(02-14-2022, 01:02 AM)casear2727 Wrote: So? I mentioned this last week, the drop just validates it for me.  He also has hasnt impacted games worthy of $20M the next 2 years with that awful right side.  We dont target him enough to pay that kind of money.

If cutting TB makes the difference in getting an elite RT or an average to above average RT would you really be against that?

I don’t think they will have to do that to sign a guard or tackle with the cap space available and cutting free money Waynes

(02-14-2022, 12:44 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Boyd's money isn't really an issue for now. His contract is up (and he'll be 30) when Chase is eligible for an extension, so they'll just move on from Boyd then.

You won't be able to find anyone as good as him for anywhere near his contract if you get rid of him. Plus then you're just 1 injury away from having only 1 good WR.

Keep Boyd. If you're going to trade anyone, trade Mixon. Only save $3.2m in cap space in 2022, but you save $13m in 2023 when Burrow will be getting an extension. No need for a $13m RB, that's just a bad allocation of resources.

We are paying him $20M the next 2 seasons. Did you see $10M in value this season?  If his $20M gets us an elite RT would you still rather have him or risk Joe's health?

No matter how good he is, he isnt putting up numbers to equal how good he is.  Chase, Higgins, Mixon, CJ are our priorities, any speedy slot would work for us for much cheaper and make our offense better with a very good oline versus average oline and TB getting 3-5 receptions per game.

(02-14-2022, 01:05 AM)Gdale_Bengal Wrote: I don’t think they will have to do that to sign a guard or tackle with the cap space available and cutting free money Waynes

We can sign a G or T or we could sign an elite G or T with our underused slot's $20m?

Thats all Im saying, and we have lots of contracts coming up or extensions in the next 2 years.

This was an important drop.  Even if he does not get the first down?  4th and short we may go for it who knows?

Watch them alligator arms!  And there was no contest of the catch by the defense only an impending hit likely.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTJVMVHkjmE

And your opinion is flawed.. No foul in that, but it's still flawed. Just because you have an opinion that validates nothing other than you seem to believe your opinion is so much better than anyone else's which it isn't.
Boyd has been the best slot guy in the league for awhile now. He didn't get as many targets this years because, duh..Tee Higgins and Ja'Marr Chase. Last year it was just Tee, the year prior to that Tyler was THE man. They don't throw 10 million bucks at guys for no reason. He actually earned his money.

(02-14-2022, 01:08 AM)rankrank1 Wrote: This was an important drop.  Even if he does not get the first down?  4th and short we may go for it who knows?

Watch them alligator arms!  And there was no contest of the catch by the defense only an impending hit likely.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTJVMVHkjmE

This killed us. No 2 ways about it. We need to male big boy decisions like a an organization that wants to go to the SB every year.

We need to spend big on Joe, Chase, Higgins, Mixon, and oline. Solid and affordable TE's and slots fill in.

Tyler Boyd makes $3M more than the next guy on our offense for the next 2 years ($20M).

No doubt some love hime, no doubt he is talented. But he is not a priority in this offense anymore, no need to waste $20M on 2 more potential SB runs.

(02-14-2022, 01:06 AM)casear2727 Wrote: We are paying him $20M the next 2 seasons. Did you see $10M in value this season?  If his $20M gets us an elite RT would you still rather have him or risk Joe's health?

No matter how good he is, he isnt putting up numbers to equal how good he is.  Chase, Higgins, Mixon, CJ are our priorities, any speedy slot would work for us for much cheaper and make our offense better with a very good oline versus average oline and TB getting 3-5 receptions per game.

Yes.

826 yards/5 TD, 37 1st Downs, 71.3% catch rate, 0 drops during the regular season.

He caught 22 of his 27 targets on 3rd down for 16 1st downs. (59.3%)
The Bengals as a whole were 16th with 39.6% on 3rd down.

Without Boyd they become SIGNIFICANTLY worse on 3rd down, and they already weren't very good. Not even touching how he helps the other receivers by being on the field because other teams have to respect him in coverage.

