The Reds have too much payroll for Cincinnati. They are not New York, Boston or LA. Look to what Tampa does with less payroll, or Oakland.

The Reds owners and GMs are admitting they must cut payroll in 2022 as the #1 priority to stay in business.

Now the huge giant payroll mistake was whoever signed Joey Votto to that 10 year contract that averages 22 million a year. A contract that allows Votto to refuse all trades. The idiot who did that should be horse whipped.

The Reds should still at least try to trade Votto and his last 3 years. Offer him to Yankees or a deep pockets team for little in trade as long as they pick up all or most of his contract. Then sell Votto on how if he really wants to help Cincinnati, he will let the small market city out of this contract.

If the Reds keep Votto, then having both Moustakas and Suarez is stupid in spending. You can only play one 3rd baseman at a time.

OK, lets skip to who Spotrac.com says are Reds Free Agents Now. Some of you love Votto so much, OK, some good players can't be re-signed, as has been the case through the Votto Monster Contract.

CASTELLONOS goes at 18 million surly wanting a free agent pay increase. Stings doesn't it. Oh for the love of Votto.

We can add MILEY, BARNHART, Lorenzen, Givens, Wilson, Cabera, DeShields, Freeman, Taylor, Gale, Milone

That reduces Reds Payroll by 48.9 Million Dollars.

I do not have a list of Reds who are Free Agents in 2023. They spent too much on The Moose, so hopefully he is on that list.

Also consider Winker up for Arbitration as are some other young names. How much more will Winker and India be in payroll.

Again, look to Tampa or Oakland as to how Cincinnati should proceed. Those of you who want Cincinnati to spent like New York, Boston or LA are not living in the real world. For the Reds to keep from going bankrupt or moving to another city, to keep a team in Cincinnati, First Pro Baseball Team, they MUST get on pace with Tampa and Oakland. This means there should NEVER be another 10 year Votto like contract by Reds ever again.

So Reds Fans, get ready for saying Good-Bye to Castellanos, Miley, Barnhart and others as Reds already have said cutting payroll to cover losses in their #1 priority. Where are the losses you may ask. Try very little baseball in 2020, and cardboard fans when there was.

If I was owner, I would have traded Votto years ago, and I would shopping him now. Hey Yankees, do you want Votto ?. He only has a 3 year contract now, certainly you Yankees can handle his 3 years. The Moose is also an expense I would shop around, but if they unload Votto, The Moose could play 1st base. I would move one of them to another team. Actually, I would unload both of them if I could.

Sorry to see Castellanos go, but Reds admit they are over extended on Payroll. Time for Cincinnati to Think Like Tampa. Rays compete with Yankees and Red Sox at half the salary.

If this sounds like MONEYBALL, it is. Except I disagree with Oakland GM who thought it a bad season if you don't win World Series. I feel if you give Cincinnati Fans an exciting team to watch Memorial Day and 4th of July, and fill seats, it really doesn't matter if you are still playing on Halloween in a season that is Too Long. I also disagree with the Oakland GM on Bunting and Base Stealing. Bunting is needed, and so is Base Stealing. So copy Tampa more than Oakland.

(10-15-2021, 12:50 AM)kevin Wrote: The Reds have too much payroll for Cincinnati. They are not New York, Boston or LA.  Look to what Tampa does with less payroll, or Oakland.

The Reds owners and GMs are admitting they must cut payroll in 2022 as the #1 priority to stay in business.

Now the huge giant payroll mistake was whoever signed Joey Votto to that 10 year contract that averages 22 million a year. A contract that allows Votto to refuse all trades.  The idiot who did that should be horse whipped.  

The Reds should still at least try to trade Votto and his last 3 years.  Offer him to Yankees or a deep pockets team for little in trade as long as they pick up all or most of his contract. Then sell Votto on how if he really wants to help Cincinnati, he will let the small market city out of this contract.

If the Reds keep Votto, then having both Moustakas and Suarez is stupid in spending. You can only play one 3rd baseman at a time.

OK, lets skip to who Spotrac.com says are Reds Free Agents Now. Some of you love Votto so much, OK, some good players can't be re-signed, as has been the case through the Votto Monster Contract.

CASTELLONOS goes at 18 million surly wanting a free agent pay increase. Stings doesn't it.  Oh for the love of Votto.

We can add MILEY, BARNHART, Lorenzen, Givens, Wilson, Cabera, DeShields, Freeman, Taylor, Gale, Milone

That reduces Reds Payroll by 48.9 Million Dollars.

I do not have a list of Reds who are Free Agents in 2023.  They spent too much on The Moose, so hopefully he is on that list.

Also consider Winker up for Arbitration as are some other young names. How much more will Winker and India be in payroll.

Again, look to Tampa or Oakland as to how Cincinnati should proceed.  Those of you who want Cincinnati to spent like New York, Boston or LA are not living in the real world.  For the Reds to keep from going bankrupt or moving to another city, to keep a team in Cincinnati, First Pro Baseball Team, they MUST get on pace with Tampa and Oakland.  This means there should NEVER be another 10 year Votto like contract by Reds ever again.

So Reds Fans, get ready for saying Good-Bye to Castellanos, Miley, Barnhart and others as Reds already have said cutting payroll to cover losses in their #1 priority.  Where are the losses you may ask.  Try very little baseball in 2020, and cardboard fans when there was.

If I was owner, I would have traded Votto years ago, and I would shopping him now. Hey Yankees, do you want Votto ?.  He only has a 3 year contract now, certainly you Yankees can handle his 3 years.  The Moose is also an expense I would shop around, but if they unload Votto, The Moose could play 1st base. I would move one of them to another team. Actually, I would unload both of them if I could.

