(02-09-2022, 05:17 PM)Synric Wrote: A name to keep an eye on is Saints David Onyemata who could be a cap casualty. Also don't count out a possible DT at 32 like Perrion Winfrey or Devonte Wyatt two Senior Bowl standouts and Duke loves his Senior Bowl guys.

Yep, there are a lot things we might do at #32.

Picking in the top half of the draft you can kind of project who will be available.  But at #32 we are much more likely to go BPA among a handful of different positions. 

Just some food for thought. Maybe this is a case of us overrating our players?

https://walterfootball.com/freeagents2022DT.php

Maybe we can get them both back.

(02-09-2022, 05:27 PM)jj22 Wrote: Just some food for thought. Maybe this is a case of us overrating our players?

https://walterfootball.com/freeagents2022DT.php

Maybe we can get them both back.

I believe we can get both back with proper structuring of contracts for the price of one high end DT.

(02-09-2022, 05:27 PM)jj22 Wrote: Just some food for thought. Maybe this is a case of us overrating our players?

https://walterfootball.com/freeagents2022DT.php

Maybe we can get them both back.

They have guys on that list with HALF the production of Ogunjobi.  And guys 5-7 years older with less production. 

That list is BS.  Larry and BJ are not going to be the top DTs in free agency, but they will be ahead of a lot of guys on that list.

(02-09-2022, 05:37 PM)fredtoast Wrote: They have guys on that list with HALF the production of Ogunjobi.  And guys 5-7 years older with less production. 

That list is BS.  Larry and BJ are not going to be the top DTs in free agency, but they will be ahead of a lot of guys on that list.

Agreed.

(02-09-2022, 05:03 PM)jj22 Wrote: We have the money to sign both, but do we really need both? BJ was considered a backup but he can clearly start. 

I'd like some of the FA money to go towards the Oline, and the draft isn't very deep at DT. Although some did shine in the Seniorbowl. 

There are some DTs in Rds 2-4 I think that could make great rotational DTs with Ogunjobi/Hill.
There are also some vets that could make for nice rotational depth and should not cost much at all (e.g. Darius Philon from Raiders).

Ogunjobi had a down year in '20 with the Browns, but he is still one of the most productive DTs (as designated by ProFootballReference) in the league over the last 4 years.

6th in TFL (37)
12th in solo tackles (120)
12th in sacks (20.5)
13th in QBhits (50)

And he is still just 27 years old.

I like Hill more. Seems he makes as many if not more big plays in fewer snaps. My concern there is putting a full workload on him. He may also be slightly cheaper. Both back would be awesome but I’d rather put that money to the O line than even more on the d line. Think we re-sign one and draft another DT in the first 4 rounds of the draft. All depends on price tag but I’d lean Hill

Larry coming off injury may give us a real shot at keeping him too for a reasonable amount on another one year prove it deal though so who knows

(02-09-2022, 05:59 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: I like Hill more. Seems he makes as many if not more big plays in fewer snaps. My concern there is putting a full workload on him. He may also be slightly cheaper. Both back would be awesome but I’d rather put that money to the O line than even more on the d line. Think we re-sign one and draft another DT in the first 4 rounds of the draft. All depends on price tag but I’d lean Hill

Larry coming off injury may give us a real shot at keeping him too for a reasonable amount on another one year prove it deal though so who knows

I don't think you need to worry about that, as long as you have someone to rotate with him at least.
Hill played nearly 650 defensive snaps back in 2018, his rookie year.
He put up near the same regular season stats then as this year (~500 snaps).

If we draft a DT that doesn't come in Rd 1 or Rd 2, I really like Matthew Butler from Tennessee.

(02-09-2022, 05:06 PM)jj22 Wrote: With the Bengals in the Superbowl, our FA's are going to get huge offers elsewhere.

Hate to think about this, but its true.  And I can never blame anyone for taking the money...  Ever.  

