(05-01-2022, 09:43 PM)Stewy Wrote: I cab guarantee you the coaches and FO are aware of this and are either not concerned due to positive medicals or they have a contingency.  

One doesn't show such great awareness as to the other oline needs and then close their eyes, spin around twice, hold their breath and hope thing workout with one guy.

I wouldn't be so sure about this. I'm again gonna trust the coaches as I always do but that exact scenario seems like what they've done the last 2 years.

(05-01-2022, 09:50 PM)Whatever Wrote: I think you have to look around the league, specifically at KC, for those answers.  

KC won the SB in '19.  They then returned to the SB in '20 with a patchwork OL.  After losing in the SB in large part due to that OL, they sold out trying to build an elite unit and dumped a ton of cap dollars and draft picks into the position group.  However, they neglected their other position groups in the process and moved backwards as a team. 

For the Bengals, it's pretty simple to look at KC's mistakes and not repeat them.  They have tried to improve the OL, but they haven't drawn resources away from other position groups to do so.  

I disagree with this assessment. 
1: I don't think the investment in the Oline was the reason for any regression. I think Mahommes struggled to deal with some of the looks defenses were showing him and the offense as a whole didn't adjust.

2: A superbowl loss to a AFC championship loss is a small regression.

Now they did trade away Hill rather than pay him. So maybe you could blame the investment of the Oline as to why they couldn't pay Hill. But I think Hill skill set might've been part of why they struggled. Also they got a good return on him that they were able to add quite a bit.

(05-01-2022, 10:04 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I'd like for OP to look through the draft results and tell us who he'd have taken with each pick since he's so upset about the lack of depth that was added.

https://www.nfl.com/draft/tracker/picks/

I'm not the OP but as someone that felt the same way after the draft I'll try and explain my reasoning.

We had 8 picks and wanting to add depth in multiple positions but also knowing we may need to double dip in some areas. I was hoping to add a couple of picks throughout the draft. The QB market wasn't there and this most likely wasn't an option. So having 8 picks and needing to double dip in an area or two and probably having to sacrifice an area or two. How many groups do we add talent to 5 maybe?

Well after giving up 2 picks it feels like we added depth to 3 groups from where we were. We added the 2 safeties who have skills and potential to be utilized right away and a corner who should be used this year. Carter who I like and see the versatility the coaches are going for but that group probably got worse with the subtraction of Ogunjobi. Oline we added 1 4th rounder in the draft but to be fair the 3 in free agency so that group was undoubtedly improved.

So in summary CB, S and OL improved. But all other positions feel like they either are a push or got borderline worse. Am I being overly critical?

(05-01-2022, 09:59 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I wouldn’t mind it, but I’m not so sure. Feels like it would have already happened by now.

Waiting on the draft. Us

I thought we needed more than 6 picks. Even drafting for depth. We are taking a gamble at Wideout, and Sample is all but certain to get extended. I don't mind trading up even if it never seems to work out for us when we do, I do think doing so for Tycen was unnecessary, given we had already double dipped with the "versatile" safety talking point, and a 4th receiver prospect, with Tee coming off surgery, was a need. I was ok passing on TE if we had to pass on something since the Offense doesn't utilize one that much. I would have went with Isaiah Likely or Khalil Shakir. We didn't position ourselves well to cut or trade Boyd after the season. If that was ever a thought.

Big Draft Day Winners...

Sample,
Boyd
Trey Hill
Brandon Allen
Huber (Welcome Back)
Trent Irwin
Trent Taylor

Draft Day Losers

Bates (from a negotiation standpoint)
Apple
Bell
Flowers
Hilton
Tre Flowers
Sample

(05-01-2022, 10:01 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I’m always going to take a WR or LT over a safety. Unless we’re talking the second coming of Ed Reed or something, and Bates ain’t that.

I agree I wouldn't want to pay Bates if it handcuffed us. But in a deep safety class which this seemed to be we should've let him test the market. Then we can either pay the amount that needs paid or we move on and use that money elsewhere.

(05-01-2022, 10:43 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I'm not the OP but as someone that felt the same way after the draft I'll try and explain my reasoning.

We had 8 picks and wanting to add depth in multiple positions but also knowing we may need to double dip in some areas. I was hoping to add a couple of picks throughout the draft. The QB market wasn't there and this most likely wasn't an option. So having 8 picks and needing to double dip in an area or two and probably having to sacrifice an area or two. How many groups do we add talent to 5 maybe?

