It’s espn insider so take it with a grain of salt. Not too many surprises at the top (Buf/TB/GB/LAR). Bengals come in 8th… behind the Browns?!

https://www.espn.com/nfl/insider/story/_/id/34020426/nfl-roster-rankings-all-32-teams-2022-strengths-weaknesses-x-factors-every-starting-lineup

(06-29-2022, 04:48 PM)Clark W Griswold Wrote: It’s espn insider so take it with a grain of salt. Not too many surprises at the top (Buf/TB/GB/LAR). Bengals come in 8th… behind the Browns?!

https://www.espn.com/nfl/insider/story/_/id/34020426/nfl-roster-rankings-all-32-teams-2022-strengths-weaknesses-x-factors-every-starting-lineup

Top 7 in order:
Bills
Bucs
Chargers (high for a non playoff team)
Rams
Packers
Browns (Watson may be gone a while and even then he hasn’t played in over a year)
Eagles (better than the Bengals? QBs the most important position and Philly is waaay behind Cincy at that position)

(06-29-2022, 04:48 PM)Clark W Griswold Wrote: It’s espn insider so take it with a grain of salt. Not too many surprises at the top (Buf/TB/GB/LAR).  Bengals come in 8th… behind the Browns?!

https://www.espn.com/nfl/insider/story/_/id/34020426/nfl-roster-rankings-all-32-teams-2022-strengths-weaknesses-x-factors-every-starting-lineup

Browns had/have a really good overall roster... Last year they were hit with Covid hard or would have likely made the playoffs with a 1 armed QB

(06-29-2022, 04:53 PM)Clark W Griswold Wrote: Top 7 in order:
Bills
Bucs
Chargers (high for a non playoff team)
Rams
Packers
Browns (Watson may be gone a while and even then he hasn’t played in over a year)
Eagles (better than the Bengals? QBs the most important position and Philly is waaay behind Cincy at that position)

The Browns do have a lot of good players but I do agree I wouldn't put them above us, same with the Eagles.

Even the Bucs lost a lot of players. It seems as usual espn is being a bit hypocritical. Using Brady and a QB to put a team
above a team they don't like like us and then put the Eagles above us and don't use Burrow as a topper to put us over them.

(06-29-2022, 04:56 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Browns had/have a really good overall roster... Last year they were hit with Covid hard or would have likely made the playoffs with a 1 armed QB

True. I just wouldn't put them over us with Burrow and our roster. Man, we need to start beating these guys again.

I hate losing to the Stains almost as much as us losing to the Stealers.

(06-29-2022, 04:53 PM)Clark W Griswold Wrote: Top 7 in order:
Bills
Bucs
Chargers (high for a non playoff team)
Rams
Packers
Browns (Watson may be gone a while and even then he hasn’t played in over a year)
Eagles (better than the Bengals? QBs the most important position and Philly is waaay behind Cincy at that position)

There are some that think Hurts was heavily limited from a lack of weapons last year.
He put up 3928 total yards and 26 total TDs with just DeVonta Smith and Dallas Goedert last year.
They now have AJ Brown to put opposite of Smith, plus Goedert still at TE.
And their OL is pretty solid.

Will be curious now to see if Hurts can be at least a 4500+ total yards and 30+ total TD guy with an expected better offense.

my favorite part about these rankings was how they explained the PFF ratings:

Quote:

• Pro Football Focus grades of 90-plus categorize as elite, 80-89.9 are good/high quality, 70-79.9 check in as average and 69.9 or lower are considered below average.
  

Seems reasonable to those not familiar with PFF

Quote:QB Joe Burrow (91.8)

Ok, that works for me.  

Quote:QB Patrick Mahomes (80.4)

LO f'n L

Basically saying Mahomes is borderline "checking in as average."  

I'm not saying I agree (or disagree) but that's gonna make a lot of KC fans salty.  

How did they do this?

Was the ranking of a blocking TE/FB given the same weight as QB?

(06-29-2022, 07:27 PM)fredtoast Wrote: How did they do this?

Was the ranking of a blocking TE/FB given the same weight as QB?

That’s what it looks like which makes no sense but here’s the criteria they used:

With the 2022 draft and free agency behind us, we're breaking down each team's roster using the PFF database, with an eye toward the projected starters. We looked at both the PFF grades from the 2021 season -- a number included for every projected starter -- and a more comprehensive assessment of each player's career using both PFF grades and statistics.

Pro Football Focus grades of 90-plus categorize as elite, 80-89.9 are good/high quality, 70-79.9 check in as average and 69.9 or lower are considered below average.

