NFL linemen have a high rate of successful return from disc surgery according to a Northwestern University study. Recovery time is 10-12 weeks. Carman had surgery Jan 19. He should already be working out based on that

No need to watch if you're convinced this is a bad pick

Jackson Carman Elite Movement Skills

For most people a herniated disc, is nothing. In fact, most people on this board have a herniated disc right now.

Generally, it takes care of itself. Only, when it starts effecting the Sciatic Nerve does it generally require surgery.

What it does tell me is he needs to learn better posture and improve back core strength and use proper lift technique. Proper Yoga on the back can be very effective.

But no worries it's not like actually breaking the back. Here's some informative videos on them. I see a lot of people asking about it.

(05-01-2021, 03:33 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: None of them have a crystal ball to see the future.

I certainly don't. There are plenty of players I thought would do well who didn't and vice-versa. 

That said, and maybe this is just confirmation bias, it does seem like sometimes the board/wisdom of the crowds recognizes a good pick. I remember people being particularly enthusiastic about Jessie Bates and Sam Hubbard when they were picked. Same with Carlos Dunlap. 

OTOH, the counter-example would be Geno Atkins, whom I remember some on the board thinking he was no good/should be cut early on. The coaches had some positive comments about him and board members still were skeptical.

(05-01-2021, 05:00 AM)pally Wrote: NFL linemen have a high rate of successful return from disc surgery according to a Northwestern University study.  Recovery time is 10-12 weeks. Carman had surgery Jan 19.  He should already be working out based on that

There is a video of him from, literally 2 days before the draft where he is doing lineman drills. Kid seems like a really hard worker if he is still doing 1 on 1 stuff 2 days before he gets picked.

Like the extra picks but still have more work to do on OL. Let’s get it done Bengals.

I dont hate the pick because Carman def has talent. I still question his fit in a wide zone scheme but hes lost close to 50 lbs in past 2 years. I didnt like Jenkins or Eichenburg. I thought we should have taken Radunz but if pollack liked Carman the best im ok with it. As I stated in other threads he got 32.5" arms so hes likely a RG only. I would have liked to grab somebody with a little more positional flexability but he at least fills a need.

The good news for us is there is still an OT on the board who is probably better than most of the OT's that went last night. Josh Ball. He has major red flags due to domestic violence incidents as Fla st. I dont know if he is even on Bengals board or not, but to me without his red flags he would have been a top 40 pick.

Jaylon Moore, James Hudson, and Dante Smith are 3 of the guys I would expect that we will be looking at today as well. All of these guys have good athletic traits that could upgrade our line depth and are good fits for a wide zone scheme. They all need to add strength to hold up in the NFL and I dont think any would be ready to start right away but offer the ability to be quality starters within a couple of years.

(04-30-2021, 10:13 PM)TheBengalsMind Wrote: We drafted him because he worked out with both Paul Alexander and Willie Anderson. Both gave the Bengals high grades on him. Tee Higgins also loved him.

He's a Cincinnati kid. So the Bengals probably knew more about him than anyone.

The Bengals felt very comfortable with him and that's why they selected him.

Well guess he can poor a mean bottle of ketchup if the piano man is high on him. I can’t believe so many people put any credence in what this guy says. The same guy who pounded the table for OBG and Fisher. Two big time flops


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(05-01-2021, 07:49 AM)Bronxbengal Wrote: Well  guess he can poor a mean bottle of ketchup if the piano man is high on him.  I can’t believe so many people put any credence in what this guy says.  The same guy who pounded the table for OBG and Fisher.  Two big time flops


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Paul Alexander also drafted a bunch of talented players. Trey Hopkins was even a Paul Alexander guy.

The Ketchup Bottle thing is way over criticized it's likely one of those questions designed to surprise prospects during interviews because most give over rehearsed answers to the basic questions. All teams do something similar.

(04-30-2021, 10:06 PM)TKUHL Wrote: The was a horrible pick. If you want to convince yourself it’s a good pick with what was on the board that’s fine, but people who hate this pick have a case. I can’t believe Tobin basically told the fans F you, a WR and 2 4th round picks are worth passing on two possible pro bowl Tackles. So pissed at this organization and Burrow too. I don’t care if he’s on his ass the whole season, shouldn't have pounded the table for Chase. Still had a chance to make it right with Jenkins but of course shit the bed again. **** this team.

How can you finalize your evaluation with missing info?

Let's see the 3 guys we get to fill holes (we have one now) and then look at it again in 3 years.

(04-30-2021, 09:18 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Are you guys being sarcastic I can't tell lol

Carman is a badass mauling Guard that can play Tackle and is athletic enough to play in an outside zone. Great pick.

Exactly my thoughts (about Carman).  As long as they are thinking RG instead of RT, I am 100% behind the pick.  The next pick, though, I really question when Spencer Brown was still on the board.  I loved the trade back as well and gaining TWO additional 4th rounders.  

(04-30-2021, 10:13 PM)TheBengalsMind Wrote: We drafted him because he worked out with both Paul Alexander and Willie Anderson. Both gave the Bengals high grades on him. Tee Higgins also loved him.

He's a Cincinnati kid. So the Bengals probably knew more about him than anyone.

The Bengals felt very comfortable with him and that's why they selected him.

Good stuff.  And REALLY cool pic in your sig...