Well after giving up 2 picks it feels like we added depth to 3 groups from where we were. We added the 2 safeties who have skills and potential to be utilized right away and a corner who should be used this year. Carter who I like and see the versatility the coaches are going for but that group probably got worse with the subtraction of Ogunjobi. Oline we added 1 4th rounder in the draft but to be fair the 3 in free agency so that group was undoubtedly improved.

So in summary CB, S and OL improved. But all other positions feel like they either are a push or got borderline worse. Am I being overly critical?

Not that you're overly critical... But where else were they gonna improve in this draft? TE possibly, and I suppose another pass rusher (Ossai) would've been nice. The draft is just a piece of the off-season, and I'm borderline ecstatic with how we've handled improving the roster.

(05-01-2022, 10:56 PM)jj22 Wrote: I thought we needed more than 6 picks. Even drafting for depth. We are taking a gamble at Wideout, and Sample is all but certain to get extended. I don't mind trading up even if it never seems to work out for us when we do, I do think doing so for Tycen was unnecessary, given we had already double dipped with the "versatile" safety talking point, and a 4th receiver prospect, with Tee coming off surgery, was a need. I was ok passing on TE if we had to pass on something since the Offense doesn't utilize one that much. I would have went with Isaiah Likely or Khalil Shakir. We didn't position ourselves well to cut or trade Boyd after the season. If that was ever a thought.

Big Draft Day Winners...

Sample,
Boyd
Trey Hill
Brandon Allen
Huber (Welcome Back)
Trent Irwin
Trent Taylor

Draft Day Losers

Bates (from a negotiation standpoint)
Apple
Bell
Flowers
Hilton
Tre Flowers
Sample

Very few teams get much out of a 4th WR and sets are less and less with 4 actual WRs split out.. more and more you are seeing TEs or RBs moving out to be a 4th WR.. the 4th wr has more value as a special team player than a a few or no snaps in a game as 4th WR

Burrow loves empty. While that could be a TE and or Mixon, a 4th receiver in this offense would be utilized more than a typical offense.

(05-01-2022, 11:03 PM)jason Wrote: Not that you're overly critical... But where else were they gonna improve in this draft? TE possibly, and I suppose another pass rusher (Ossai) would've been nice. The draft is just a piece of the off-season, and I'm borderline ecstatic with how we've handled improving the roster.

LB, WR/KR, TE, P and maybe double dip at more of a true DT 3T and let Carter be pure depth at 3T and DE.

What I like about cincy’s draft is that you can tell they stuck to their plans, even when KC took Karloftis.

a defensive end, and then the 2 other DB picks would’ve had people super happy. But with Dax Hill, it makes it seem like they went overboard with the db’s.

Makes me think Bates AND Bell will be replaced after next year, along with Apple

(05-01-2022, 10:56 PM)jj22 Wrote: I thought we needed more than 6 picks. Even drafting for depth. We are taking a gamble at Wideout, and Sample is all but certain to get extended. I don't mind trading up even if it never seems to work out for us when we do, I do think doing so for Tycen was unnecessary, given we had already double dipped with the "versatile" safety talking point, and a 4th receiver prospect, with Tee coming off surgery, was a need. I was ok passing on TE if we had to pass on something since the Offense doesn't utilize one that much. I would have went with Isaiah Likely or Khalil Shakir. We didn't position ourselves well to cut or trade Boyd after the season. If that was ever a thought.

Big Draft Day Winners...

Sample,
Boyd
Trey Hill
Brandon Allen
Huber (Welcome Back)
Trent Irwin
Trent Taylor

Draft Day Losers

Bates (from a negotiation standpoint)
Apple
Bell
Flowers
Hilton
Tre Flowers
Sample

I think Drew Chrisman takes that job.

(05-01-2022, 11:17 PM)jj22 Wrote: Burrow loves empty. While that could be a TE and or Mixon, a 4th receiver in this offense would be utilized more than a typical offense.

Plus you need good depth at such an important position. If one of the big 3 go down the drop off is huge. Guys like Thomas or Taylor could fill in for a game or two, but if there’s a major injury and one of them is your WR3 for any significant amount of time that’s pretty scary.