The fact that you think Boyd isn't worth $10m but you think CJ (who made $6.1m) is a priority is the weird thing considering he's significantly worse than Boyd in pretty much all facets. He just had a career best season at age 28 and still couldn't reach 500 yards.

There's enough money to get a very good OL even if you don't get rid of Boyd. You're making it sound like an either-or and it's really not.

(02-14-2022, 12:39 AM)casear2727 Wrote: Does it matter? Look how many targets he gets vs Kupp?  We dont need a $10M slot. We need $10M oline.  

Respectfully, please provide me your argument on spending $20M on TB the next 2 years instead of an excellent RG or RT?  

It doesn't have to be one or the other. It's not that hard to sign or draft a IOL.

(02-14-2022, 01:10 AM)grampahol Wrote: And your opinion is flawed.. No foul in that, but it's still flawed. Just because you have an opinion that validates nothing other than you seem to believe your opinion is so much better than anyone else's which it isn't.
Boyd has been the best slot guy in the league for awhile now. He didn't get as many targets this years because, duh..Tee Higgins and Ja'Marr Chase. Last year it was just Tee, the year prior to that Tyler was THE man. They don't throw 10 million bucks at guys for no reason. He actually earned his money.

How does this make any sense?  Yes he earned his money before this year, but like you said we have other priorities in Chase and Higgins.  Doesnt matter how great he is if his production doesnt match the $$$ which could go to a position that would match the production. 

We have the chance at multiple SB runs, we need to evaluate where every penny is spent.  A 4-5 reception slot WR or an elite Olineman that will protect Joe?  Our offense requires a great oline and simply solid TE's and slots for the next decade.

Tell me where I am wrong?

(02-14-2022, 01:17 AM)J24 Wrote: It doesn't have to be one or the other. It's not that hard to sign or draft a IOL.

It's not that hard to draft an olineman..... ?

We had 2 1st round draft busts (not counting Ross) that should be starting veterans today in 2015 and 2018.

We have drafted exactly ONE solid starting olineman in the last 10 years. 
Please tell me how easy it is for us in the draft?

We have 0 idea what influence Tyler has in a WR room where the other 2 are 1st and 2nd year players. The OP makes no "hot take" in suggesting we could part ways with TB to free up cap; even if he's said it for "a week".

(02-14-2022, 01:23 AM)bfine32 Wrote: We have 0 idea what influence Tyler has in a WR room where the other 2 are 1st and 2nd year players. The OP makes no "hot take" in suggesting we could part ways with TB to free up cap; even if he's said it for "a week".

If we have to pay a low priority slot wr to provide guidance and influence to a 3rd yr WR and a 2nd yr ROTY, both with SB experience, we have way more issues than we thought.  These guys have grown up and p-assed TB.

I understand that many will have responses based on emotions but it is time to respond like a winning org that wants to go back to the Super Bowl and make big boy decisions on priorities that protect the Joe & win games.  

I am waiting to hear an argument as to how Tyler's low production (not his ability or likeabilty) is worth $20M the next two years over an elite RT or RG?  I think Joe's knees agree with me.

Patriots cut all pro safety Lawyer Malloy... winning requires intelligent decisions, not emotional ones. 

Just my opinion, but open to hear why I am wrong?

i am not OP. i am the guy who clearly believes it was a bad drop and costly. Keep him till current contract is up and waive bye bye at that point. In other words the choice is easy pay higgins and pay chase when its time. Boyd has his current contract to change my mind but otherwise bye bye when his contract is up.

(02-14-2022, 01:40 AM)rankrank1 Wrote: i am not OP.  i am the guy who clearly believes it was a bad drop and costly.  Keep him till current contract is up and waive bye bye at that point.  In other words the choice is easy pay higgins and pay chase when its time.  Boyd has his current contract to change my mind but otherwise bye bye when his contract is up.

This has nothing to do with the drop.

Why cant anyone who wants to keep TB provide me any reasons paying him $20M the next 2 years over adding to the current projected cap spend and acquire an elite, over an average, oline talent to protect Joe, who can then throw to priority receivers Chase and Higgins, then to a solid TE and Mixon, and then to a cheap, but quick, slot wr, of which there are a million (probably the most populated position in football)?

