I hate the Steelers but Big Ben is/has been and always will be one of the best in this era.

Dude is just plain amazingly talented, tough as nails and a gamer.

Can't stand the guy it's the truth.

Agree. Was bummed when they drafted him out of our backyard as a Miami Redskin. I remember coming out of high school and in college every body around here was talking about Cincinnati's QB (I think it was Giduli- Who was very good) but  Miami had a QB that was tearing it up. Then of all teams to draft him. It had to be the Steelers. Anyway its been like watching one of ours play for the other guys. Definitely a love hate thing but respect his playing ability.

(12-06-2015, 12:17 PM)6andcounting Wrote: The only ones scared of watching a Steelers offense that didn't run the ball, didn't throw to Heath Miller and called 5 step drop deep passes on 3rd and 1 against the blitz were Steelers fans.

Arians had Fast Willie Parker ...... Your saying he should have featured him? Haley gets Bell..... I'm sure Arians would have ran more had he had a back like bell .

Heath Miller always played well vs us.

I know you know them better since I only saw them 2 times a year . But I'm just saying Arians was a great coach. It feels like a few here are making him out to be a crumb bum.

(12-06-2015, 07:26 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Arians had Fast Willie Parker ...... Your saying he should have featured him? Haley gets Bell..... I'm sure Arians would have ran more had he had a back like bell .

Heath Miller always played well vs us.

I know you know them better since I only saw them 2 times a year . But I'm just saying Arians was a great coach. It feels like a few here are making him out to be a crumb bum.

Steeler fans are saying that the only two run plays in Arians playback were single-back set handoff up the left A gap and right A gap. There was no interest in utilizing a run game, not even in short yardage or red zone. No play action, no attack the middle of the field with Miller, just deep passes and Ben scrambling to avoid the pressure. There was no such thing as a dump off pass in Arians' offense. Ben was the same qb in Arians' first year as his last year. Ben become consistent enough to be considered elite under haley. His sacks and interception rate managed to plummet immediately. He actually reads defense, audibles and attacks the best match-up. Much different than just chucking it deep while getting sacked.

Arian's was a good X's and O's guy, but the offense had no identity and he kept trying the same thing failure after failure until he was fired into retirement.

The issue isn't with underating Arians. The issue is most fans are probably overrating Haley because he managed to make necessary changes and actually develops a game plan. The talented offense was able to take off, but anyone short of a ****** should have been able to manage that.

Meh, Arians is getting 10+ wins per year and a top-tier offense out of a QB he got for a 6th round pick, and (to a less extent) Drew Stanton so he's gotta be good. Tomlin has had the benefit of a HOF QB in his prime. Tomlin impresses me naught.

(12-08-2015, 02:41 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Meh, Arians is getting 10+ wins per year and a top-tier offense out of a QB he got for a 6th round pick, and (to a less extent) Drew Stanton so he's gotta be good. Tomlin has had the benefit of a HOF QB in his prime. Tomlin impresses me naught.

Tomlin benefited from a HOF qb is his prime, but not Bruce Arians? Arians was fired into retirement because he couldn't figure out how to develop and utilize an offense that played to any of number of strengths his HOF qb had to offer. Screw running, screw play action, screw quick slants, screw Heath Miller - chuck it deep with no regard for match-ups and pretend that 50 sacks and 15 interceptions a year is working out just fine. And before you say it's easier said than done, Haley fixed everything in half an offseason and had a consistent,elite offense by year two. And realistically, Haley a replaceable figure at OC; not easily replaceable, but still replaceable..

(12-08-2015, 11:04 AM)6andcounting Wrote: Tomlin benefited from a HOF qb is his prime, but not Bruce Arians? Arians was fired into retirement because he couldn't figure out how to develop and utilize an offense that played to any of number of strengths his HOF qb had to offer. Screw running, screw play action, screw quick slants, screw Heath Miller - chuck it deep with no regard for match-ups and pretend that 50 sacks and 15 interceptions a year is working out just fine.  And before you say it's easier said than done, Haley fixed everything in half an offseason and had a consistent,elite offense by year two. And realistically, Haley a replaceable figure at OC; not easily replaceable, but still replaceable..

Agreed.

Ben and Bell and others can sometimes cover up a bad call or wrong call with their ability.  That doesn't change the call being made in the first place.

One BIG reason I hate the fake field goal...let your stars make the play unless you absolutely have the element of surprise working on you side.

(12-08-2015, 02:19 PM)GMDino Wrote: Agreed.

Ben and Bell and others can sometimes cover up a bad call or wrong call with their ability.  That doesn't change the call being made in the first place.

One BIG reason I hate the fake field goal...let your stars make the play unless you absolutely have the element of surprise working on you side.

The problem with arians play calling was that his entire approach to running the offense was wrong, so the plays we could run sucked - i.e. no full back for short yardage and lack of run commitment eliminated play action. Any fan can complain about a bad play call from their OC basically every game. I'm more thankful that haley's approach to the offense gives the offense and identity and plays to the strengths while still considering favorable match-ups. As long as that's on track one particular call is forgivable.

The fake FG was on Tomlin. Haley would have chose to have the offense out there and no way the ST coach calls that on his own. The Bell game winning Wildcat was probably also on Tomlin. He had the mindset that he had the time to call a t.o. and run another play. That had an impact on the play selection and was why it was a risky play, even if it was Haley's choice.

(12-08-2015, 11:04 AM)6andcounting Wrote: Tomlin benefited from a HOF qb is his prime, but not Bruce Arians? Arians was fired into retirement because he couldn't figure out how to develop and utilize an offense that played to any of number of strengths his HOF qb had to offer. Screw running, screw play action, screw quick slants, screw Heath Miller - chuck it deep with no regard for match-ups and pretend that 50 sacks and 15 interceptions a year is working out just fine.  And before you say it's easier said than done, Haley fixed everything in half an offseason and had a consistent,elite offense by year two. And realistically, Haley a replaceable figure at OC; not easily replaceable, but still replaceable..

