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+---- Thread: Make Russia Great Again (/Thread-Make-Russia-Great-Again)
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Make Russia Great Again - NATI BENGALS - 02-21-2020
Wait wait wait. I meant America.
Where are my trumpets at? Another proud day in a maggot hat.
Hooting and hollering to support the conman who once again is getting help from the commies to rig your election.
More true patriot career civil servants get shit canned by the reality tv show host bimbo because they spoke the truth. Only in brain dead trumpland do we want intelligence officials to not share national security threats. We want loyalist ass kissers. Amiright trumpets?
Moscow Mitch and friends love it.
Is this even America anymore?
RE: Make Russia Great Again - Vas Deferens - 02-21-2020
at Least Putin wasn’t born in Kenya!
RE: Make Russia Great Again - GMDino - 02-21-2020
And this isn't "both sides" and "we become what we hate" this is the Republican leadership and elected officials openly defending a "man" who not only breaks norms but the law and the procedures to stop him.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - jj22 - 02-21-2020
Shrugs. Republican's have opened the door for an attack on America this Summer and Fall, and it's surely coming. They've adopted Russian talking points, and tore up the constitution. They welcome it as it's their only hope of keeping the presidency in 2020.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - Dill - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 11:17 AM)jj22 Wrote: Shrugs. Republican's have opened the door for an attack on America this Summer and Fall, and it's surely coming. They've adopted Russian talking points, and tore up the constitution. They welcome it as it's their only hope of keeping the presidency in 2020.
Well according to Laura Ingraham Trump has been harder than any president on Russia. She ran a list of all the sanctions
Because they are afraid of losing the election, Dems are twisting a perfectly normal, routine process whereby a politically neutral head of national intelligence is replaced by a Trump Yes Man after the former has, following his duty, informed Congress of coming Russian interference in the election. Dems would have you believe that he was weaponizing the intel community to favor his reelection bid, as he already has the Justice Dept.
If Trump controls the Executive branch and the intel services are part of that branch, then it is within his power to withhold intel findings from Congress if they hurt his re-election chances. LOL you going to try and IMPEACH him over that?
RE: Make Russia Great Again - Mike M (the other one) - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 11:17 AM)jj22 Wrote: Shrugs. Republican's have opened the door for an attack on America this Summer and Fall, and it's surely coming. They've adopted Russian talking points, and tore up the constitution. They welcome it as it's their only hope of keeping the presidency in 2020.
Republicans?
Aren't you a bit hypocritical? We dabble in other countries elections all the time trying to change the outcome to one that's favorable for us, so why should we expect anything less from other countries during ours?
RE: Make Russia Great Again - GMDino - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 02:36 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Republicans?
Aren't you a bit hypocritical? We dabble in other countries elections all the time trying to change the outcome to one that's favorable for us, so why should we expect anything less from other countries during ours?
Expect? No.
Do something about it? Yes.
Not fire the people who say it is happening and then deny it is happening.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - Belsnickel - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 02:36 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Republicans?
Aren't you a bit hypocritical? We dabble in other countries elections all the time trying to change the outcome to one that's favorable for us, so why should we expect anything less from other countries during ours?
Do you think that these other countries just roll over and let us interfere in their democratic processes? Do you think those countries just go "oh well, that's the way the world works"? I mean, that's what is happening right now and you're attitude seems to be agreeing with that position.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - jmccracky - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 02:49 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Do you think that these other countries just roll over and let us interfere in their democratic processes? Do you think those countries just go "oh well, that's the way the world works"? I mean, that's what is happening right now and you're attitude seems to be agreeing with that position.
I cant wait for Iran to put military bases in my backyard. I mean, we do it, so it's ok for them too.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - Mike M (the other one) - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 02:49 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Do you think that these other countries just roll over and let us interfere in their democratic processes? Do you think those countries just go "oh well, that's the way the world works"? I mean, that's what is happening right now and you're attitude seems to be agreeing with that position.
No, they do not, but we are not them, so we can't combat it the same way, you know, run around and kill the other group(s) or shut off their voices because we have the 1st amendment protecting these fools and it allows them to say it and get away with it.
I don't want them interfering in ours, but we have no right to whine and moan when we interfere in others and doesn't matter if we get caught or not. The idea is that we ARE trying to control the outcome. We are stuck in a "what comes around goes around" machine that we made.
As far as I know, they haven't been able to change the votes at the booth level. Now mis-information is the way they can influence votes, but that's always been happening between the 2 parties already, now we are just adding more parties to the mix. It's part of our social media revolution that I don't think we fully expected to happen, and clearly we don't know how to combat it yet.