I will add that Clemson didn't "help" their tackles at all...made them play on islands almost every snap.  He is tried and tested, and is very strong.  As long as the plan is to put him at RG, I am very happy with his selection.  Here is a solid evaluation of him.  As a reminder, this is based on him playing LT.  

https://primetimesportstalk.com/2021/04/25/2021-nfl-draft-scouting-report-jackson-carman/

(05-01-2021, 01:46 AM)AtomicBlaze Wrote:  I don't know if I trust the Bengals to evaluate injuries.  He likely had a herniated disc, if he had back surgery.  I would not draft an offensive lineman that has a history of this type of injury.  I just don't think your back is ever the same once you have had a herniated disc especially if it was bad enough that it required surgery.

That is really a two part statement.  To part A;  From my own personal experience, my back has never been the same since suffering two herniated discs, nearly 20 years ago.  However, that was in a different era of medical technologies and expertise.  They have procedures today, such as microdiscectomy that are minimally invasive compared to other methods, that can get a person back in action in a relatively short period of time.

To the B part of the bolded;  It all depends upon some unknown variables.  Things like age, the individual bodies ability to heal, person's physical state previous to the injury, etc.  In my case, I was a 33 y/o semi-pro athlete, in great physical condition, but I also worked a trade that was very intensive on the back (flooring).  Had a I found a different line of work, a microdiscectomy may have allowed me to play ball a few more years;  or it could have failed and had me worse off than before.

In Carman's case, only time will tell.  He definitely has age and physical condition on his side, as far as ability to fully rehab goes.  In my case, I was able to easily regain way above average strength, but the shock and jolt from collisions and contact, as well as sudden and haphazard bending have cause my back to relapse more times over the years than heavy exertion from controlled movements.

(04-30-2021, 11:40 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Last year we took Tee in the 2nd. And I maintain that Sample is a bad comparison. I do not think Carman went several rounds too early.

The thing I like best about Carman is he rarely gets pushed backwards.  He has played OT and we have shown some durability concerns there, so he has that going for him as well.  

As a RG, he will be a perfect fit.

Everyone seems to think that if we don't get a "projected 1st rounder" in Round 2 that it is somehow a scouting failure.  Well, there were some publications that had him as a fringe 1st rounder and his injury (which required surgery) caused him to slip.  He had a private workout and performed well there.  

I am very excited about another big program guy joining the team that everyone that knows him seems to rave about him.  My only concern being if the Bengals somehow want him to be our RT.  I don't think that is his best position.  RG would be perfect.  I am incredibly disappointed with the 3rd round selection when Spencer Brown was still out there, but I love the trade back and Carman selection. 

If anyone wants a summation of this thread but doesn’t want to do the work, allow me.

GOOD PICK

NO BAD PICK

NO! GOOD PICK!

SHUT UP BAD PICK

YOU SHUT UP GOOD PICK!!

BAD PICK HE’S THE FATTEST THING I’VE SEEN EVER

GOOD PICK HE’S THE FATTEST THING I’VE SEEN EVER

BAD PICK WE TRADED DOWN

GREAT PICK WE TRADED DOWN

And so forth.

(04-30-2021, 09:18 PM)SadFaceBengal15 Wrote: This is exactly y I didn’t wanna wait to go oline

What's sad is the fact that people are so hurt about the Bengals not taking Sewell, that i doesn't matter who the they take in later rounds....

(05-01-2021, 03:40 AM)Benton Wrote: For clarity, playing smart. 

When things break down he relies on his physical ability, which doesn't always work out. He also tries to stop everything coming through, which just leaves him off balance. 

Lucky for us we had guys like Mike Jordan and Bobby Hart who didn't seem to mind at all....

(05-01-2021, 06:08 AM)TheBengalsMind Wrote: For most people a herniated disc, is nothing. In fact, most people on this board have a herniated disc right now.

Generally, it takes care of itself. Only, when it starts effecting the Sciatic Nerve does it generally require surgery.

What it does tell me is he needs to learn better posture and improve back core strength and use proper lift technique. Proper Yoga on the back can be very effective.

But no worries it's not like actually breaking the back. Here's some informative videos on them. I see a lot of people asking about it.

Really.. sorry had a friend get a try out with the Browns, had the same issue.. never fully recovered, was continued to bother him.. backs are very concerning.. but if we are going to downgrade the Oline that went before him because of injury history that is why we needed to pass, we should hold the standard here but i guess for those that maybe wanted a certain pick, standards dont apply

(04-30-2021, 09:32 PM)AtomicBlaze Wrote: The worst thing is he has disc injury in his back, that is a career ending type of injury. Why would they take that risk?

It’s actually not. Not that I’m a doctor, but I do medical device implants for spine...and I like to think I know quite a lot, seeing as I have to speak to orotho spine and neurosurgeons about patients pathology, mri, pain, etc to sell my product.

There are many many minimally invasive “back surgeries”. If he got one of the 10 surgeries I can think of off the top of my head, he’ll be just fine.

Now we can debate his talent level all day.

(05-01-2021, 07:55 AM)Synric Wrote: Paul Alexander also drafted a bunch of talented players. Trey Hopkins was even a Paul Alexander guy.

The Ketchup Bottle thing is way over criticized it's likely one of those questions designed to surprise prospects during interviews because most give over rehearsed answers to the basic questions. All teams do something similar.

Look im defended Alexander before but i know from being on this board there were times we put Alexander liked him.. many said must be trash so that is not a great endorsement. as for Willie also read where he really loved Sewell so guess here it is ok to go with him but not Sewell