Arians doensn't have nearly the cream of QB talent as a HC that Tomlin does.  Rookie Andrew Luck and washed-up or injured Carson Palmer does not equal Ben.  Anywho, Arians has a vertical passing offense that is #1 in the NFL now that his starting QB is healthy, Ben is throwing for 350+ per game, and the notion that Arians retired is hard to swallow.  Why the Steelers can't admit they fired Arians and LeBeau is beyod me.

(12-08-2015, 07:06 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Arians doensn't have nearly the cream of QB talent as a HC that Tomlin does.  Rookie Andrew Luck and washed-up or injured Carson Palmer does not equal Ben.  Anywho, Arians has a vertical passing offense that is #1 in the NFL now that his starting QB is healthy, Ben is throwing for 350+ per game, and the notion that Arians retired is hard to swallow.  Why the Steelers can't admit they fired Arians and LeBeau is beyod me.

I don't think they tried to hide it. It just sounded nicer to say they retired.

Palmer's been great this year, but Ben has a higher YPG (leads league actually), little bit better completion percentage, and highest yards per attempt in the league - Palmer is #2 trailing by .04 so that's a wash. I haven't seen much of the Cardinals offense, but the Steelers offense has been all about throwing at the best mis-matches. Until the past two games, the offense has been about sustaining drives, not quick scores on deep patterns.

Mike Munchak has been one of the most influential persons as to the success of this offence. Combined with Haley's quick passes to the mismatch and Ben's buy in to the scheme while having the ability to audible into the better matchup.

(12-08-2015, 08:14 PM)6andcounting Wrote: I don't think they tried to hide it. It just sounded nicer to say they retired.

I'm just saying I find it amusing the Steelers organization has enough clout to blatantly misrepresent things like that and get away with it.  It doesn't sound nicer regarding Arians or Lebeau if you say they voluntarily retired from their jobs with the Steelers and then immediately got the same jobs elsewhere. Maybe that is why Arians and Palmer both get along so well; they both retired years ago. 

(12-09-2015, 12:36 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I'm just saying I find it amusing the Steelers organization has enough clout to blatantly misrepresent things like that and get away with it.  It doesn't sound nicer regarding Arians or Lebeau if you say they voluntarily retired from their jobs with the Steelers and then immediately got the same jobs elsewhere.  Maybe that is why Arians and Palmer both get along so well; they both retired years ago. 

I'm not sure why anyone should give a shit about anything above. 

(12-09-2015, 12:38 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: I'm not sure why anyone should give a shit about anything above. 

Solid retort.  I'm sure Arians and Lebeau fake retired because Steelers fans have such gigantic penises, or something.

(12-09-2015, 01:36 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Solid retort.  I'm sure Arians and Lebeau fake retired because Steelers fans have such gigantic penises, or something.

Again...I'm really not sure why I should care about fake or real retirements.  The "retort" was solid to the point I was speaking to.  You are making a huge deal about something no one cares about.  Solid argument that commands a solid retort.

(12-09-2015, 02:20 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: Again...I'm really not sure why I should care about fake or real retirements.  The "retort" was solid to the point I was speaking to.  You are making a huge deal about something no one cares about.  Solid argument that commands a solid retort.

I'm really not concerned about what you care about.  And I would assume the Steelers "care" about presenting themselves as an organization that everyone "retires" from rather than gets fired or cut from.  Because firing coaches is what the Browns do, I guess.  I'm sure we'd all have a hearty chuckle if the Browns HC "retired" after this season, but you wouldn't care.

Anyways, I don't know why you think I'm addressing this particular comment about the Steelers directly at you.  Steelers fans I know admit that Arians and Lebeau were fired, and they did so without getting their panties in a wad and accusing me of getting my panties in a wad.  Methnks thou doth protest too much, Mr. Idontevencare.

(12-09-2015, 02:26 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I'm really not concerned about what you care about.  And I would assume the Steelers "care" about presenting themselves as an organization that everyone "retires" from rather than gets fired or cut from.  Because firing coaches is what the Browns do, I guess.  I'm sure we'd all have a hearty chuckle if the Browns HC "retired" after this season, but you wouldn't care.

Anyways, I don't know why you think I'm addressing this particular comment about the Steelers directly at you.  Steelers fans I know admit that Arians and Lebeau were fired, and they did so without getting their panties in a wad and accusing me of getting my panties in a wad.  Methnks thou doth protest too much, Mr. Idontevencare.

I make a one sentence response to your post about the two coaches and their exit, I then repeat the same thing, again.  Meanwhile you post paragraphs and you think I protest too much.  That's rich.  

Cool...

(12-09-2015, 02:26 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Because firing coaches is what the Browns do, I guess.  I'm sure we'd all have a hearty chuckle if the Browns HC "retired" after this season, but you wouldn't care.

I wouldn't care.  However this did bring up a thought.  Maybe they fire coaches because none of them ever spend enough time with the organization for the management to care how it looks when they leave.  LOL... Can you honestly without using the internet remember the last 6 head coaches?  Without using the internet do you know how many head coaches they have had since coming back into the league?  

(12-09-2015, 02:59 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: I make a one sentence response to your post about the two coaches and their exit, I then repeat the same thing, again.  Meanwhile you post paragraphs and you think I protest too much.  That's rich.  

Cool...

True or false:

Bruce Arians and Dick Lebau are retired from coaching football.

(12-09-2015, 03:09 PM)Nately120 Wrote: True or false:

Bruce Arians and Dick Lebau are retired from coaching football.

False