Not cool.

The part where no charges were filed after retrieving old phone records made me less angry.

(04-28-2022, 08:09 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: guilty until proven innocent, huh? you seem like an emotional reactionary person

I tend to give people with strong feelings on this leeway because they have been handled pretty awfully throughout history. The issue is usually there are two people there and each can have different ideas of what happened. In each persons mind their version can be true without making the other person a liar because there can be a lot of nuance to the situation.

Defector? Really? Just note that no other sports media picked it up and remember who these "reporters" are/were.

Seems sketchy, but if it's true, I'd part ways.

(04-28-2022, 08:13 PM)Au165 Wrote: I tend to give people with strong feelings on this leeway because they have been handled pretty awfully throughout history. The issue is usually there are two people there and each can have different ideas of what happened. In each persons mind their version can be true without making the other person a liar because there can be a lot of nuance to the situation.

it's very irresponsible and dangerous to jump to conclusions. I hate the guilty until proven innocent mindset people have. Social media has exacerbated it

(04-28-2022, 08:20 PM)Wyche Wrote: Seems sketchy, but if it's true, I'd part ways.

On the surface, it does seem sketchy.  However, in the Southeastern States people love their college football programs more than many other things in life.  I could envision a situation where, like in the "good ole' boy network", everything possible that could be done to keep this story quiet and under wraps, very well could have went down in the name of not bringing shame to the University, and more importantly, "the program".  

(04-28-2022, 08:09 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: guilty until proven innocent, huh? you seem like an emotional reactionary person

I don't care how I "seem". The justice system has proven for decades upon decades that it is incapable of reliably determining guilt in rape cases. We're forced to interpret credibility on our own, and the reports of "Jane Doe" are just about impossible for me to look past.

Really sickening to hear these stories but there are reasons to withhold trashing Carman too quickly.

If she is telling the truth then she got a lot of VERY bad advice. First: don’t ask the guy who raped you for a ride home. Get the hell out of there and someplace public and call for a ride from someone who hasn’t just raped you. 2nd: I understand a victim not wanting to file a report right away, but if you are a parent and your child tells you they were raped you don’t leave it up to them. You get them to a doctor and file a report.

It’s hard enough to prove rape, but you really need to go to the police right away to have a good shot at getting a conviction. Not always but time is of the essence in these situations.

All of that said, we live in an innocent until proven guilty country thankfully. The case was investigated and closed with no charges filed. It’s also worth noting she waited until his career was established and he was about to cash in before coming forward. I believe they also said she filed the report at age 17 (did not wait until she was a legal adult which would leave her at more risk if filing a false report). The fact that they reviewed her phone records and didn’t proceed further says something. Especially after she had screenshots of some of the convo but not the all of it, and said the rest would be more damning and once police saw the full records they dropped the case. Her mom also told her she can’t see him anymore even if she doesn’t file a report? That part of the story makes no sense. That’s not something you even need to say. Oh it’s ok if we don’t call the police but you are not allowed to hang out with your rapist again?! Doesn’t add up.

I certainly don’t want a rapist on our team but I also don’t want to see a young man’s life ruined by false accusations. It doesn’t sound like anything will come of this so I would not be in favor of cutting him unless more evidence comes out.

(04-28-2022, 08:44 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: On the surface, it does seem sketchy.  However, in the Southeastern States people love their college football programs more than many other things in life.  I could envision a situation where, like in the "good ole' boy network", everything possible that could be done to keep this story quiet and under wraps, very well could have went down in the name of not bringing shame to the University, and more importantly, "the program".  

It happens in every big national program.  

I'm glad we signed 3 Olinemen this off season, because relying on this guy was a terrible idea even before he was an alleged rapist.

Someone call Q.

Not a good look at all.

I could swear I put Quinton Spain's number around here somewhere....

Zac Taylor opens press conference: “First off, I am aware there is a story about Jackson Carman today. I don’t have any comment on that.”

— Paul Dehner Jr. (@pauldehnerjr) April 29, 2022

I have no clue what happened or didn't happen; Either way we should give Quinton Spain a call.

(04-28-2022, 09:01 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: Really sickening to hear these stories but there are reasons to withhold trashing Carman too quickly.

If she is telling the truth then she got a lot of VERY bad advice. First: don’t ask the guy who raped you for a ride home. Get the hell out of there and someplace public and call for a ride from someone who hasn’t just raped you. 2nd: I understand a victim not wanting to file a report right away, but if you are a parent and your child tells you they were raped you don’t leave it up to them. You get them to a doctor and file a report.