(05-01-2022, 11:41 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Plus you need good depth at such an important position. If one of the big 3 go down the drop off is huge. Guys like Thomas or Taylor could fill in for a game or two, but if there’s a major injury and one of them is your WR3 for any significant amount of time that’s pretty scary.

Last year that would’ve been a bigger issue, but with the much improved o-line, and a better receiving tight end, the bengals offense can still thrive with one of the big 3 missing time with injury. I just rather it not be Jamarr if that happens

(05-01-2022, 10:43 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I'm not the OP but as someone that felt the same way after the draft I'll try and explain my reasoning.

We had 8 picks and wanting to add depth in multiple positions but also knowing we may need to double dip in some areas. I was hoping to add a couple of picks throughout the draft. The QB market wasn't there and this most likely wasn't an option. So having 8 picks and needing to double dip in an area or two and probably having to sacrifice an area or two. How many groups do we add talent to 5 maybe?

Well after giving up 2 picks it feels like we added depth to 3 groups from where we were. We added the 2 safeties who have skills and potential to be utilized right away and a corner who should be used this year. Carter who I like and see the versatility the coaches are going for but that group probably got worse with the subtraction of Ogunjobi. Oline we added 1 4th rounder in the draft but to be fair the 3 in free agency so that group was undoubtedly improved.

So in summary CB, S and OL improved. But all other positions feel like they either are a push or got borderline worse. Am I being overly critical?

WR, RB, LB, and TE aren’t any worse than last year.
The depth WRs were just as bad.
TE also basically same since Hurst is about same level as Uzomah.
All LB lost is Evans.

So upgrading OL and the DBs is an upgraded team overall.

Bengals still have over $15 mill in cap, so they can add a few more vets to upgrade the spots they didn’t address in the draft.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

(05-01-2022, 07:05 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I've been saying we will wait and see what they do after. Linebackers were thin in my opinion last year. One of the reasons I was saying we got lucky with injuries. Did Jordan Evans Return? Also I would say the Dline got weaker with the loss of Ogunjobi. I like Carter but I don't think he gives us what Larry O. did at least this year. Again we might bring him back and bring in more players. Just saying with what we have right now I wish we could've added more.

I thought BJ should give us what Ogunjobi did last year, and Carter will play BJ's role from last year?

BJ Hill will be just fine and will platoon with Carter to give us interior pass rush.

(05-01-2022, 07:55 PM)AtomicBlaze Wrote:  Yet they trotted out that shit OL last year and tried to tell the fans it was good, as they did the year before, when most everyone in the world knew it would be trash.  Last year could have just as easily been a disaster had Burrow been injured once again on the record number of sacks he took last year.

Yea, it didn't work out like they planned last year on the OL, but to say they did nothing vs the year before is wrong.

(05-01-2022, 10:13 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I disagree with this assessment. 
1: I don't think the investment in the Oline was the reason for any regression. I think Mahommes struggled to deal with some of the looks defenses were showing him and the offense as a whole didn't adjust.

2: A superbowl loss to a AFC championship loss is a small regression.

Now they did trade away Hill rather than pay him. So maybe you could blame the investment of the Oline as to why they couldn't pay Hill. But I think Hill skill set might've been part of why they struggled. Also they got a good return on him that they were able to add quite a bit.

KC still had the # 3 offense last year, only slightly worse than #1 the previous year.

The big regression was their defense, which slid from 16th to 27th.  

(05-01-2022, 10:05 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I wouldn't be so sure about this. I'm again gonna trust the coaches as I always do but that exact scenario seems like what they've done the last 2 years.

Case in point.....this FA off seaseason was massively different than any in the last decade.....there was a need and they met it .....period.

So there is a difference

(05-01-2022, 10:02 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: You may be right and I do agree with your logic. That's why I want a center to slide Karras to LG or just more of a proven left guard because I think that would help Jonah improve his play. I'm nervous about trusting Carman to develop and be penciled in as the starter trusting players will develop feels like what has gotten us into this mess in the first place. But there is a difference between hoping one player in one position improves and hoping 3 players on your Oline imrove.

Oh I agree, but asking the team to replace 4 starters vs 3 is a bit much just to solidify fan confidence.  I really think they believe in Carman and that is a reality we need to accept because individual opinion will change it naught.