For rookies and players not active (or barely active) in 2021, we used college grades or NFL grades from earlier seasons. NFL grades from 2020 or earlier are marked with (*), college grades from 2021 are marked with (**), and college grades from 2020 or earlier are marked with (***).

I like the media not believing in the Bengals which is a theme even without this article. I love the underdog role, being a Super Bowl favorites isn’t fun. Assuming the offensive line plays like there capable of I think the Bengals got the best team in the AFC with the Bills at #2. People went crazy over the Von Miller signing I think he’s overrated at this stage in his career. Donald gets double teamed every play and Floyd was there 2nd best rusher. Also no one talks about the Rams losing Whitworth at LT and there best guard Corbertt.

(06-29-2022, 07:58 PM)lone bengal Wrote: I like the media not believing in the Bengals which is a theme even without this article. I love the underdog role, being a Super Bowl favorites isn’t fun. Assuming the offensive line plays like there capable of I think the Bengals got the best team in the AFC with the Bills at #2. People went crazy over the Von Miller signing I think he’s overrated at this stage in his career. Donald gets double teamed every play and Floyd was there 2nd best rusher. Also no one talks about the Rams losing Whitworth at LT and there best guard Corbertt.

Nailed it

(06-29-2022, 07:58 PM)lone bengal Wrote: I like the media not believing in the Bengals which is a theme even without this article. I love the underdog role, being a Super Bowl favorites isn’t fun. Assuming the offensive line plays like there capable of I think the Bengals got the best team in the AFC with the Bills at #2. People went crazy over the Von Miller signing I think he’s overrated at this stage in his career. Donald gets double teamed every play and Floyd was there 2nd best rusher. Also no one talks about the Rams losing Whitworth at LT and there best guard Corbertt.

Really we got a good tanking here. 4th best roster. It’s because even with the FA signings in the OL. The only AFC teams ahead of us all added an All-Pro player.

(06-29-2022, 08:45 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Really we got a good tanking here. 4th best roster. It’s because even with the FA signings in the OL. The only AFC teams ahead of us all added an All-Pro player.

I also feel like the average media guy dosen’t know how good some lesser know Bengals players are.

Awuize - was the highest graded CB in the AFC and 3rd overall

Hilton - graded as a top 5 slot Cb

Hubbard - great against the run and can give you 7 sacks / intangibles

Logan Wilson - stud last year , hardly talked about by mainstream media

Pratt - played very good

Reader - not talked about enough about how good he is , get he’s a NT not a sexy position

(06-29-2022, 09:10 PM)lone bengal Wrote: I also feel like the average media guy dosen’t know how good some lesser know Bengals players are.

Awuize - was the highest graded CB in the AFC and 3rd overall

Hilton - graded as a top 5 slot Cb

Hubbard - great against the run and can give you 7 sacks / intangibles

Logan Wilson - stud last year , hardly talked about by mainstream media

Pratt - played very good

Reader - not talked about enough about how good he is , get he’s a NT not a sexy position

The Bengals despite a SB appearance made the biggest turnaround in history (In 2021, Zac Raylor led the Bengals to their first playoff win since 1990, ending the longest active drought in the four major North American sports, en route to an appearance in Super Bowl LVI, the franchise's first since 1988). It’s still not sunk in for a lot of folks including our own Fredtoast lol. They’ve got to prove it wasn’t a fluke. But you are dead right about some of the players. Logan Wilson? Awouzie had a hell of a season as did Hilton. We will be on national TV all the time this year and our players will get noticed.

(06-29-2022, 04:53 PM)Clark W Griswold Wrote: Top 7 in order:
Bills
Bucs
Chargers (high for a non playoff team)
Rams
Packers
Browns (Watson may be gone a while and even then he hasn’t played in over a year)
Eagles (better than the Bengals? QBs the most important position and Philly is waaay behind Cincy at that position)

The Eagles are probably the most improved team from last year.  They are much further behind at QB, as you mentioned, though.

The one HUGE issues with PFF is that it doesn't take opponent strength in to account.  If your defensive line played the Bengals twice and got 9 sacks each game, their PFF ranking would be absurdly high, but they might not do anything against a top team.

That is why I like to go back and look at game matchups where they breakdown the individual performances against quality opponents.

You can't do yearly averages that way, but it helps analyze matchups for potential wagering information.

The Packers and an NFC East team are always overrated by PFF because of the (previously) weak division in which they play. 

(06-29-2022, 09:10 PM)lone bengal Wrote: I also feel like the average media guy dosen’t know how good some lesser know Bengals players are.

