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+--- Thread: Are there any optimists left? (/Thread-Are-there-any-optimists-left)
RE: Are there any optimists left? - Nately120 - 11-01-2019
The main thing to me is admitting that we are losing left and right, have a HC who looks to be in way over his head, and now we are tossing a late round pick rookie QB into a hopeless situation which makes us the Cleveland Browns, really.
I feel like I have to admit it because we've yucked it up every time they do this very thing. Fair is fair. Now, let's hope for the best?
RE: Are there any optimists left? - Catmandude123 - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 11:46 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I would bring this point up when the argument of "We need to fix the o line before we move on from Dalton" was a big talking point up until Dalton went 0-8.
Fans will give Dalton and Mixon a pass because of the line but want to tar and feather ZT for the offense not exceling.
RE: Are there any optimists left? - Nately120 - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 11:53 AM)Catmandude123 Wrote: Fans will give Dalton and Mixon a pass because of the line but want to tar and feather ZT for the offense not exceling.
ZT is the one who hired his schlub buddy to coach the o-line (he probably had no real alternatives, though) and he made sure he doubled-down on how great Hart was. I realize ZT is a QB coach who took a huge promotion with a crap organization, but he's more complicit in the failure of the line than Dalton or Mixon. Dalton didn't even take a cap-eating deal like Palmer did and this is the thanks he gets.
Meh, just my take. ZT will be here as long as he can toe the company line, though.
RE: Are there any optimists left? - Catmandude123 - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 11:52 AM)Nately120 Wrote: The main thing to me is admitting that we are losing left and right, have a HC who looks to be in way over his head, and now we are tossing a late round pick rookie QB into a hopeless situation which makes us the Cleveland Browns, really.
I feel like I have to admit it because we've yucked it up every time they do this very thing. Fair is fair. Now, let's hope for the best?
Why don't you want to admit ZT inherited a shit show? It couldn't be turned around in a half a season. Like your buddy Fred always says"quit being a whinner".
RE: Are there any optimists left? - Catmandude123 - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 11:56 AM)Nately120 Wrote: ZT is the one who hired his sclub buddy to coach the o-line (he probably had no real alternatives, though) and he made sure he doubled-down on how great Hart was. I realize ZT is a QB coach who took a huge promotion with a crap organization, but he's more complicit in the failure of the line than Dalton or Mixon. Dalton didn't even take a cap-eating deal like Palmer did and this is the thanks he gets.
Meh, just my take. ZT will be here as long as he can toe the company line, though.
WE had arguably the best O=line coach in the league last year and we won six games He had Glenn , Boling, and a first round draft pick.
RE: Are there any optimists left? - Nately120 - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 11:57 AM)Catmandude123 Wrote: Why don't you want to admit ZT inherited a shit show? It couldn't be turned around in a half a season. Like your buddy Fred always says"quit being a whinner".
Um, I'm pretty sure I openly state that being the HC of the Bengals is a herculean task due to Mike Brown being amazingly apathetic and lazy. I feel as though you aren't familiar enough with my body of work if you are drawing these conclusions.
RE: Are there any optimists left? - fredtoast - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 11:32 AM)grampahol Wrote: We really need a new definition for the word 'trying'.. They're definitely trying, but not in a good way.
So your saying that they shouldn't wait until the first round to draft O-linemen?
RE: Are there any optimists left? - rfaulk34 - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 08:54 AM)jason Wrote: Everything gets stale after 16 years... I think the roster needed a complete overhaul either way. I wanted him gone by then too, but it's plain to see that he's the only guy who's had any success under Mike Brown.
Wyche started off 0-5 and 2-6. Judging on 8 games is like firing Tony Perez after 44 games in his first year.
RE: Are there any optimists left? - fredtoast - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 11:48 AM)Catmandude123 Wrote: Railing about a coach because he benched your chosen pick to be QB is nothing short of idiotic.
The only thing idiotic is the fact that I keep posting this and you keep acting like it does not exist.
This is from over a month ago (9-23)
http://thebengalsboard.com/newreply.php?tid=21305&replyto=764837
(09-23-2019, 12:39 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You guys know how I defend Dalton, but if we are eliminated we should see what we have in Finley.
Unless this defense and O-line makes huge improvements Dalton will have to play like a Pro Bowler to get another contract from the Bengals. Even if he is playing well enough to start for another team that is just a QB away, we won't begin a complete re-build around a 34-year-old QB. Plus paying a QB 20+ million makes it harder to fill other holes on the roster. So we will be going with a Finley or a 2019 draft pick.
It would be amazing for us if we were to have found a starter with a fourth round pick. Again that allows us to use a high first round pick on another hole in the roster.
You are either blatantly trolling or you can't read.
RE: Are there any optimists left? - rfaulk34 - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 11:05 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Yeah...so we pin our hopes and dreams of success on a guy that's healthy maybe half the time. And is going to be 32.
Doesn't seem too sound does it?
You don't put all your eggs in one basket. See what another QB can do this year. Work on the line and LBs next year and get a new, young QB in the draft if necessary.
I hate the injury excuse but when 60% of your expected line (and one guy shouldn't be a starter) and your best (top 5-10 in the NFL) WR hasn't played yet...you've seen how bad the backups are on the line this year. They're backups for just that reason.
