(09-07-2021, 11:45 AM)bengaloo Wrote: I'm not anti vaccine, especially for the vulnerable or people who dont have natural immunity, but to think we cannot treat covid cases is ludicrous with the knowledge we have at this point. We are just not doing it. Maybe its time to start demanding it? I care about people. I'm not political about saving lives. We all deserve to live, including the people on the far right and far left. 

(09-07-2021, 11:54 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Well the vaccine doesn't even enter into it if you're saying that our county is withholding other life-saving treatments.  It makes you wonder why there is a bi-partisan effort to let people die, but who knows.  I know Trump got the insta-cure and lots of regular people didn't, so meh.

You may be right, but if you are then America is just a total shithole.  As in like everyone should be booing the national anthem of this corrupt country that is willingly allowing people to die for no reason.

(09-07-2021, 12:14 PM)bengaloo Wrote: Trump, Rudi and all the elite got the antibody treatment. I dont know what or why or how, but I think the citizens of this country at this point should put our partisan differences aside, unite, and start asking these questions together and demanding treatment and total transparency. 

(09-07-2021, 12:16 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Yeah, I'm sure equal and free medical treatment for all will be real popular in this country. 


But to bring this back to the main point, why is DeSantis ok with his voter-base dying off?  It just doesn't make sense. 

(09-07-2021, 12:22 PM)bengaloo Wrote: It should be very popular. 


DeSantis so far is the first governor to actively and publically push for the monoclonal antibody treatments and now Florida is opening clinics across the state offering them. This is all new developments. I'm not for or against DeSantis, but my hats off to him on this single topic. Glad he did it and more should follow. Monoclonal antibody treatments will save lives. 

(09-07-2021, 12:34 PM)Nately120 Wrote: So governors are the ones impeding the use of this life-saving treatment?  Is this a state by state thing?

(09-07-2021, 12:40 PM)bengaloo Wrote: I have no idea. I think governors can influence and bring things to light. Honestly, I have no idea if its a state to state thing. If it is it shouldnt be. We should ALL be pushing our leaders to allow early treatment and unlock the monoclonal antibodies for all who need it. 

(09-07-2021, 12:44 PM)Nately120 Wrote: But there isn't any evidence our leaders are preventing early treatment via vaccines OR the antibodies, is there?  It just seems like a stretch to say there is this treatment that we have 500 million doses of and for some reason we're just watching people drain medical resources and/or die because "someone" won't let us use it.

(09-07-2021, 12:52 PM)bengaloo Wrote: We have a treatment and have 500 million doses of it, but I cant say why we are not using it. It's not a stretch to say it exists. It literally exists, and even has full FDA approval and has since May. Why its not the first line of treatment is beyond my noggin brother! I doesnt make sense to me at all. 

BUT, we can learn from this and move forward in a good way using these and other treatments. Lets finish this strong. That is all we can ask and hope for now. Lets finish this pandemic strong, and save some lives.

(09-07-2021, 10:49 AM)bengaloo Wrote: 40% is too many for something pushed as a vaccine that would stop the pandemic. Natural immunity is far superior, as we all know now. However, early treatment for covid is what could really actually save lives and end the pandemic. 500 million doses of monoclonal antibody treatments were shipped all over the US a long time ago. These treatments can save lives, yet most of them are collecting dust on the shelves while people keep pushing the vaccines. Its time to use some common sense. If you want the vaccine, get it, but whether your vaccinated or not, early treatment should be on the table and its insane that most clinics dont treat active covid cases with the plethora of treatments that can treat it. They are sending people home until they get sick enough to be hospitalized. Enough is enough. All options should be on the table. We either take saving lives seriously, or keep pushing vaccines that are showing to be less effective than we were told. 

(09-07-2021, 01:00 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I gotta say, your ability to meld the nihilistic notion that our government is just letting people die with the optimism that we're going to turn the corner any day now is quite interesting.  

