(05-07-2021, 10:40 AM)OSUfan Wrote: What? NT is not important? Can we please refer back to this at the end of the season should Reader stay healthy all year? With a healthy Reader for a full season you do not feel that there will be a difference in yards given up in the running game? 

No it's not an important position anymore. If you don't play on third downs you're position isn't important.

(05-07-2021, 09:15 AM)TJ528 Wrote: I mean Sled it's hard to inspire confidence in the fan base when you're record at 6-25-1 speaks for itself.  What's the old saying "you are what your record says you are" and 6-25-1 say they aren't a good coaching staff.  Can that change sure but the optics right now show he's basically the equivalent of Dave Shula, actually his record says he's a worse coach than Dave Shula. 

I don't disagree, I'm just pointing out that while they inspire no confidence in the fans, the vast majority of the players are buying in to what they are doing and have said so numerous times. Of course, there will always be those that say those players don't mean what they are saying. I tend to take them at their words. If they weren't happy, they just wouldn't say anything.

(05-07-2021, 11:06 AM)Sled21 Wrote: I don't disagree, I'm just pointing out that while they inspire no confidence in the fans, the vast majority of the players are buying in to what they are doing and have said so numerous times. Of course, there will always be those that say those players don't mean what they are saying. I tend to take them at their words. If they weren't happy, they just wouldn't say anything.

I think you have players still talking positive about the coaching staff because they've played here 1 or 2 seasons and they've seen there building and last year they were riddled with injuries.  

However, if this team comes out of the game 0-4 or 1-6 that tune changes quickly amongst the players and that confidence turns into words like Bates said there was confusion in 2019 in the game plan. 

(05-07-2021, 11:16 AM)TJ528 Wrote: I think you have players still talking positive about the coaching staff because they've played here 1 or 2 seasons and they've seen there building and last year they were riddled with injuries.  

However, if this team comes out of the game 0-4 or 1-6 that tune changes quickly amongst the players and that confidence turns into words like Bates said there was confusion in 2019 in the game plan. 

I believe the communication issue was take care of shortly after Bates made that comment and he then said it was a lot better.

Referring to 2021 exclusively:

~ I'll still call interior OL a weakness until I see Carman play. He might change that.
~ Linebacker remains a weakness. The only guy I actually feel "good" about is Wilson. The rest are average or worse.
~ Tight end doesn't have much going in terms of receiving threats. Uzomah is a nice piece when healthy, but hardly a feature player.
~ Special teams coverage might be trouble this year with a big wave of newcomers.
~ The entire coaching staff has to prove something or they remain a weakness.

How are more people not saying pass rush? Our pass rush was the weakest part of our team last year.

(05-07-2021, 11:34 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: How are more people not saying pass rush? Our pass rush was the weakest part of our team last year.

Valid. Didn't even occur to me, but it's clearly not a strength. They've addressed it in 20 different ways this offseason so hopefully that improves -- or Anarumo will look even worse.

(05-07-2021, 11:34 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: How are more people not saying pass rush? Our pass rush was the weakest part of our team last year.

I think if you look at a lot of peoples response it's been DL, LB, depth, coaching.  All the issues that were there last year.  I feel like they've addresses the DL with good players.  Not great players, but you have to hope having a lot good players allows others to excel.  

My biggest thing is Lou putting them in position to excel. 

(05-07-2021, 11:34 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: How are more people not saying pass rush? Our pass rush was the weakest part of our team last year.

Good question? 

People were obsessed with what happened to Burrow last season and  ignored what happened with the defensive line. 8 sacks in the last 11 games is a despicable outcome 

(05-07-2021, 11:42 AM)J24 Wrote: Good question? 

People were obsessed with what happened to Burrow last season and  ignored what happened with the defensive line. 8 sacks in the last 11 games is a despicable outcome 

And we brought in an All Pro FA DE to help with that, and drafted Ossai and others to help that out.

(05-07-2021, 11:46 AM)Sled21 Wrote: And we brought in an All Pro FA DE to help with that, and drafted Ossai and others to help that out.

1.) Hendrickson was a product of the players around him in New Orleans. It would be a surprise if he has the same success here as he did last season.

2.) Both Oassai and Sample are rookie expecting them to be significant contributors is not smart.

Well, this team has on and off field weaknesses.

On field.

1) Offensive & Defensive line play.

We were bottom 5 to dead last in a slew of stats measuring line play. On offense: sacks & pressures allowed, & rushing yards. On defense: sacks, rushing yards allowed, & others. We could not pass or run block effectively nor stop the run nor rush the passer. Ain't gonna win many games that way.

Now, some of that was injury related, especially on D. Reader got hurt early. Geno's injury reduced him to a shell. Tupou opted out. Wren missed all year. Our top 4 DTs all lost. We were signing guys off the street to start/play all year (Daniels, Covington, Hunt, etc). Hubbard also missed time and Dunlap flat out quit (thanks, Lou). Lawson was our only impactful DL, and he left in FA.

