(10-25-2022, 06:13 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: Well, just like what you said about breaking tackles, this is also wrong. CEH has started six of the seven games this season. Pacheco started this past weekend, and played 30% of the snaps. On average, Pacheco has played 10% of snaps this season. But, at least you got the part about McKinnon right. He does play often, roughly splitting snaps with CEH. Going 1/3 isn't that bad, you'd be a HoFer if you played baseball.

you think pacheco is just getting the start this one time? Just a one time thing against the 49ers only? 

CEH isnt as good as Mixon. CEH is a bust

(10-25-2022, 03:51 PM)Go Cards Wrote: These threads remind of the AJ McCarron should be starting over Dalton threads.

I get what you are saying but there is a massive difference between QB and RB.  I just find it kinda crazy through 7 games Evans has 0 carries and 1 catch for 4 yards.  Would like to see him get a few carries and think it could benefit our team to mix him in and keep Mixon's legs fresher. 

(10-25-2022, 06:16 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: you think pacheco is just getting the start this one time? Just a one time thing against the 49ers only? 

CEH isnt as good as Mixon. CEH is a bust

I have no idea if he is going to continue starting. That isn't what you said, though. You said that Pacheco "gets the starts". He hasn't, no. If you want to move the goalposts to say that "he will be getting the starts" then feel free to do so. 

(10-25-2022, 06:19 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: I have no idea if he is going to continue starting. That isn't what you said, though. You said that Pacheco "gets the starts". He hasn't, no. If you want to move the goalposts to say that "he will be getting the starts" then feel free to do so. 

Pacheco was named the starter this past week. That isnt a ringing endorsement of CEH

who you think is as good as Mixon. Which is just silly

you're being a silly goose

(10-25-2022, 06:21 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: Pacheco was named the starter this past week. That isnt a ringing endorsement of CEH

who you think is as good as Mixon. Which is just silly

you're being a silly goose

That's the nicest thing you've ever said to me. Hey, it is possible that I am just completely off base. Maybe even likely. From watching both players, I don't see Mixon doing anything that CEH can't do and from a production standpoint, CEH is more efficient on less carries. If Mixon ends up turning in an MVP type season and CEH is a benchwarmer by the end of the year, I will happily say that I am wrong. 

My main opinion is that Mixon is nothing special and there are numerous backs that could match his production if he were replaced today. I think CEH could if he was thrust into the role here, but that is just more of a secondary opinion. 

(10-25-2022, 06:28 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: That's the nicest thing you've ever said to me. Hey, it is possible that I am just completely off base. Maybe even likely. From watching both players, I don't see Mixon doing anything that CEH can't do and from a production standpoint, CEH is more efficient on less carries. If Mixon ends up turning in an MVP type season and CEH is a benchwarmer by the end of the year, I will happily say that I am wrong. 

My main opinion is that Mixon is nothing special and there are numerous backs that could match his production if he were replaced today. I think CEH could if he was thrust into the role here, but that is just more of a secondary opinion. 

you ever think something like that can be attributed to the chiefs having a better o-line and play caller?

because that is the case here

Mixon doesn't break tackles well and doesn't have break-away speed for long runs. Bad balance.

I don't care if it's Evans or someone else. There has got to be better.

He also ain't great in bashing and getting that short yardage.

Call up Patrick if you have to and give him a shot if Perine isn't the guy for that job.

(10-25-2022, 06:18 PM)BurrowTheGoat Wrote: I get what you are saying but there is a massive difference between QB and RB.  I just find it kinda crazy through 7 games Evans has 0 carries and 1 catch for 4 yards.  Would like to see him get a few carries and think it could benefit our team to mix him in and keep Mixon's legs fresher. 

Maybe so but fans were plenty passionate about how the back up QB was better than Dalton, reminiscent of this debate. 

Heck at least AJ had a certain playoff win against the steelers ripped from his grasp with Burfict and Pacman's baffoonery as his litmus test. 