It's also easy for Trump et al to say, "fake news" when an organization gets caught peddling misleading information, headlines etc. All of this just feeds itself and keeps it going. I have no idea how to stop it, as long as someone is willing to "click it" there will always be misleading/propaganda wars on social media.
These are pretty much the facts of where we are as a nation for now.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - Mike M (the other one) - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 03:11 PM)jmccracky Wrote: I cant wait for Iran to put military bases in my backyard. I mean, we do it, so it's ok for them too.
Do you think they would, if they could?
I certainly think they would.
This is not a good comparison to Social Media presence. This is a physical one, and we do have control over that.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - Belsnickel - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 03:23 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: No, they do not, but we are not them, so we can't combat it the same way, you know, run around and kill the other group(s) or shut off their voices because we have the 1st amendment protecting these fools and it allows them to say it and get away with it.
I don't want them interfering in ours, but we have no right to whine and moan when we interfere in others and doesn't matter if we get caught or not. The idea is that we ARE trying to control the outcome. We are stuck in a "what comes around goes around" machine that we made.
As far as I know, they haven't been able to change the votes at the booth level. Now mis-information is the way they can influence votes, but that's always been happening between the 2 parties already, now we are just adding more parties to the mix. It's part of our social media revolution that I don't think we fully expected to happen, and clearly we don't know how to combat it yet.
It's also easy for Trump et al to say, "fake news" when an organization gets caught peddling misleading information, headlines etc. All of this just feeds itself and keeps it going. I have no idea how to stop it, as long as someone is willing to "click it" there will always be misleading/propaganda wars on social media.
These are pretty much the facts of where we are as a nation for now.
So yes or no, do you think our intelligence community should look for ways to combat the interference in our elections by foreign nations?
Second question, also yes or no, do you think that Trump seeking to downplay this foreign influence that is working to help his re-election is a concerning situation for our democracy?
RE: Make Russia Great Again - jmccracky - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 03:28 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Do you think they would, if they could?
I certainly think they would.
This is not a good comparison to Social Media presence. This is a physical one, and we do have control over that.
For sure they would. Maybe it's a bad comparison, but so is "but others do it" excuse. I'll try better next time lol.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - jj22 - 02-21-2020
Republicans have refused to vote and support election security and integrity. There is a reason for this. They need the help. Nothing in politics is a coincidence. If Russia was helping a Dem you bet they'd vote and support securing the integrity of our Democracy.
Republicans, while they will surely turn on Trump when he is out of office, become proAmerica, proConstitution etc, can't erase their role in this dismantling of the constitution and it's important for Americans to remember.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - jj22 - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 02:36 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Republicans?
Aren't you a bit hypocritical? We dabble in other countries elections all the time trying to change the outcome to one that's favorable for us, so why should we expect anything less from other countries during ours?
Ok. So let me ask. Would you be okay if this was a Dem needing the help from our enemy's?
RE: Make Russia Great Again - Benton - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 02:36 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Republicans?
Aren't you a bit hypocritical? We dabble in other countries elections all the time trying to change the outcome to one that's favorable for us, so why should we expect anything less from other countries during ours?
1- we do. That doesn't mean I want, or accept, another country doing it to us.
2- it's a little different in that one party and the POTUS has openly embraced receiving help from not just a foreign power, but one we've worked hard to keep in check.
And just so there's no confusion, that party is republican leadership. Agencies inside the government, private sector and just common sense has shown a connection with Russian interference, but Republicans have shot down every bill to stop that saying it's unnecessary. They've been trying to make it even easier. Which is understandable since several have been connected to Russian government agencies and businesses.
The sad part is, Russia and it's party of preference is doing a great job of crippling our economy, way more than if we had adopted their brand of communism way back when. Not that I'm advocating that, I just think it's sad it took such a little nudge to do this to ourselves.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - Benton - 02-21-2020
(02-21-2020, 06:33 PM)jj22 Wrote: Republicans have refused to vote and support election security and integrity. There is a reason for this. They need the help. Nothing in politics is a coincidence. If Russia was helping a Dem you bet they'd vote and support securing the integrity of our Democracy.
Republicans, while they will surely turn on Trump when he is out of office, become proAmerica, proConstitution etc, can't erase their role in this dismantling of the constitution and it's important for Americans to remember.
In fairness, there's evidence the Russians have helped Dem candidates, too. They don't really care who wins, only that the government is too divided to do anything. It's working, too. Instead of people talking about ways to fix things, we talk about which side is worse. We being politicians and voters alike.
The difference is, as a party, the Dems are the only ones suggesting to limit that influence. Republicans are hoping we go the way of rome.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - Mike M (the other one) - 02-24-2020
(02-21-2020, 03:42 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: So yes or no, do you think our intelligence community should look for ways to combat the interference in our elections by foreign nations?
