(01-25-2022, 02:53 PM)Wyche Wrote: Let's see....CJ, Bates, Mixon, Boyd, Harris, Huber, Evans, Phillips, Wilson....I think that's it?

Trey Hopkins and Josh Tupou

Huber Evans Wilson and Harris are all mostly special teamers. I personally forgot completely about Darius Phillips... Guessing Mental Block from that San Francisco game lol.

(01-25-2022, 01:24 PM)Wyche Wrote: Agree....and I have no data to back this opinion, but it seems that it would be even harder to turn a team around when the previous guy has been there so long. Imagine what it'll be like in New England. I think a coach should get three years minimum, unless it's a complete Trainwreck. That firing in Miami was ridiculous.

Agree

Only thing I can think of was Flores was wanting the kind of control they weren't willing to give.

As for ZT I'll have to admit there's been many times I wanted his head on a platter. But I was wrong and I admit it. Here's to hoping this is the beginning of great things to come. 

(01-25-2022, 02:57 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Agree

Only thing I can think of was Flores was wanting the kind of control they weren't willing to give.

As for ZT I'll have to admit there's been many times I wanted his head on a platter. But I was wrong and I admit it. Here's to hoping this is the beginning of great things to come. 

From what I heard on Sirius, Flores was disrespectful and could not get along with his coaches nor could he get along with ownership.

(01-25-2022, 02:30 PM)Sled21 Wrote: And shortly after he was hired and spoke of his vision, I predicted he would be one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever, and people laughed and laughed and laughed. Yet here he is in his 3rd year already in the top 3. 

Have to give you props 

(01-25-2022, 02:59 PM)Sled21 Wrote: From what I heard on Sirius, Flores was disrespectful and could not get along with his coaches nor could he get along with ownership.

I guess ?

But my first thoughts would be that ownership should have known what they were getting. And didn't he hire some or most of his staff ? I don't know, I've never even slightly followed the Dolphins.

(01-25-2022, 02:55 PM)Synric Wrote: Trey Hopkins and Josh Tupou

Huber Evans Wilson and Harris are all mostly special teamers. I personally forgot completely about Darius Phillips... Guessing Mental Block from that San Francisco game lol.

Don't feel bad, how could I have forgotten Trey and Josh? . So that makes 11 leftover.

(01-25-2022, 02:59 PM)Sled21 Wrote: From what I heard on Sirius, Flores was disrespectful and could not get along with his coaches nor could he get along with ownership.

(01-25-2022, 03:03 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: I guess ?

But my first thoughts would be that ownership should have known what they were getting. And didn't he hire some or most of his staff ? I don't know, I've never even slightly followed the Dolphins.

From what I've read, his infighting with management/ownership was over Tua. He apparently doesn't think he's the man for Miami.

(01-25-2022, 02:59 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Have to give you props 

Without looking, I think Sled was the only one that had THAT much faith....I know leonardfan40 thought we'd likely make the playoffs with 9 wins, but that's about all I can recall.

(01-25-2022, 01:21 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: The Browns method of hiring new coaches every 1-2 years for decades is just way too exciting! If teams had more patience there’d probably be a few more names on that list. Everyone just wants instant success without having to work for it though. It takes 3-4 years to remake a roster, draft good talent, etc.

I don't think it's "without wanting to work for it."
I think the fans (aka customers) just expect the product to be better faster.
They don't want to wait around year after year after year just to get to winning record/playoffs.
The longer it takes, the more the fans start to lose interest.

That's also part of why you're seeing 1st round rookie QBs start sooner.
The longer a rookie sits on the bench, the lower the value the contract becomes (at least in the eyes of some fans).

(01-25-2022, 02:30 PM)Sled21 Wrote: And shortly after he was hired and spoke of his vision, I predicted he would be one of the greatest Bengals coaches ever, and people laughed and laughed and laughed. Yet here he is in his 3rd year already in the top 3. 

I was a supporter of Zac Taylor -- until I wasn't.

I supported him through the 2-win season. I supported him through the 4-win season. In the back of mind was the comment of a poster (FredToast) that a coach needed to be given three years to implement his vision, and I was thinking of how Belichick had been let go by Cleveland. 

I was delighted the beginning of this year. But after the back-to-back loses to the Jets and Cleveland, I was devastated and lost hope. I felt if the Bengals fired him, and had to restart over, then so be it. I thought about coaches I've seen: Dave Shula (19 wins and 51 loses) and Bruce Coslet (21-39) and Dick LeBeau (12-33). 

Now, I'm so glad the Bengals have retained him and kudos to those who kept the faith. This has been one of the best seasons to be a Bengals fan.