It’s hard enough to prove rape, but you really need to go to the police right away to have a good shot at getting a conviction. Not always but time is of the essence in these situations.

All of that said, we live in an innocent until proven guilty country thankfully. The case was investigated and closed with no charges filed. It’s also worth noting she waited until his career was established and he was about to cash in before coming forward. I believe they also said she filed the report at age 17 (did not wait until she was a legal adult which would leave her at more risk if filing a false report). The fact that they reviewed her phone records and didn’t proceed further says something. Especially after she had screenshots of some of the convo but not the all of it, and said the rest would be more damning and once police saw the full records they dropped the case. Her mom also told her she can’t see him anymore even if she doesn’t file a report? That part of the story makes no sense. That’s not something you even need to say. Oh it’s ok if we don’t call the police but you are not allowed to hang out with your rapist again?! Doesn’t add up.

I certainly don’t want a rapist on our team but I also don’t want to see a young man’s life ruined by false accusations. It doesn’t sound like anything will come of this so I would not be in favor of cutting him unless more evidence comes out.

I agree with you on all points and also with your conclusions. May I add some more points that I noticed while reading the report?


Thirdly, do not go with a young man to his room if, as she reports, he tried to kiss her the day before at the cinema, using his body strength to his advantage at all times.

Fourth, what mother lets her fifteen-year-old daughter go to a movie with an adult man that doesn't start until 11pm and she doesn't get home until 1am? And the really strongest point, which you've already made as well. What mother leaves a decision to her fifteen-year-old daughter after she reports being raped?

Fifth, if the alleged perpetrator admits to his crime via text messages, why don't I keep a screenshot of it when I change my phone or provider? That would be the proof of my story in the first place.

There are just so many inconsistencies that I can understand a little that the prosecutor's office has closed the case. It is simply too little to destroy the life of a young man. Doubts always remain with accusations afterwards, that is in the nature of the thing. But there are just too many discrepancies in the story of her that I would also decide pro Carman. 

(04-28-2022, 07:57 PM)Rubekahn29 Wrote: I’m just curious as to why we didn’t see this article last year?? Just doesn’t make sense. Honestly, I need more information. Coaches will be asked about it soon, so that’ll be where I can form a better opinion.

It came up last year and disappeared just as fast as it came up. It came up during draft last year, then pop its back again this draft without a word being said all year about it.

Zac was asked about it at the end of the draft interview about getting Dax. He gave it a "no comment" just like last year.

(04-28-2022, 08:03 PM)ATOTR Wrote: Our fans dismissing this are losers

If this story came out about a Steelers or brown or raven, you’d be
Laughing and celebrating and wanting them to disown.

But since it’s a bungle, all of a sudden the girl is probably a liar.  

What a bunch of  hypocrites

What part of there is no evidence to back up this allegation did you not understand? There are no multiple accusers, no evidence, and she holds her story for two years until he's about to be a millionaire. Are you really that gullible?

(04-28-2022, 08:44 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: On the surface, it does seem sketchy.  However, in the Southeastern States people love their college football programs more than many other things in life.  I could envision a situation where, like in the "good ole' boy network", everything possible that could be done to keep this story quiet and under wraps, very well could have went down in the name of not bringing shame to the University, and more importantly, "the program".  

Hey now, Miami of Ohio is not a southeastern college.

(04-28-2022, 09:01 PM)JaggedJimmyJay Wrote: I don't care how I "seem". The justice system has proven for decades upon decades that it is incapable of reliably determining guilt in rape cases. We're forced to interpret credibility on our own, and the reports of "Jane Doe" are just about impossible for me to look past.

It's really not that hard to determine guilt in rape, unless you wait two years to report it. And I'm not victim shaming here, but the fact she was 15 when it allegedly happened, if she had gotten a rape kit done on her and it actually happened, they would have his DNA and case closed, he's be in prison. It's hard to prove ANY crime when a victim waits years to report it and all the evidence is gone. 

(04-28-2022, 08:44 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: On the surface, it does seem sketchy.  However, in the Southeastern States people love their college football programs more than many other things in life.  I could envision a situation where, like in the "good ole' boy network", everything possible that could be done to keep this story quiet and under wraps, very well could have went down in the name of not bringing shame to the University, and more importantly, "the program".  

The interesting thing from a draft perspective is that many thought Carman was a reach in Round 2. But, IF it is true that teams had him off their board totally...might be able to get him way later if you want him. So say you think he is innocent and nothing to the charges...you probably shoudl wait until later to take him.

That side of this is a head-scratcher.

As to the charges...who knows?

if he wasnt proven guilty then its not news.