Second question, also yes or no, do you think that Trump seeking to downplay this foreign influence that is working to help his re-election is a concerning situation for our democracy?
Shouldn't they have already been working on that or have figured it out by now? Trump's election was not the first time with outsiders (or specifically Russians) trying to influence the voters.
Why wouldn't he downplay it? I believe the impact was fairly minimal. Most voters already had decided. Also I think the Media did more to try to influence voters than Russia did. Even Comey hurt Hills campaign more than Russia did. But I said it back then, and will say it again, Hills pandered to the wrong crowd. Agree or dis-agree?
(02-21-2020, 05:14 PM)jmccracky Wrote: For sure they would. Maybe it's a bad comparison, but so is "but others do it" excuse. I'll try better next time lol.
"but others do it" excuse? I specifically said WE do it to others, so turn about is fair play. Do you agree or not with that? I didn't say we have to accept it. Just expect it and be ready for it and obviously we were not ready for it. Did they influence some votes? Probably, but with the way this country is, I'd say the impact wasn't that big, people already knew which way they were voting. And if anything, Comey did more damage to Hillary and the Media did it's damage to Trump more so than what the Russians did.
(02-21-2020, 06:33 PM)jj22 Wrote: Republicans have refused to vote and support election security and integrity. There is a reason for this. They need the help. Nothing in politics is a coincidence. If Russia was helping a Dem you bet they'd vote and support securing the integrity of our Democracy.
Republicans, while they will surely turn on Trump when he is out of office, become proAmerica, proConstitution etc, can't erase their role in this dismantling of the constitution and it's important for Americans to remember.
That's just BS, Republicans have been trying to get voter integrity for years, but the Dem's won't allow it. You know Photo ID, I doubt they would even if it was favorable to the Dems, you can't control outside influence with out trying to control the Media as well, but you can point it out.
(02-21-2020, 07:01 PM)jj22 Wrote: Ok. So let me ask. Would you be okay if this was a Dem needing the help from our enemy's?
Haven't the Russian come out and said they plan to help Bernie next? As someone has already stated, their goal is not to "Unite" us, but keep us "Divided".
RE: Make Russia Great Again - jj22 - 02-24-2020
(02-24-2020, 05:29 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Haven't the Russian come out and said they plan to help Bernie next? As someone has already stated, their goal is not to "Unite" us, but keep us "Divided".
Link?
The question was to you tho since you seem so fine with it when it benefits Trump.
Are you fine with it in general or just when it benefits Trump?
And let's talk photo ID? When have you ever voted and not had to show your photo ID? The argument is for those who don't have or can't afford photo id's to be allowed to vote. So you may want to rethink your Dems won't allow something that is already law and happening.
RE: Make Russia Great Again - Dill - 02-24-2020
(02-24-2020, 05:29 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Belsnickel Wrote: So yes or no, do you think our intelligence community should look for ways to combat the interference in our elections by foreign nations?
Second question, also yes or no, do you think that Trump seeking to downplay this foreign influence that is working to help his re-election is a concerning situation for our democracy?
Shouldn't they have already been working on that or have figured it out by now? Trump's election was not the first time with outsiders (or specifically Russians) trying to influence the voters.
Why wouldn't he downplay it? I believe the impact was fairly minimal. Most voters already had decided. Also I think the Media did more to try to influence voters than Russia did. Even Comey hurt Hills campaign more than Russia did. But I said it back then, and will say it again, Hills pandered to the wrong crowd. Agree or dis-agree?
I believe that Bels, like many of the rest of us, thinks that the intel community HAS figured it out. The Russians interfered in the 2016 election to help Donald Trump. They are preparing to do the same in the 2020 election. The problem is, Trump does not agree. He is doing the opposite of leading on the issue of national security by punishing people who sound the alarm. Mitch McConnell, with the President's blessing, is currently blocking legislation which would protect elections from foreign meddling. https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/14/politics/mcconnell-election-security/index.html
You say "Most voters already had decided"--the question is whether Russian trolls helped them to their decision. And also whether the release of DNC emails influenced people's decisions, and whether we can expect similar tactics again. Less than 80,000 votes in 4 states decided the election. The timely release of fake news can certainly determine an election, especially when so many are so bad at telling real from fake.
Further, it looks like Russians were able to hack into voting machines in most every state. How do we know they can't do that again and with greater effect?
When you say we have no right to "whine" about Russian interference, people are justified in wondering if you think we should just let it happen, not try to protect ourselves, for that would be "whining."
The question, again, is whether you think we should defend ourselves or not? You have not answered it.