(01-21-2022, 03:30 PM)Johnny Cupcakes Wrote: If Marvin would have won a playoff game, he still would have been 1-6 over his 16 years of coaching. It wouldn't really boost him up that much in my mind.

Well, there would have been at least one more game.  So he could've been 1-7 OR 4-6 at best (with a SB ring).

We just don't know.

Went Dalton. Not because I love the guy by any means, but if they get over the hump, I feel his confidence would have boosted well enought to win more in the future. However, I think after the 2nd or 3rd loss, he may have felt defeated and lost the confidence of himself and the coaches at playoff time. Far stretch, but possible.

I said Carson. Think you have to look at QB’s and HC as they get the most credit and blame for playoff wins based on the impact they can both have.
I’m not judging Chad, TJ or Geno one bit for no playoff wins so I don’t see that helping them much.

Andy never had Carson’s raw talent or draft expectations. He isn’t hated nearly as much as Carson either. He was a 2nd round pick who played better than that for quite a while. He has his share of haters but I think most can appreciate what he was and did for us. I would hope if he came back for ruler of the jungle or some other honor later people would be very warm to his return.

Marvin lasted 16 years so one playoff win wouldn’t change much. Even a run (whatever that means to different individuals) wouldn’t unless it was a SB win. Plus if he won it in 2005 then went 13 years without another it really wouldn’t change much for him. Little less criticism, a little more appreciation but overall I don’t see it changing too much. Without a Super Bowl or continued playoff success over his LONG career.

One playoff win for Carson and most would have a better opinion of him even if he forced his way out afterwards. Then he would be looked at as a star who put this franchise on his back and carried us to a win. Maybe if he got that he wouldn’t be so butt hurt talking about the Bengals now.

A playoff win affects Carson’s legacy the most.

(01-21-2022, 07:38 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: TJ should have stayed, as well as Marvin Jones should have.

As good as they were, they definitely needed that #1 talent on the field with them.

Boyd is a modern day prototype of them.

He's damn good but should never fool himself at being a viable #1 receiver.



To answer your thread question though I think Chad gets higher recognition and put into the HOF.

However... Dalton has the most to gain out of all.

He's basically the butt of jokes and measure of NFL QB mediocrity.

Dalton getting some playoff runs definitely not only changes how the fans of the team perceive him but all of NFL.

TJ, yes… Marvin, I’m not so sure. He has had a good career since leaving cincy. His 2017 season, with Detroit, was on par with prime green. His career stats are almost identical to bengals WR Carl Pickens. Pickens was the more dominant WR, but just to give some context to how well MJ has done.

I dunno... I really don't think any less of those guys as players because they didn't win a playoff game. Is Eddie Brown better than Chad Johnson because he played in a Super Bowl?

(01-21-2022, 09:02 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: TJ, yes… Marvin, I’m not so sure.  He has had a good career since leaving cincy.  His 2017 season, with Detroit, was on par with prime green. His career stats are almost identical to bengals WR Carl Pickens. Pickens was the more dominant WR, but just to give some context to how well MJ has done.

You are correct.

MJ has had pretty decent numbers since leaving the Bengals.

Dalton

If everything else remains the same with Marvin. Steelers beat him like a drum, team folds up under the lights, can't win in P.T. And just change the record to 1-6 in playoff game over 16 seasons. Not sure that changes his legacy that much ?

But say Dalton won the S.D. game ? Might have made things different for him ?

(01-21-2022, 03:48 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: This is all false, Tony. He never said anything to urge Burrow to not come here and he has given Burrow plenty of credit. 

Palmer Praising Burrow #1

Palmer Praising Burrow #2

Palmer Praising Burrow #3

The story about Palmer trying to urge Burrow to not come here was false but people ran with it. He never said anything of the like. The story comes from an interview where Carson said he believes that Cincinnati wasn't committed to winning a Super Bowl during his tenure - this was twisted into Carson's cautioning Joe Burrow about coming here but he never mentioned anything about Burrow. 

Screw Plamer... I said what I said... Those are all run of the mill comments... What was he gonna say? He sucks?

(01-21-2022, 08:53 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: I said Carson. Think you have to look at QB’s and HC as they get the most credit and blame for playoff wins based on the impact they can both have.
I’m not judging Chad, TJ or Geno one bit for no playoff wins so I don’t see that helping them much.

Andy never had Carson’s raw talent or draft expectations. He isn’t hated nearly as much as Carson either. He was a 2nd round pick who played better than that for quite a while. He has his share of haters but I think most can appreciate what he was and did for us. I would hope if he came back for ruler of the jungle or some other honor later people would be very warm to his return.

Marvin lasted 16 years so one playoff win wouldn’t change much. Even a run (whatever that means to different individuals) wouldn’t unless it was a SB win. Plus if he won it in 2005 then went 13 years without another it really wouldn’t change much for him. Little less criticism, a little more appreciation but overall I don’t see it changing too much. Without a Super Bowl or continued playoff success over his LONG career.

