And they try again...

[Dill]

(01-25-2017, 12:45 PM)hollodero Wrote: I'm not entirely sure what you mean... I got to say though, the statement "human life starts with contraception" is, obviously, a scientifically valid defnition. bfine is just right.
I also think it's not momentous for any king of legislation. And I'd feel uneasy about that definition being part of a proposed bill.

Sometimes I'm glad I live in Europe. We had a hefty public debate about abortion once, many years ago. Then we passed a law and everyone finally got behind that compromise (abortion is legal within 3 months after nidation). And it was never seriously debated since. 
Your whole scratching and reintroducing this "Mexico City" approach alone is astonishing. Your system doesn't seem to allow for any kind of compromise or social accordance any longer. And since power in your system is bound to swing between red and blue until eternity, abortion is bound to be a neverending topic. 

A judgment of fact is subject to empirical confirmation. If I say George Bush was the 43rd president of the US, that is a judgment of fact. If I say he was a bad president, or a good one, I am making a value judgment, something qualitatively different. If is not a "fact" he was a bad president, even though I think he was.

 Laws are based upon values, though in a court case, factual judgments may be required to determine whether a law was violated.  The law says it is wrong/illegal to park in a certain space. You park in it. You get a ticket. It is a factual judgment that you parked there, not a value judgment. That you parked illegally is a value judgment.

Applied to abortion--there are many points from before conception till after birth that one could define as the beginning of "personhood" or "life as a human."  Answers to the question are diverse because people are applying differing sets of values to the question of when human life "officially" begins. Because they can point to biological "fact" like conception or the first heartbeat or actual birth does not mean it is a "fact" that life begins then.

The function of ideology is to confuse judgments of value with judgments of fact.  So denying that life begins a conception or whatever is supposedly like denying facts, science, etc.