Democrats losing all credibility in denial of overwhelming evidence..

[Dill]

(04-02-2024, 08:10 AM)hollodero Wrote: Dill Wrote:You say he is “socially left,” but the only evidence for that are his CLAIMS he is pro choice and gay marriage and the like.

Well, I for one just believe him, and why wouldn't I? Say what you will, you can't say that SSF is shy to voice his own opinion, why would he lie about that?

RESET needed here.  I was responding to the question of whether SSF is a "centrist."  

And I've already explained why I don't "just believe" him on that, and shown my work.

As for his "socially left" beliefs, 

1. I don't consider being pro-choice "socially left." Over half of Republicans were before Trump. Many Catholics too. Gay marriage has become centrist at least. "Socially left" was Sunset's phrasing.

2. I don't doubt SSF is ok with pro-choice, gay marriage, and trans people. I just recognize the weak position of his beliefs in the rank order of his priorities. He's always ready to remind us "everyone knows" he's pro-choice and was for gay marriage before Obama, but the defenders of these ideals have tended' to be "the modern left" and "progressives"--targets of rage and hatred for him. 

Further, the Trump court has proven not friendly to the abovementioned policies, but SSF approves of how Trump's choices protect our "freedoms." He's also expressed admiration for DeSantis, not exactly a defender of any of these "socially left" policies.

So I don't see a "lie" here, just someone who, e.g., mostly attacks pro-choice politicians, not on their pro-choice stance, but across a range of other issues, just as he defends pro-life politicians, not on their pro life stance, but on those other issues, i.e., a guy who consistently and insistently attacks "the modern left" and defends the policies, political maneuverings, and SCOTUS selections of their anti-choice, anti-gay opponents.  

Thus it's his claim of "independence"/neutrality/nonpartisanship that takes people by surprise, as he calls others "hacks" for much more measured discourse. On his fascist thread he maintained that accurate labels are very important to political discourse. That centrist label cannot be maintained in this case without the kind of gaslighting which is destructive of accurate labeling.