Sorry to see Castellanos go, but Reds admit they are over extended on Payroll.  Time for Cincinnati to Think Like Tampa.  Rays compete with Yankees and Red Sox at half the salary.

If this sounds like MONEYBALL, it is.  Except I disagree with Oakland GM who thought it a bad season if you don't win World Series.  I feel if you give Cincinnati Fans an exciting team to watch Memorial Day and 4th of July, and fill seats, it really doesn't matter if you are still playing on Halloween in a season that is Too Long. I also disagree with the Oakland GM on Bunting and Base Stealing.  Bunting is needed, and so is Base Stealing.  So copy Tampa more than Oakland.

Cmon Kevin..They can always just mint a trillion dollar 3rd baseman ..

Sure gives a positive vibe about this team. Makes me want to go and buy season tickets. F this ownership group.

You’d think a small market team (our Reds) with 5+ years of high draft picks would have a stocked farm system. I’m not going to dig up numbers but I’m willing to bet Oakland and TB have above average farm systems, allowing them to sell off expensive talent for rookies ready for their turn. We have a couple pitchers possibly ready, I can’t name anyone else. They could trade off some expensive players like Suarez, but aside from home runs, that dude hasn’t done much for two seasons. His trade value right now is low, think of a Chapman-like return or less for Suarez. Moose has been disappointing, what can you trade him for? Probably no one of much value. [emoji2369]

Here’s to another year of Farmer at SS, Suarez batting under his weight, Senzel getting hurt early and disappearing, and Votto not heating up until the All Star Break! Led by The Chin, who did NOTHING to deserve a contract extension. If that ain’t Cardinal Bob slapping this fan base in the face while hysterically laughing, I don’t know what is!

(10-16-2021, 11:42 AM)The D.O.Z. Wrote: You’d think a small market team (our Reds) with 5+ years of high draft picks would have a stocked farm system. I’m not going to dig up numbers but I’m willing to bet Oakland and TB have above average farm systems, allowing them to sell off expensive talent for rookies ready for their turn. We have a couple pitchers possibly ready, I can’t name anyone else. They could trade off some expensive players like Suarez, but aside from home runs, that dude hasn’t done much for two seasons. His trade value right now is low, think of a Chapman-like return or less for Suarez. Moose has been disappointing, what can you trade him for? Probably no one of much value. [emoji2369]

Here’s to another year of Farmer at SS, Suarez batting under his weight, Senzel getting hurt early and disappearing, and Votto not heating up until the All Star Break! Led by The Chin, who did NOTHING to deserve a contract extension. If that ain’t Cardinal Bob slapping this fan base in the face while hysterically laughing, I don’t know what is!

The farm system isn't bad, especially when looking at the pitching prospects.  

I hate seeing them punt on 2022 just a few days into the season.  I think the budget slashing is more greed on behalf of Bob Castellini than it is any attempt to be like the Rays or A's.  The Rays would take Castillo and beat some team over the head with him to watch 2 or 3 high level prospects shake out.  Krall just puts dudes like Bradley and Miley on waivers for jack squat because he sucks shit as a baseball executive.  

The Reds are about to get buried.  They have elected to be shitty at a time where the Brown family are actually looking like they want to spend money to build a winner.  If the Bengals continue on their current trajectory with a charismatic quarterback and a front office actively trying to change their PR for the better, nobody will give a single shit about the Reds the very instant that the first player sets foot into PBS for training camp.

Well, here we go with a AAA team on the field. Reds are in the midst of a fire sale.

(11-05-2021, 08:26 PM)samhain Wrote: The Reds are about to get buried.  They have elected to be shitty at a time where the Brown family are actually looking like they want to spend money to build a winner.  If the Bengals continue on their current trajectory with a charismatic quarterback and a front office actively trying to change their PR for the better, nobody will give a single shit about the Reds the very instant that the first player sets foot into PBS for training camp.

Reds have had 2 straight winning season and were in the playoff last year.  They have made multiple big moves over the last few years brining in guys like Moustakis, Castellanos, Sonny Gray, and Trevor Baur.

Thye may suck in 2022, but right now they are way ahead of the Bengals in regards to satisfying the fans.

(11-10-2021, 02:46 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Reds have had 2 straight winning season and were in the playoff last year.  They have made multiple big moves over the last few years brining in guys like Moustakis, Castellanos, Sonny Gray, and Trevor Baur.

Thye may suck in 2022, but right now they are way ahead of the Bengals in regards to satisfying the fans.

They had an embarrassing playoff series vs Atlanta in a freak COVID season and are coming off on an epic meltdown this year.  Throw in the fact that fans just watched them go through a legit sell-off/rebuild from 2014-2019 and you've got a fan base that's low on patience.  Ownership has shown that all a rebuild gets them is about 2 years of low-end success, followed by another tear-down.  Not exactly a team people will want to pay to watch while they try to get their shit together again.

(11-10-2021, 06:01 PM)samhain Wrote: They had an embarrassing playoff series vs Atlanta in a freak COVID season and are coming off on an epic meltdown this year.  Throw in the fact that fans just watched them go through a legit sell-off/rebuild from 2014-2019 and you've got a fan base that's low on patience.  Ownership has shown that all a rebuild gets them is about 2 years of low-end success, followed by another tear-down.  Not exactly a team people will want to pay to watch while they try to get their shit together again.

Couldn’t have said it better myself!