Yet curious about Evans as well because I'm on record all over this board in off season saying to move on from Mixon after this season if not now. But seems his cap hit was big this year. The funny thing is not one single person on this board agreed with this in the off season. Now they want to crucify the guy.    

But don't want to risk any games to find out how good Evans is yet unless the coaches think he has earned it.  There will be some garbage time eventually he will get him into the game or somebody will go on concussion protocol or get dinged and force him in and then we can see exactly what he offers. 

We need to know because if he cant cut it one needs to be drafted, which is the avenue I believe will be followed. Yet think Mixon is still signed next year as well so brace yourself in case Zac sees it differently than me and does not release or trade him.  

(10-25-2022, 06:42 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Maybe so but fans were plenty passionate about how the back up QB was better than Dalton, reminiscent of this debate. 

it's also reminding me of the auden tate fan club

maybe these dudes arent as good as you think. 

(10-25-2022, 06:38 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: Mixon doesn't break tackles well and doesn't have break-away speed for long runs.  Bad balance.

I don't care if it's Evans or someone else.  There has got to be better.

He also ain't great in bashing and getting that short yardage.

Call up Patrick if you have to and give him a shot if Perine isn't the guy for that job.

He was tied for 6th last year in broken tackles with 20. Mixon is well below average gaining yards after contact. You are right on his contact balance he gets hit in the lower legs or feet he goes down.

Nick Chubb is on another level when it comes to contact balance. 

(10-25-2022, 06:42 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Maybe so but fans were plenty passionate about how the back up QB was better than Dalton, reminiscent of this debate. 

Heck at least AJ had a certain playoff win against the steelers ripped from his grasp with Burfict and Pacman's baffoonery as his litmus test. 

Yet curious about Evans as well because I'm on record all over this board in off season saying to move on from Mixon after this season if not now. But seems his cap hit was big this year. The funny thing is not one single person on this board agreed with this in the off season. Now they want to crucify the guy.    

But don't want to risk any games to find out how good Evans is yet unless the coaches think he has earned it.  There will be some garbage time eventually he will get him into the game or somebody will go on concussion protocol or get dinged and force him in and then we can see exactly what he offers. 

We need to know because if he cant cut it one needs to be drafted, which is the avenue I believe will be followed. Yet think Mixon is still signed next year as well so brace yourself in case Zac sees it differently than me and does not release or trade him.  

I've always been a Mixon fan, but he's not impressive to me anymore.

He might pick it up and get things going late. 

I still don't like the fact that he doesn't scare a defense because he hasn't been speedy, elusive, powerful, or agile.

If someone wants to feed me crow later... fine.  I'll take it.  He just is being very meh.

Going into this season the main thing I was looking forward to seeing was what Mixon could actually do with a much improved line.

Things seem to be gelling in that direction so maybe hope is not lost.

I'd just love to see Mixon rip off a huge run to prove me wrong.

It sure AF seems like a lifetime since he has.

(10-25-2022, 06:44 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: it's also reminding me of the auden tate fan club

maybe these dudes arent as good as you think. 

That's definitely possible.  At least with Auden we got to see him in a game.  Evans feels like a forgotten man this season.  If we get out to a lead id love to see him get 5 carries or so.  

(10-25-2022, 06:44 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: it's also reminding me of the auden tate fan club

maybe these dudes arent as good as you think. 

Truth.

Not enough PT for Evans to know.

Tate had his chance and didn't make much of it with his agent crying as well.

(10-25-2022, 09:39 AM)BurrowTheGoat Wrote: Why does he never get any PT?  Mixon is having a mediocre year.  I still like Mixon and think he's a good player but nothing about his performance so far this year warrants keeping Evans on the sidelines every play.  We all saw Evans flash some talent in the pre-season.  I figured that performance alone would earn him the occasional couple of plays but apparently the coaches are happy to make him a KO return man only?  Heck even last season he got more playing time.  Also, with our new shotgun heavy scheme his speed and burst could be an asset.  It's really confusing to me.

because Perine is a solid backup.... and we have run little over last couple games ...

