(04-05-2022, 05:24 PM)fredtoast Wrote: My original point has not been proven to be off target.  Injuries are pretty random.  There is lots of data that proves this.  

It is silly to claim that the exact same coach with the exact same training staff with the exact same information "managed" to stay healthy this year after they had a team in 2020 that was destroyed by injuries.

I am not attacking Zac in any way.  I am not saying he did anything wrong.  But I have ALWAYS said that coaching and/or training staff really could not do much to prevent injuries because they are based mostly on luck. 

You all are the ones claiming Zac screwed up in '19 and '20.  And at the same time you are saying I am the one attacking Zac.

This is nuts.

Is it possible for their injury prevention strategies have a positive impact while still having years with increased injury numbers due to bad luck?

(04-05-2022, 11:26 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: Good god, you're a necromancer?

On a related note, my sister-in-law is a plunger; always bringing up old crap.

(04-06-2022, 02:53 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: AJ's injury was likely age and playing style. He runs and jumps a lot. I don't know many WR's with his build that stay healthy past 30. Randy Moss was basically done at 32.

The mechanism of injury was probably the biggest factor in his injury. But, with age comes repetitive stress and possibly degeneration. Age would play a larger role in healing/recovery.

(04-06-2022, 02:55 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I would argue that Gruden wasn't that great at winning either. 117-112 for his career. Only 4 times out of 15 seasons did he win more than 9 games.

Did he ever develop a QB as a head coach?

(04-06-2022, 01:21 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Again, for the third time, nothing. 

Coaching is about winning. I don't understand what else you think he should be praised for.

Say one of Marvon Lewis’ staunchest defenders, through thick and thin.

(04-06-2022, 04:38 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Did he ever develop a QB as a head coach?

Never.

(04-05-2022, 02:36 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You guys are ridiculous sometimes.

If I had tried to claim that better coaching would prevent injuries at any time over the last two years you would have been squealing at me for blaming Zac for our high injury numbers.

I never did that. I have consistently said that coaching made no difference.

You, on the other hand, are now claiming that inferior coaching by Zac in '19 and '20 was partly responsible for all those injuries.

Coaching makes no difference? Let's just suppose that the coaches just ground these guys to dust from spring till the last day of the season vs taking it easy early on.. Do you think injuries would be exactly the same or simply dependant on luck alone and nothing else? In that case what use is ever having a coach involved in physical conditioning at all? Just hire a bunch of slave drivers with whips?   

(04-08-2022, 08:16 AM)SladeX Wrote: Say one of Marvon Lewis’ staunchest defenders, through thick and thin.

The only thing I defended was his winning.

I never praised him for his losing seasons the way you guys do with Zac.

And when he stopped winning I was calling for him to be replaced.  I was livid when we brought him back after the '17 season.

So what exactly is your point?

I know how they stayed healthy.. Not enough pretty nurses.. If it weren't for young, pretty nurses do you think I'd ever bother getting old, sick or injured? HELL NO! I'd stay young and healthy forever..

(04-05-2022, 12:11 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Speculation on my part, but I don't think we did things the same way in 2020 that we did last year.

Zac made it a point to back off things last year, whereas in 2020 (and 2019), it was par for the course.

Isn't that the year AJ got hurt going long on day 1 of practice

(04-09-2022, 12:09 PM)Big_Ern Wrote: Isn't that the year AJ got hurt going long on day 1 of practice

2019 was when he got injured during the practice in Dayton.  Some reported that the field was in poor condition.  However Zac stated he didn't think the field was part of the issue.

(04-09-2022, 12:37 PM)George Cantstandya Wrote: 2019 was when he got injured during the practice in Dayton.  Some reported that the field was in poor condition.  However Zac stated he didn't think the field was part of the issue.

Nobody ever accused him of suffering from gravel toe did they?  If memory serves right that field is artificial turf with an artificial, rubberized track.. or at least it used to be once upon a time..

(04-10-2022, 09:38 AM)grampahol Wrote: Nobody ever accused him of suffering from gravel toe did they?  If memory serves right that field is artificial turf with an artificial, rubberized track.. or at least it used to be once upon a time..

Here is what Boyd said about the conditions.  

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2019/07/29/aj-green-reportedly-tore-ankle-ligaments-practice-field-teammate-called-terrible/

Quote:"'The turf was terrible,” Boyd said, per ESPN. “I couldn’t run any routes out there. I’m falling all over the ground. It was bad. It was rocks, pebbles out there. Man, it was somewhere we shouldn’t have been. I’m not trying to say any excuses, but it is what it is.”

And some apparent comments from staff:

https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/07/27/aj-green-injury-bengals-training-camp-zac-taylor-dayton-field-turf-conditions

Quote:"But after working there for an hour on Saturday, several Bengals staffers were frustrated that Green’s injury happened on a field that they saw as subpar. One mentioned that players were sliding all over the place during what was a shorter-than-usual camp practice. Another saw pebbles lodged into the turf."

Again the injury may not have anything to do with the field conditions.  It was also noted that he landed awkwardly.  

(04-06-2022, 04:38 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Did he ever develop a QB as a head coach?

Gannon was pretty good but older. Didn't play that well at other stops.

Carr is all over the place. Good years. Bad years.

I don't know.

Joey Boese S&C coach senses it is because Taylor's deft feel for the modern player produced a regimen with the proper work load.
"Zac's philosophy on practice and how we do things is extremely intelligent," Boese says. "I think our players understand that. It's different in places where it's not the way it is here. The trust factor. They know what we've got going. They know when they come back here we're not going to run them into the ground. Those days are done."

(04-14-2022, 09:21 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Joey Boese S&C coach senses it is because Taylor's deft feel for the modern player produced a regimen with the proper work load.
"Zac's philosophy on practice and how we do things is extremely intelligent," Boese says. "I think our players understand that. It's different in places where it's not the way it is here. The trust factor. They know what we've got going. They know when they come back here we're not going to run them into the ground. Those days are done."

It's just interesting how winning changes the narrative. If Dalton was the qb and we won 4-5 games, the narrative would be that the players aren't being prepared for the season.

(04-14-2022, 09:43 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: It's just interesting how winning changes the narrative. If Dalton was the qb and we won 4-5 games, the narrative would be that the players aren't being prepared for the season.

True but Boese was talking about before this season

(04-14-2022, 09:21 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Joey Boese S&C coach senses it is because Taylor's deft feel for the modern player produced a regimen with the proper work load.
"Zac's philosophy on practice and how we do things is extremely intelligent," Boese says. "I think our players understand that. It's different in places where it's not the way it is here. The trust factor. They know what we've got going. They know when they come back here we're not going to run them into the ground. Those days are done."

Hard to believe that NFL players used to spend the offseason selling insurance or cars or something like that.  They did not get into football shape until they came to training camp.  

It is a whole new world now.  If you don't train and eat right all year round you don't stay in the NFL.

(04-15-2022, 10:43 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Hard to believe that NFL players used to spend the offseason selling insurance or cars or something like that.  They did not get into football shape until they came to training camp.  

It is a whole new world now.  If you don't train and eat right all year round you don't stay in the NFL.

I thought you might want to change your sig from Jack Handy for this:
"Zac's philosophy on practice and how we do things is extremely intelligent," Boese says

Joey Boese” He believes that chemistry began to bubble last May and June, when the Bengals were one of the few teams in the league that had virtually perfect attendance for the voluntaries. Boese senses it is because Taylor's deft feel for the modern player produced a regimen with the proper work load.”