(09-07-2021, 01:02 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: That 40% is against a variant, and the vaccine was always just one strong tool to help end the pandemic. But early treatment for covid alone Can't end the pandemic either. Vaccinations, masks, and social distancing will.Treatments can save lives and prevent more deaths, but they won't stop the spread.

Natural immunity is a critical part of the puzzle too (though whether it is superior on its own compared to vaccines is up for debate in various studies), and researchers are finding most effective immunity is a "hybrid immunity" of people who got sick and then later got the vaccine. The problem is trying to infect everyone first will lead to mass deaths, both from the sheer number of people infected and the degree to which it would overwhelm our health infrastructure.  

No one is going to argue against a safe, proven treatment, but they will push back against pushing the idea that treating covid alone is all that needs to be done. 

(09-07-2021, 01:02 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: That 40% is against a variant, and the vaccine was always just one strong tool to help end the pandemic. But early treatment for covid alone Can't end the pandemic either. Vaccinations, masks, and social distancing will.Treatments can save lives and prevent more deaths, but they won't stop the spread.

Natural immunity is a critical part of the puzzle too (though whether it is superior on its own compared to vaccines is up for debate in various studies), and researchers are finding most effective immunity is a "hybrid immunity" of people who got sick and then later got the vaccine. The problem is trying to infect everyone first will lead to mass deaths, both from the sheer number of people infected and the degree to which it would overwhelm our health infrastructure.  

No one is going to argue against a safe, proven treatment, but they will push back against pushing the idea that treating covid alone is all that needs to be done. 

(09-07-2021, 01:20 PM)bengaloo Wrote: I dont care who pushes back against what, as long as viable treatments are available to all. None of us know how to end the pandemic. Masking, vaccines, treatments, etc. Whatever. I'm just saying we should be saving lives by using all treatments available. 

(09-07-2021, 01:31 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: You literally just said that this treatment is what "can actually save lives and end the pandemic" in response to someone discussing vaccines. Your original post on the topic said that we need more of this treatment because vaccines are failing. I asked how and you never elaborated. 

The vaccines do what monoclonal antibody treatment does but better and can prevent the infection from even happening, which would actually stop the spread. 

(09-07-2021, 01:38 PM)bengaloo Wrote: I dont know if it can "end it" or not, but it can definitely end the really scary part of it, if we can save the lives of the most vulnerable. If we can do that, is there really a pandemic left, even if corona is here for many years? My point is if we can take the 99.3 or so survival rate for elderly/vulnerable and make it 99.9%, as a society, do we still need to lockdown, mask, or even more importantly, be scared for our loved ones? 

(09-07-2021, 02:19 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: Again, vaccines do the same thing but better when it comes to making cases less severe and they stop the spread from occurring. So if you want to make cases less severe, you promote vaccines because you get the added bonus of stopping the spread. Stopping the spread ends the pandemic.  

If you just try to make cases less severe and not control spread, you are going to go backwards. More spread means more people in the hospital. More people in the hospital means more deaths per capita because we deplete the limited resources that we have to treat patients. If we stopped using masks and social distancing, we'd also have more spread, which means more cases and less resources to treat patients, causing more deaths. This also doesn't take into account the long term effects of covid. 

So just treating covid means that death rate goes up.

(09-07-2021, 02:34 PM)bengaloo Wrote: Vaccines dont stop the spread, or prevent people from getting covid, as we are seeing every single day everywhere. 

(09-07-2021, 02:50 PM)treee Wrote: This is misinformation. The vaccines reduce infectiousness of breakthrough cases and also reduce your chance of getting Covid by allowing your body to fight off the virus before it takes hold. The vaccines also reduces severity of disease before it is a health emergency which keeps our ICUs from being overburdened. You are allowed to be skeptical of the vaccines for whatever personal reasons you have, but stop posting factually incorrect information that puts people's lives in danger.