I would keep Ogunjobi because we know he can get you sacks, TFL, and QB hits all while handling a starter's workload. He's played 60%+ of the snaps each of the last 4 years and had similar-ish numbers to this year in 2019 and 2018. So we know he can do it again.

BJ Hill was a great add, doubly so for costing only a guy you were going to cut anyway. That said, he's less productive statistically than Ogunjobi and has played 47%, 35%, and 44% of the snaps the last 3 years.

If you're only going to retain one of the two, you better be sure that they can be a starter, and a productive starter at that.

(02-09-2022, 06:59 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I would keep Ogunjobi because we know he can get you sacks, TFL, and QB hits all while handling a starter's workload. He's played 60%+ of the snaps each of the last 4 years and had similar-ish numbers to this year in 2019 and 2018. So we know he can do it again.

BJ Hill was a great add, doubly so for costing only a guy you were going to cut anyway. That said, he's less productive statistically than Ogunjobi and has played 47%, 35%, and 44% of the snaps the last 3 years.

If you're only going to retain one of the two, you better be sure that they can be a starter, and a productive starter at that.

It all comes down to price.

I agree with you.  I would prefer Ogunjobi.  But what if he is going to get twice as much as Hill?

at least neither of them are repped by AthletesFirst. they still occupy space in katies colon after that waynes signing.

Hill he is more consistent on a play by play basis. With that being said I think he's could get both back.

(02-09-2022, 07:05 PM)fredtoast Wrote: It all comes down to price.

I agree with you.  I would prefer Ogunjobi.  But what if he is going to get twice as much as Hill?

Fair.

It depends on what the number is that we're doubling, I guess? If I can get Ogunjobi for $6-7m/yr for 3 years, I will offer that deal.

Of course it depends on if Ogunjobi/Hill wants to chase a payday or wants to chase more SBs. Ogunjobi has made some decent money already ($11.5m), so he's more likely to not chase purely the most money he can get regardless of location. I think Hill is more likely to try to secure the biggest payday he can (a la Carl Lawson), which I wouldn't blame him for at all.

(02-09-2022, 04:43 PM)jj22 Wrote: My NFL fandom clock is working overtime trying to get me focused on free agency. Clearly the mind isn't used to the season still ongoing this late. Kinda like a battered QB seeing ghost in a clean pocket. I got happy feet!

So maybe this is a discussion for later, but I am not sure we can sign both back. I almost think BJ has played better. Thoughts?

If we only sign one, which one should get the extension?

I want both back here but if I have to choose I keep BJ Hill. He is a better run stopper than Ogunjobi and almost as good of a
pass rusher. Overall he is just better, Ogunjobi is more of a splash play guy early in the game that seems to get worn out as the
game goes on for whatever reason. Larry O looks in better shape than BJ Hill but looks can be deceiving. BJ Hill doesn't seem to
get worn out as bad. Plus BJ Hill made the great play against the Chiefs to get us right back into the game. 

Love clutch plays like that in such a huge game.

Before his injury Ogunjobi was most likely gone. A DT that can get to the QB is highly valued and he is an upper tier athlete. His injury is major and may chill some offers. Hill has played great and I dont think we could go wrong with either or both.

Honestly I can't pick. I'd love to keep this unit together the defense has put together a heck of a year. Definitely need to keep one if we can't keep both. I do think we should be able to draft a decent DT in the first 4 rds. But I say keep both and the draft this guy.

The Bengals have shown in the past when we have 2 FAs as closely matched as these 2, we throw an offer out there and the first to sign we keep, the other goes bye-bye. All things equal; I'd take a BJ

(02-09-2022, 04:52 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I think Ogunjobi was a little better, but Hill could be the one re-signed because he might be cheaper.

I'd like to bring back Larry, but BJ played very well this year.

With what we are already paying Reader we can't drop a ton of money on DT in free agency.

Pretty much what I was going to say.

Hill is close if not just as good, and I get the feeling he'll be cheaper/better value.