(10-30-2021, 02:11 PM)Sled21 Wrote: I don't believe for a second he does that in a vacuum. He has final say, but coaches get input. It seems he listens to this group of coaches on who they want to bring in and who they don't, both in the draft and in FA.

Of course coaches get input but Duke is the one that makes the decision. Also I think him and Zac have a lot of similarities in what they envision this team to be. 

(10-27-2021, 08:32 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Remember all the years of everyone complaining we did not have enough scouts, Tobin sucked at drafting, and flat out missing on a lot of high draft picks (looking at you John Ross, Cdric Oggiboggi, Jake Fisher, etc)
Since Taylor came into the building and is working with Tobin:
2019-
1 11 11 Jonah Williams Offensive Tackle Alabama
2 20 52 Drew Sample Tight End Washington
3 8 72 Germaine Pratt Linebacker North Carolina State
4 2 104 Ryan Finley Quarterback North Carolina State  Swing and a miss
4 23 125 Renell Wren Defensive Tackle Arizona State
4 34 136 Michael Jordan Guard Ohio State    Swing and a miss
6 9 182 Trayveon Williams Running Back Texas A&M
6 38 210 Deshaun Davis Linebacker Auburn     Swing and a miss
6 39 211 Rodney Anderson Running Back Oklahoma  Swing and a miss
7 9 223 Jordan Brown Cornerback South Dakota State   Swing and a miss

2020-
1 1 1 Joe Burrow Quarterback LSU  Grand Slam homer
2 1 33 Tee Higgins Wide receiver Clemson  Homer
3 1 65 Logan Wilson Linebacker Wyoming   Homer over the center field wall
4 1 107 Akeem Davis-Gaither Linebacker Appalachian State
5 1 147 Khalid Kareem Defensive end Notre Dame
6 1 180 Hakeem Adeniji Offensive tackle Kansas
7 1 215 Markus Bailey Linebacker Purdue

2021-1 5 5 Ja'Marr Chase Wide receiver LSU   Grand slam
2 14 46 Jackson Carman Offensive tackle Clemson     homer
3 5 69 Joseph Ossai Defensive end Texas         looks to be a homer
4 6 111 Cameron Sample Defensive end Tulane
4 17 122 Tyler Shelvin Defensive tackle LSU
4 34 139 D'Ante Smith Offensive tackle East Carolina
5 5 149 Evan McPherson Kicker Florida      homer
6 6 190 Trey Hill Center Georgia
6 18 202 Chris Evans Running back Michigan
7 7 235 Wyatt Hubert Defensive end Kansas State


So in 2019 we missed on a 4th rounder and a couple of 6th and 7th rounders.
In 2020 every player has stuck on the roster and is contributing unless injured.
In 2021 every player has stuck on the roster and is contributing unless injured.

Same Tobin, same scouting room, same owner from the Marvin Lewis days. I think it's obvious what changed.
I simply cannot wait to see what they bring to us when we are drafting at the end of the round.

You forgot to put a Swing and a Miss next to Drew Sample's name. 

(10-30-2021, 02:24 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: You forgot to put a Swing and a Miss next to Drew Sample's name. 

Because he is doing exactly what they drafted him for. The fact some think he was taken too high is one point, to say he's a bust is ridiculous.

(10-29-2021, 08:58 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Sample is doing exactly what he was drafted to do, be a blocking TE to shore up the oline. He was not drafted to be a pass catcher. 

You don't know that.

You don't draft a TE in rd2 unless you think there's some untapped upside to his pass catching abilities. 

If you wait till round 4 and pick Sample, fine. If you wait till rd 4 and Sample isn't there, no great loss. 

If you say "man...we gotta get this Sample guy cause he's not gonna be there in the 4th", then you have a problem. 

(10-29-2021, 03:33 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I had Sample as a mid rounder, but I heard there was a team right behind us that was eyeing him in the 2nd.

We don't know how long he would of lasted so that is a bad argument Weezy, sorry.