(10-25-2022, 08:39 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: I've always been a Mixon fan, but he's not impressive to me anymore.

He might pick it up and get things going late. 

I still don't like the fact that he doesn't scare a defense because he hasn't been speedy, elusive, powerful, or agile.

If someone wants to feed me crow later... fine.  I'll take it.  He just is being very meh.

Going into this season the main thing I was looking forward to seeing was what Mixon could actually do with a much improved line.

Things seem to be gelling in that direction so maybe hope is not lost.

I'd just love to see Mixon rip off a huge run to prove me wrong.

It sure AF seems like a lifetime since he has.

Said all off season he was a high mileage overpaid back and should be replaced and money spent elsewhere and fresh legs should be drafted.

100% of the answers were that Mixon was the least of the Bengals problems and no back should be brought in to help. 

But now is not the time to move on, that ship sailed. Plus the O-line play early this season did him no favors at all or his limited carries so far. 

The coaches see these guys daily and must feel he is better than Evans for whatever reason. Hoping Evans is everything you all think he is though because it would make me very happy. 

Unless RB's are super elite I don't see ever giving them a big contract, once again it's too late now.

It is odd as well that as soon as Mixon starts running better these threads pop up. Bengals fans are not happy unless we complain it seems, myself included.

Got nothing against Evans and hope he proves to be twice the back Mixon is but the jury is still deliberating on this and the judge presiding is Zac. 

(10-25-2022, 06:16 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: you think pacheco is just getting the start this one time? Just a one time thing against the 49ers only? 

CEH isnt as good as Mixon. CEH is a bust

Why not?

(10-25-2022, 09:55 PM)Go Cards Wrote: It is odd as well that as soon as Mixon starts running better these threads pop up. Bengals fans are not happy unless we complain it seems, myself included.

I just want to see Evans incorporated in the offense.  He has some dynamic skills and explosion and could be our new Gio.  Nothing against Mixon he would still be the lead back in my dream scenario.

(10-25-2022, 06:33 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: you ever think something like that can be attributed to the chiefs having a better o-line and play caller?

because that is the case here

Of course, I've mentioned that earlier in this conversation about "both backs will largely get you what the offensive line gives them". CEH has a better line, so he is more efficient, the inverse is true with Mixon. Inevitably, it leads to me looking for things that they can control. CEH breaks tackles more often and is better at getting yardage after contact. They are both talented receivers but neither are game breaking. Neither of them pass block very well. 

The major difference is that Mixon is a lead back, but CEH led the committee in his rookie season. He tallied 1,100 yards at five yards per touch, which is respectable and on par, if not slightly better, than what Mixon has done throughout his career. The truth is that many backs are very similar in what they are capable of doing. The number of backs that are genuine difference makers are very few. Neither Mixon or CEH are one those guys. Hell, we could replace Mixon with Perine today and likely wouldn't see a drop off in our run game, though that would be hard to do in all fairness. We are one of the worst rushing teams in the league again.

Many fans don't like the "RBs don't matter argument" but it largely holds true. Unless you have a Nick Chubb type RB, you can probably replace your guy and see similar production with an "unpopular" name. 

(10-26-2022, 12:57 AM)BurrowTheGoat Wrote: I just want to see Evans incorporated in the offense.  He has some dynamic skills and explosion and could be our new Gio.  Nothing against Mixon he would still be the lead back in my dream scenario.

I just want to win and as said before am certain you will see Evans before the year is up. 

What the coaches are not seeing in practice who knows, but here are there college stats for reference  

yr....Evans.......................................................Perine.................................................Mixon

16....614 rush .....108  rec....4 TD's..........14...1,713 rush.....108 rec....21 TD's........15.....753 rush........356 rec....11 TD's
17....685 rush ......157 rec....7 TD's..........15...1,349 rush.....107 rec...17 TD's..........16...1,274 rush.....538 rec.....15 TD's
18....423 rush ......148 rec....5 TD's..........16...1,060 rush......106 rec...13 TD's.........17.......went pro
20....73 rush........87 rec......1 TD..............17........went pro.....................................18.........pro

......................Career

Evans  averaged 5.6 ypc,  9.8 per rec,  .... 4.25 TD's a year 
Mixon averaged .6.8 ypc, 13.8 per rec,.....13.0  TD's a year
Perine averaged .5.6 ypc,  8.0 per rec.......16.3 TD's a year

Evans took all 4 years to go pro as well even though his senior year was a covid year and he surely would have jumped if he was certain of getting drafted. 