One playoff win for Carson and most would have a better opinion of him even if he forced his way out afterwards. Then he would be looked at as a star who put this franchise on his back and carried us to a win. Maybe if he got that he wouldn’t be so butt hurt talking about the Bengals now.

A playoff win affects Carson’s legacy the most.

At least there's a silver lining coming from those playoff debacles we all endured, Carson's tainted legacy. . 


Yet don't think him winning one playoff game before holding the Bengals hostage would change my mind one bit on the quitter. 

A loser can gain my respect per circumstances, yet can never respect a quitter in sports without redeeming themselves.

Think Chad's popularity was fine and not sure how much it would have escalated with just one win. Some say he would be in Hall if a playoff win came but I disagree and think how it went in NE after leaving hurt his cause. Yet he is well loved in throughout NFL fans still I believe, his flamboyancy and talent insured that. 

Love Geno and TJ,  but not sure one playoff win would have boosted them much higher either. My fathers wife was the biggest TJ fan ever and I still have her jersey, although there is no chance of it fitting me.

Would have to say Dalton and Marvin would be thought of much differently today with just the one playoff win though and since OP regrets listing Marvin my vote will go to Dalton. 

Now a SB or even making to AFC Championship game would change them all. But merely one playoff win only helps a few imo. 

(01-21-2022, 10:34 PM)Tony Wrote: Screw Plamer... I said what I said... Those are all run of the mill comments... What was he gonna say? He sucks?

I would expect to find him not giving Burrow any credit, exactly like you said he was doing.

Carson.

Everything changes if we win in 05. He's here for 15 years, racks up a Hall of Fame career, and we don't even draft Andy.

(01-22-2022, 12:50 AM)KillerGoose Wrote: I would expect to find him not giving Burrow any credit, exactly like you said he was doing.

The interviewer in every case brought it up. Trust me Palmer didn't go out of his way to give the run of the mill comments.. He knows Burrow is making him look stupid and is 100000000 times the QB quitting Palmer ever was...

Voting is starting to even out a little.

56 votes

41% Marvin Lewis
23% Andy Dalton
18% Chad Johnson
11% Carson Palmer
7% Atkins/Dunlap
0% Housh

Housh was obviously the weakest link, but I do think his career and legacy would've been dramatically impacted as well.

(01-21-2022, 03:03 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: The Fans

This, followed by Geno who was our best player in this stretch. I love Chad now but he was never really clutch in big games
that was Housh as far as our Receivers go. The fans deserved a win so much and Marv just failed in this regard as did Palmer
and Dalton. So happy not just one Playoff win finally happened for us fans but two and we could possibly have a 3rd and a SB.

Great times right now!   Sick of the old ones now going back.

From the list of choices, I had to go with Marvin Lewis. Without ever achieving a single playoff victory in seven opportunities, he will be forever known as the coach who brought us out of the dark, but couldn't get over the hump. All of the players listed will still be remembered as great players and fierce competitors, but Marvin Lewis' legacy suffered the most by not being able to achieve that one singular goal.

(01-25-2022, 10:10 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: From the list of choices, I had to go with Marvin Lewis.  Without ever achieving a single playoff victory in seven opportunities, he will be forever known as the coach who brought us out of the dark, but couldn't get over the hump.  All of the players listed will still be remembered as great players and fierce competitors, but Marvin Lewis' legacy suffered the most by not being able to achieve that one singular goal.

I just think most of it was his bad. He had some damn good teams going into the Playoffs, but 0-7 speaks for itself IMO.

Has to be Marvin. 0-7 is a brutal legacy and I don't think anyone will ever come close again. There's 29 HC with at least 7 losses in the postseason. There's only 6 coaches among them with less than 7 wins to go with those 7 losses, and only Marvin has less than 2 wins at 0.

The worst HC in 2021 was Matt Nagy at 0-2 and he got fired. Now there's only Rich Bisaccia, Nick Sirianni, and Kliff Kingsbury left at 0-1, and I don't think it's guaranteed Bisaccia and Kingsbury will be back either.

He earned it, but that's just a rough way to always be remembered.

(01-25-2022, 10:30 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Has to be Marvin. 0-7 is a brutal legacy and I don't think anyone will ever come close again. There's 29 HC with at least 7 losses in the postseason. There's only 6 coaches among them with less than 7 wins to go with those 7 losses, and only Marvin has less than 2 wins at 0.

The worst HC in 2021 was Matt Nagy at 0-2 and he got fired. Now there's only Rich Bisaccia, Nick Sirianni, and Kliff Kingsbury left at 0-1, and I don't think it's guaranteed Bisaccia and Kingsbury will be back either.

He earned it, but that's just a rough way to always be remembered.

I guess I misunderstood the OP's question. Cannot disagree with this. I just blame Marv, sad to say more than everyone else.

Geno Atkins is most deserving out of the list. He revolutionized the defensive tackle position and was a class act.

Marvin and Andy repeatedly choked in the playoffs.

I love Chad but his shenanigans were a bit much at times.

TJ was solid but not Super Bowl solid.

Carson Palmer is dead to me. He was great in 2005 and 2006, but mediocre from 2007 until he quit after 2010.