(01-25-2022, 03:41 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I don't think it's "without wanting to work for it."
I think the fans (aka customers) just expect the product to be better faster.
They don't want to wait around year after year after year just to get to winning record/playoffs.
The longer it takes, the more the fans start to lose interest.

That's also part of why you're seeing 1st round rookie QBs start sooner.
The longer a rookie sits on the bench, the lower the value the contract becomes (at least in the eyes of some fans).

I think that's true from any viewpoint, not just fans. If that QB pans out, you know you're gonna have to pay him. Which leads to less money to spread around.

(01-25-2022, 01:43 PM)Wyche Wrote: ....and what I mean by trainwreck is an Urban Meyer kinda scenario. Back biting in the media, player arrests, etc. Not just losing close games.

That's not a wreck, that's the train going completely off the rails!  I've never liked the close game argument for what it's worth.  

I've definitely been on the wagon of "three years is enough to turn a team around" and my milestone for Zac this year wasn't number of wins, but winning a playoff game.  Which he did.  And mad props to him for it, because as much as I liked the guy and loved that he said the right things and the team seemed to rally behind him, I had very little confidence he'd actually pull it off.  But I said all offseason I'd be thrilled for him to prove me wrong.  He did.  And I'm thrilled.  It feels VERY good to walk around in Bengals gear outside of Cincinnati and not get made fun of for it for the first time in a long time. 

Obviously Bill Walsh and Jimmy Johnson are 2 names you love to see associated with your coach.

How 'bout them Bengals!

(01-25-2022, 06:03 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Obviously Bill Walsh and Jimmy Johnson are 2 names you love to see associated with your coach.

How 'bout them Bengals!

I'm loving this crow like never before!  I was wrong.  I love it that I was, because, this crow is delicious!

(01-25-2022, 02:53 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: Let's see....CJ, Bates, Mixon, Boyd, Harris, Huber, Evans, Phillips, Wilson....I think that's it?

Hubbard

Zac is killing it for sure and oddly enough 3/4 of this board or more wanted him fired with just 4 weeks to go in the season.

Glad he got the last laugh and took the Bengals to playoffs and where they're going presently.

(01-25-2022, 01:12 PM)Wyche Wrote: No other coach, dating back at least 102 years has ever been to a Conference Championship game after starting out with 6 wins his first two seasons....and some more interesting tidbits. Only Bill Walsh and Jimmy Johnson have similar success, but they won 8 each their first two years.

https://www.cincyjungle.com/2022/1/25/22898468/cincinnati-bengals-afc-championship-zac-taylor-record-kansas-city-chiefs

I think this just goes to show how bad of a team Zac inherited especially in the trenches and also shows his youth on 
how he was able to grow as a Head Coach and create a roster to his and Lou's liking. It is also obvious that the players
really like him and will go to war for him. We also had a lot of great breaks for us with players like Burrow and Chase 
being available when we picked and coaches like Pollack, Hobby, Golden and Walters being available to add to the team.

(01-25-2022, 04:53 PM)MileHighGrowler Wrote: That's not a wreck, that's the train going completely off the rails!  I've never liked the close game argument for what it's worth.  

I've definitely been on the wagon of "three years is enough to turn a team around" and my milestone for Zac this year wasn't number of wins, but winning a playoff game.  Which he did.  And mad props to him for it, because as much as I liked the guy and loved that he said the right things and the team seemed to rally behind him, I had very little confidence he'd actually pull it off.  But I said all offseason I'd be thrilled for him to prove me wrong.  He did.  And I'm thrilled.  It feels VERY good to walk around in Bengals gear outside of Cincinnati and not get made fun of for it for the first time in a long time. 

It does indeed feel good.

The losing close game argument holds a little merit for me due to watching young teams progress from little leagues to Jr high, high school, college, and sometimes professional sports.....and having been on such teams at points in my life. We weren't very competitive in '19, but last year was. This is still a young team. There's bound to be growing pains and learning curves. It's still almost surreal that we're one game away from the Super Bowl. Hey, they've proven me wrong too.

(01-25-2022, 07:27 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Hubbard

Shit, we forgot Sam too! Huge oversight. So that's 12 holdovers. 

(01-25-2022, 07:47 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I think this just goes to show how bad of a team Zac inherited especially in the trenches and also shows his youth on 
how he was able to grow as a Head Coach and create a roster to his and Lou's liking. It is also obvious that the players
really like him and will go to war for him. We also had a lot of great breaks for us with players like Burrow and Chase 
being available when we picked and coaches like Pollack, Hobby, Golden and Walters being available to add to the team.

The trenches were awful. Absolutely awful.