Evans receiving stats look ok but Mixon had more in 1 year than Evans had his entire collegiate career

Maybe Evans has gotten better as he has matured or maybe his game is more suited for the pros, both are possibilities. But nothing in these stats suggest he is better than the two in front of him.

Plus Bengals are only rushing the ball 19 times a game on average and in the last 3 games when playing better Mixon has only averaged 12 carries a game. The game plan lately may be what is keeping Evans out. If they gave Evans a mere 5 carries a game in last 3 Mixon would only have 7 carries a game. 

Be patient and Evans will get his chance and the Bengals did cut 2 good RB's after pre-season imo, so leans in favor of your argument by Evans beating them out.

His fresh legs is the best thing he has going and that is a positive. Plus I will be the first to say that stats don't always tell the entire story and there are always many variables that have to be factored into the equation. So hope Evans kills it when getting the chance  

(10-26-2022, 10:25 AM)Go Cards Wrote: I just want to win and as said before am certain you will see Evans before the year is up. 

What the coaches are not seeing in practice who knows, but here are there college stats for reference  

yr....Evans.......................................................Perine.................................................Mixon

16....614 rush .....108  rec....4 TD's..........14...1,713 rush.....108 rec....21 TD's........15.....753 rush........356 rec....11 TD's
17....685 rush ......157 rec....7 TD's..........15...1,349 rush.....107 rec...17 TD's..........16...1,274 rush.....538 rec.....15 TD's
18....423 rush ......148 rec....5 TD's..........16...1,060 rush......106 rec...13 TD's.........17.......went pro
20....73 rush........87 rec......1 TD..............17........went pro.....................................18.........pro

......................Career

Evans  averaged 5.6 ypc,  9.8 per rec,  .... 4.25 TD's a year 
Mixon averaged .6.8 ypc, 13.8 per rec,.....13.0  TD's a year
Perine averaged .5.6 ypc,  8.0 per rec.......16.3 TD's a year

Evans took all 4 years to go pro as well even though his senior year was a covid year and he surely would have jumped if he was certain of getting drafted. 

Evans receiving stats look ok but Mixon had more in 1 year than Evans had his entire collegiate career

Maybe Evans has gotten better as he has matured or maybe his game is more suited for the pros, both are possibilities. But nothing in these stats suggest he is better than the two in front of him.

Plus Bengals are only rushing the ball 19 times a game on average and in the last 3 games when playing better Mixon has only averaged 12 carries a game. The game plan lately may be what is keeping Evans out. If they gave Evans a mere 5 carries a game in last 3 Mixon would only have 7 carries a game. 

Be patient and Evans will get his chance and the Bengals did cut 2 good RB's after pre-season imo, so leans in favor of your argument by Evans beating them out.

His fresh legs is the best thing he has going and that is a positive. Plus I will be the first to say that stats don't always tell the entire story and there are always many variables that have to be factored into the equation. So hope Evans kills it when getting the chance  

Comparing Oklahoma offense and Michigan offense is like trying to compare baseball to cricket. 

Oklahoma RBs always have crazy stats because their offensive was so good.
Kennedy Brooks (who?) Averaged 7ypc on 472 attempts
Tre Sermon averaged 6.5 on 455
Rodney Anderson 6.4 on 200
Alex Ross 6.4 on 123 carries.
Rhamondre Stevenson 7.2 on 165

For Michigan
in 2019 no one was over 5.1
In 2018 no one over 5.3
In 2017 no one over 6.1
In 2016 no one over 5.9 (except Evans who was 7.0)