He hasn't been a pass catching threat much at all but he is a damn good blocker and if you say he is a horrible blocker, well...

Once again, you are wrong.

Missing out on Drew Sample would not have made a single ripple in the spacetime continuum of the Cincinnati Bengals. 

Drew sample is not a bust. He's o n the team, making important contributions. Yeah, taken too high. But he does what he does at a high level.
Was Big Daddy a bust? Or Justin?

(10-30-2021, 02:25 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Because he is doing exactly what they drafted him for. The fact some think he was taken too high is one point, to say he's a bust is ridiculous.

If we go with that argument, which i don't. He's not doing that very well.

Either by grade (pb 51.7--rb 60.4) or by pressures given up (T) for 2nd most among TEs or by pass block efficiency 90.0 (very bad), he's not "doing exactly what they drafted him for". 

He's not a bust. He's just not that good and he's taking a spot from someone who could be doing better. 

(10-30-2021, 02:42 PM)SladeX Wrote: Drew sample is not a bust. He's o n the team, making important contributions. Yeah, taken too high. But he does what he does at a high level.
Was Big Daddy a bust? Or Justin?

Bad example. Big Daddy and Justin Smith both produced while with the Bengals. A couple blocks here and there from a 2nd round TE with next to nothing in the receiving game isn't producing. 

Anyway...i'm done with the argument. He's not good. He was picked too high and someone else should have his spot. 

(10-30-2021, 02:50 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: If we go with that argument, which i don't. He's not doing that very well.

Either by grade (pb 51.7--rb 60.4) or by pressures given up (T) for 2nd most among TEs or by pass block efficiency 90.0 (very bad), he's not "doing exactly what they drafted him for". 

He's not a bust. He's just not that good and he's taking a spot from someone who could be doing better. 

His blocking definitely left a lot to be desired early on this season. And not just the one or two plays against DE’s. He’s been better lately, but he really should be one of the best blocking TE in the league if that’s all you’re getting from him. And he’s not.

(10-30-2021, 02:39 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Missing out on Drew Sample would not have made a single ripple in the spacetime continuum of the Cincinnati Bengals. 

Probably correct, but he DOES contribute to the team in a positive way. Decent blocking TE.

If we switched the Pratt and Sample picks it would look better.

I have been disappointed with Drew Sample's play in the passing game this year, that is for sure.

But he also has made some key blocks that have led to this team's success.

Ryan Hewitt filled the same role as Sample and most fans praised him and said he was an important part of the offense. But he was an undrafted free agent.

People just like to shit on Sample because he was a second round pick.

(10-30-2021, 09:50 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Ryan Hewitt filled the same role as Sample and most fans praised him and said he was an important part of the offense. But he was an undrafted free agent.

People just like to shit on Sample because he was a second round pick.

Well…yeah. Just like people shit on players that are overpaid. It’s about value. Doesn’t mean the player is total garbage. Just means people feel the team could have used that pick/money more wisely.

(10-30-2021, 09:53 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Well…yeah. Just like people shit on players that are overpaid. It’s about value. Doesn’t mean the player is total garbage. Just means people feel the team could have used that pick/money more wisely.

I think they are doing it more to complain about the Bengals taking him in the second round.  But to make their point valid they have to claim he is useless.

I think it is possible to take the position that Sample is good at his job, but that does not make him worth a second round pick.  Thta way you can complain about the bad draft decision without really blaming Sample for where he was drafted.

(10-30-2021, 09:50 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Ryan Hewitt filled the same role as Sample and most fans praised him and said he was an important part of the offense.  But he was an undrafted free agent.

People just like to shit on Sample because he was a second round pick.

Duh

(10-30-2021, 09:53 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Well…yeah. Just like people shit on players that are overpaid. It’s about value. Doesn’t mean the player is total garbage. Just means people feel the team could have used that pick/money more wisely.

Don't blame the player for taking too much money.  Blame the team for payig too much.