn't in dispute, as you say, as there is video evidence of it. Oh yeah. He handed our ARs and was like "you know how to use that, right?" and then they showed footage of the person definitely not knowing how to use it. |