If their projected starters are out there and they crap it up, then fine, blast away--whether it be the choice of starters or the play calling/coaching. But it's reckless to pull the plug after 8 games when so many guys are out there that shouldn't be and the ones that should are injured or retired. if he gets a couple years to get "his guys" out there, and they're crap..."swing away Merrill".
RE: Are there any optimists left? - fredtoast - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 11:48 AM)Catmandude123 Wrote: Did you realistically think we were going to be a winning team with the roster we had? Did the loss of Boling ,Williams, Glenn. and Green impact the ability of the team to succeed?
Gee I don't know. Why don't you try reading what I wrote in the post that YOU QUOTED.
redtoast Wrote: [url=http://thebengalsboard.com/Thread-Are-there-any-optimists-left?pid=790354#pid790354][/url]
I don't want to come off like I am hating too hard on Taylor. He is handicapped by a horrid O-line and a "10th choice" Defensive Coordinator. He might actually be a decent head coach with a better team,
![[Image: 1303a1.jpg]](https://i.imgflip.com/1303a1.jpg)
RE: Are there any optimists left? - jason - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 12:15 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Wyche started off 0-5 and 2-6. Judging on 8 games is like firing Tony Perez after 44 games in his first year.
What in particular do you like that you've seen from Taylor?
RE: Are there any optimists left? - rfaulk34 - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 02:19 PM)jason Wrote: What in particular do you like that you've seen from Taylor?
lol. Not a whole lot.
Point is, he's brand new to this level of responsibility and he has a lot of "learning on the go". He needs to get away from the "buddy system" of coach hiring and if we're talking about fair, how about a full offseason to work with?
RE: Are there any optimists left? - jason - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 02:26 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: lol. Not a whole lot.
Point is, he's brand new to this level of responsibility and he has a lot of "learning on the go". He needs to get away from the "buddy system" of coach hiring and if we're talking about fair, how about a full offseason to work with?
I agree with you on the hirings. I didn't like that it was being posted over and over that he'd been a failure at every stop. Failure is a great teacher. But he hasn't proven anybody wrong. Then you factor in the nepotistic hires (like there wasn't enough of those at the top)... It's just a train wreck. I get that they aren't very good, but I'd be a lil more ok with 0-8 if I saw some sort of identity. They don't seem to be good at anything.
RE: Are there any optimists left? - Hammerstripes - 11-01-2019
Not an optimist here, but a realist.
There's nothing you can really take from this season. The line is so bad due to 3 missing starters. That cripples the offense.
I'll make all of my judgements next year when we have a decent line and a new QB. I'll judge this regime on how much progress is made between week 1 and week 17 of next year.
RE: Are there any optimists left? - fredtoast - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 02:19 PM)jason Wrote: What in particular do you like that you've seen from Taylor?
He is not Marvin Lewis.
The "anyone but Marvin" crowd is kind of forced to support Taylor.
That being said I am also a little hesitant to judge Taylor after the trainwreck he was handed. I think the offense gets a pass because of the scrub O-line, but the defense has no real excuse. We had good DBs like Jackson, Kirkpatrick, and Bates getting toasted because they look lost. I blame that on coaching. If we don't see some changes to the defensive coaching staff this offseason I am going to be really disappointed.
RE: Are there any optimists left? - rfaulk34 - 11-01-2019
(11-01-2019, 03:15 PM)jason Wrote: I agree with you on the hirings. I didn't like that it was being posted over and over that he'd been a failure at every stop. Failure is a great teacher. But he hasn't proven anybody wrong. Then you factor in the nepotistic hires (like there wasn't enough of those at the top)... It's just a train wreck. I get that they aren't very good, but I'd be a lil more ok with 0-8 if I saw some sort of identity. They don't seem to be good at anything.
I'm with you. If next year starts and we're "in the same boat" in regards to who is on the staff and who they do or don't pick up in FA and who they draft...it should be easy to see if this year is SOP or if things look different next year. If it's the former, then fans are in for a nice long (as if it hasn't been long enough to now) continuous shit show.
RE: Are there any optimists left? - Fan_in_Kettering - 11-02-2019
After last season everybody was happy to see Marvin Lewis finally go. I was one of those people. Marvin had a good run but it was his time. The trouble is we all thought anybody has to be better than Marvin — and the Bengals hired someone who isn’t even worthy to tie Marvin’s shoelaces. Marvin might have grown stale but Zac Taylor isn’t even thawed out.
Let’s end this tragedy and try again.
RE: Are there any optimists left? - SladeX - 11-02-2019
Given the way the trade deadline was handled, no.
The only hope is for Mike to retire, and for Katie to hire a GM. Until that happens, this team is going nowhere.
Even then Katie might just be a chip off the old block...
RE: Are there any optimists left? - rfaulk34 - 11-02-2019
(11-02-2019, 10:56 AM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: After last season everybody was happy to see Marvin Lewis finally go. I was one of those people. Marvin had a good run but it was his time. The trouble is we all thought anybody has to be better than Marvin — and the Bengals hired someone who isn’t even worthy to tie Marvin’s shoelaces. Marvin might have grown stale but Zac Taylor isn’t even thawed out.
Let’s end this tragedy and try again.
Marvin was 1-7 in his last 8 games, at the end of a 3 year losing season run. Taylor has started off 0-8 with a team he got to late and has too many starters that shouldn't be starters.
Where is the logic in replacing a guy 8 games into his career, under these circumstances?