Getting Reader back is a start. Brought in Ogubjobi to replace Geno and Hendrickson for Lawson. Hubbard still here. Drafted Ossai, Sample, and Shelvin, who all likely make the team. And Hubert, who is likely PS bound. Tupou and Wren are also back in the picture. Along with some of last year's holdovers: Daniels, Kareem, Bledsoe, McKenzie, & Akinmoladun. And signed Anthony Williams as an UDFA.

For those counting at home, that is 15. Likely 10 on the 53 plus 2-3 on the PS. There are a lot of unproven, young, or new to the team guys. So we don't really know what we have. Has to be better than last year's disaster, but by how much?

On offense, injuries were less of a factor (XSF & Williams missed time, and Hopkins late), but Turner's guys just sucked. Pass blocking and run blocking.

A healthy XSF, Spain all year, and drafting Carman & converting him to guard should give us 3 playable OG options & push Jordan to #4 OG. At tackle, we swapoed Reiff for the much maligned Hart (who was our best run blocker, BTW). Drafted Smith in Rd 4 but he seems a bit of a project. Johnson & Adeniji look to battle for #3 OT. Can Jonah stay healthy? Yikes. At C, Hopkins coming off major injury backed by Price. Hill likely not a contributor yet.

We got a bit better at G, depending on Carman. We got better at pass protection at OT but worse in the run game. C is the same.

And of course canning Turner and giring Pollack is a major upgrade.

This seems to be a prove it to me year. Can Jobah stay healthy and be a franchise LT? Can Carman play G? Do we want to keep Reiff around long term? Is Hopkins healthy? What does Spain look like with a camp here? Can Pollack polish/save some of the depth guys into functional players (Price, Jordan, Johnson, Adeniji)? Are Smith/Hill contributors now? How big a difference does Pollack make?

Again, got to be better, but by how much? I still think we will need more reinforcements next year. Not sold on Jonah as franchise LT. Hopkins is an awful run blocker. Reiff on 1 year deal. Spain/XSF are adequate at best. No confidence in Turner's guys. Plus 3 rooks.

I'd love to bring in a vet OT, but I can see wanting to take a look at Smith in camp first. If he can play year 1, then maybe we don't need to.
------------

2. Wide Receiver.

We were bottom of the league, or near it, it separation. Higgins & Boyd are good, but not speedsters. Ross was benched. AJ was not good. Erickson gone. Tate & Thomas are marginal NFL players.

Chase is a huge upgrade. But he does not solve all our problems. Still no speed outside of him. No proven depth, really. No PR or backup slot guy. With Lees & Robinson brought in as UDFAs, I think one could make the team. Also think Morgan could displace Tate.

Again, we are better. The top 3 look fantastic. Not much after that.
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LB & TE are also problematic.

On field, I think Lou's zone system is too passive and ZT is not a good tactical/game management coach.

(05-07-2021, 11:19 AM)Sled21 Wrote: I believe the communication issue was take care of shortly after Bates made that comment and he then said it was a lot better.

Sled that's the problem though.  You shouldn't have to take that comment public for it to be addressed in the lock room. 

Evidently he wasn't being heard or listened to so he figured he'd tell the press the communications issues as well.  

Thats easy. Its the OC DC and HC.
ZT and LA had nothing on their resume that defined
Building and sustaining identities that define winning football.

Great coaching can make average talent good
But inept coaching can hinder and handicap
Great talent.

Zac and Lou have not once strung together
Back to back weeks of outcoaching their
Rival across the field.

The Bengals front office has given Zac and Lou
Enough talent to produce wins

The other weakness I see is the urgency for this
2021-draft class to get it done now.
Come out the gate making plays.
We cant afford to have 4-Drew Samples and 2 Jordan Willis
On the field this year.

Chase Carnen and Ossai and Shelvin need
Come out and contribute now.

Coaching. Ownership. Tight end. Linebacker. Defensive back is a huge question mark outside of Bates. Offensive line, until I see dramatic improvement during an actual game. Defensive line for the same reason.

(05-07-2021, 11:54 AM)J24 Wrote: 1.) Hendrickson was a product of the players around him in New Orleans. 

This is an empty allegation that can never be proven.  when a team ahs multiple productive players it is impossible to pick and choose and deceide which ones are good and which ones are not.

Lots of people saying TE is a weakness. And I don't think it has to do with Uzo's injury.

If he is healthy then we have a very solid TE corps. Not elite, but I think most people here think there are pore elite TEs putting up huge receiving numbers than there really are.

Their schedule... (The teams they play anyway) looks awfully tough to me.

For me, the biggest weakness is the lack of strengths. We have almost no margin for error. I don't know if I can remember a team with less functional depth top to bottom. We are at the mercy of the injury gods more than ever. Our lines have no identity, forget about leadership. The good thing is there's a lot of room to grow lol! And Burrow is an elevator. It remains to be seen whether that will be enough.