(02-14-2022, 01:06 AM)casear2727 Wrote: We are paying him $20M the next 2 seasons. Did you see $10M in value this season?  If his $20M gets us an elite RT would you still rather have him or risk Joe's health?

No matter how good he is, he isnt putting up numbers to equal how good he is.  Chase, Higgins, Mixon, CJ are our priorities, any speedy slot would work for us for much cheaper and make our offense better with a very good oline versus average oline and TB getting 3-5 receptions per game.

We get it you hate Boyd move on

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(02-14-2022, 01:53 AM)ah5 Wrote: We get it you hate Boyd move on

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I dont hate Boyd.  But I do like Joe better.  I dolike winning.

We get it. You are ok with losing as long as we have players you like...?

You make this shitty comment because you know Im right and you cannot make any argument that makes sense to pay a slot wr who is at best a 3rd option (sometimes 4th and even 5th) $20M while our QB is coming back home to more MRI scans... 

Im begging you to tell me how I am wrong?

(02-14-2022, 01:23 AM)bfine32 Wrote: We have 0 idea what influence Tyler has in a WR room where the other 2 are 1st and 2nd year players. The OP makes no "hot take" in suggesting we could part ways with TB to free up cap; even if he's said it for "a week".

The reality is that we have no real depth at WR.  Personally, Boyd is somewhat overpaid for what he is and overrated by a lot of folks, but there is absolutely nothing behind him.  That means that you either have to spend a 1st or 2nd round pick or drop a substantial chunk of the cap savings you get for dumping him back into a replacement to reasonably make up for the lost production.  It doesn't make sense this off-season, though it might in '23.

(02-14-2022, 02:07 AM)Whatever Wrote: The reality is that we have no real depth at WR.  Personally, Boyd is somewhat overpaid for what he is and overrated by a lot of folks, but there is absolutely nothing behind him.  That means that you either have to spend a 1st or 2nd round pick or drop a substantial chunk of the cap savings you get for dumping him back into a replacement to reasonably make up for the lost production.  It doesn't make sense this off-season, though it might in '23.

I dont understand?  No one team in their right mind pays a WR3 $10M in case WR 1 or 2 gets hurt?

OBJ came off the street replaced Woods for $1.25M - TB 10x the WR OBJ is?  Not a real question but back WR are everywhere.

Im more concerned about having to play the backup QB because we are paying non-priority players over oline.

(02-14-2022, 02:17 AM)casear2727 Wrote: I dont understand?  No one team in their right mind pays a WR3 $10M in case WR 1 or 2 gets hurt?

OBJ came off the street replaced Woods for $1.25M - TB 10x the WR OBJ is?  Not a real question but back WR are everywhere.

Im more concerned about having to play the backup QB because we are paying non-priority players over oline.

Boyd has an $8.25 mil salary next year, but cutting him causes $2.8 mil in signing bonus to accelerate, leaving you with only about $5.5 mil in actual cap savings.  Look at what a lot of comparable guys signed for last year.  Emmanuel Sanders and AJ Green got $6 mil.  Sammy Watkins got $5 mil.  OBJ is an extreme outlier because he was cut mid-season.  It's a zero sum move.  

(02-14-2022, 12:30 AM)casear2727 Wrote: I mentioned this last week sometime with a couple posters in agreement...

Boyd is way over paid at WR3.   $10.1M this coming season and $10.3M next. Trade for value now or let go and spend, spend, spend on Oline.

We dont need a superstar slot with Chase, Higgins and Joe.  Especially one not producing at a high level.

Dropping an 8yd pass on a crucial 3rd down in the SB simply adds to my suggestion a week ago.

I know it was his only drop, but he hasnt carried us anymore than a solid RG would have this season. Lets not make the same mistake 2 more years.  Pull a Belicheck and move on from high dollar guys that dont produce to their pay level.

I know many will disagree, but keep in mind, this was my suggestion a week ago.

Agree 1000%. He needs to go if he can't/won't restructure his contract. He is not producing like a $20 plus mil player should, period.