Awuize - was the highest graded CB in the AFC and 3rd overall

Hilton - graded as a top  5 slot Cb

Hubbard - great against the run and can give you 7 sacks / intangibles

Logan Wilson - stud last year  , hardly talked about by mainstream media

Pratt - played very good

Reader - not talked about enough about how good he is , get he’s a NT not a sexy position

Yep!

I wouldn't trade Awuzie for anyone except maybe Ward.  He's an absolute stud in all phases.  Ditto Hilton as a slot CB.  They probably also don't know Bates, despite a 90 plus playoff PFF score.

I believe the offense took the biggest strides in the off-season, but I believe the way the defense "gelled" down the stretch, and the addition of guy like Ossai, Hill/Anderson, and further development of guys like Bailey, ADG, and Khalid Kareem will make this one tough unit.

There is a lot to be said for a defense that gets to play with a lead as well. 

(06-29-2022, 09:28 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: The Bengals despite a SB appearance made the biggest turnaround in history (In 2021, Zac Raylor led the Bengals to their first playoff win since 1990, ending the longest active drought in the four major North American sports, en route to an appearance in Super Bowl LVI, the franchise's first since 1988). It’s still not sunk in for a lot of folks including our own Fredtoast lol. They’ve got to prove it wasn’t a fluke. But you are dead right about some of the players. Logan Wilson? Awouzie had a hell of a season as did Hilton. We will be on national TV all the time this year and our players will get noticed.

Excellent point.  Even though they were in the playoffs last year, all you heard DURING those games was "9 sacks", and a lot of ball-washing of Mahomes. 

Not this year.  

(06-29-2022, 06:23 PM)ochocincos Wrote: There are some that think Hurts was heavily limited from a lack of weapons last year.
He put up 3928 total yards and 26 total TDs with just DeVonta Smith and Dallas Goedert last year.
They now have AJ Brown to put opposite of Smith, plus Goedert still at TE.
And their OL is pretty solid.

Will be curious now to see if Hurts can be at least a 4500+ total yards and 30+ total TD guy with an expected better offense.

Yep.  Eagles are my dark horse in the NFC...Have some work buddies that are big "EGGLES" fans and they pulled for us in the playoffs.  I also wagered on them this upcoming season as I think the perception of them is still junk.  

People forget how difficult it is to defense a QB that can tuck and run.  Hurts is a big, strong, mobile guy.  If he doesn't take a step this year, they will likely replace him, but I think he will have a pretty good year.  

I've been dead wrong before, but I am pulling for him.  

(06-30-2022, 08:50 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Yep.  Eagles are my dark horse in the NFC...Have some work buddies that are big "EGGLES" fans and they pulled for us in the playoffs.  I also wagered on them this upcoming season as I think the perception of them is still junk.  

People forget how difficult it is to defense a QB that can tuck and run.  Hurts is a big, strong, mobile guy.  If he doesn't take a step this year, they will likely replace him, but I think he will have a pretty good year.  

I've been dead wrong before, but I am pulling for him.  

Hurts is similar to Lamar Jackson in playstyle.
He may not run or pass quite as well, but he's close.
Both are a good hybrid QB that can make plays with their legs or arm.
However, both need weapons in the passing game to really be effective with their arm.

People love these types of QBs in fantasy football, but people hate them otherwise.
A lot of people seem to think that 4000 yard passer with 30 TDs and 10 INTs is better than a QB with 3300 yards passing, 700 yards rushing, 20 pass TDs, 10 rush TDs, and 10 INTs.
But in terms of total yardage, they're exactly the same.
I think it's because many people feel that the rushing QB style is not sustainable for too many years.

(06-30-2022, 10:35 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Hurts is similar to Lamar Jackson in playstyle.
He may not run or pass quite as well, but he's close.
Both are a good hybrid QB that can make plays with their legs or arm.
However, both need weapons in the passing game to really be effective with their arm.

People love these types of QBs in fantasy football, but people hate them otherwise.
A lot of people seem to think that 4000 yard passer with 30 TDs and 10 INTs is better than a QB with 3300 yards passing, 700 yards rushing, 20 pass TDs, 10 rush TDs, and 10 INTs.
But in terms of total yardage, they're exactly the same.
I think it's because many people feel that the rushing QB style is not sustainable for too many years.

To me the big value from a "running QB" is more about converting third downs than rolling up big total yardage numbers.

Nothing is more frustrating for a defense than having perfect coverage and good pressure but still giving up a first down on a scramble.

Lone Bengal nailed it as Whacked said. Great posts, major reps.