(11-13-2022, 03:53 PM)Go Cards Wrote: A very good group of WR's no doubt, but don't see them being better than Chase, Higgins, and Boyd. 


Percentage of catches per targets..........Rec Yds per games played.........TD percentage per catch
 
Chad...............55%.....................................66.6 yds ....................................0.087
Hushpuppy......63%.....................................49.5 yds......................................0.070
Henry..............51%.....................................33.2 yds......................................0.176

Chase..............63%......................................85.3 yds.....................................0.148
Higgins............65%......................................65.7 yds......................................0.082
Boyd................68%......................................53.2 yds......................................0.065


Chad and company caught 56.3 of the balls thrown their way for 149.3 yds per game
Chase and company catch  65.3% of balls thrown their way for....204.0 yds per game 

Henry does have elite % of TD's per catches, but missed 49% of the passes thrown his way and only averaged 33 yds per game played. 

Have fond memories of all these WR's listed, but todays group is more professional, more productive, and more consistent, and much better blockers imo. Thats no knock on the others though because they were great as well, just not as great.   

You're looking at career averages and not the time that they actually played together. More specifically, like Essex said, 2005 and 2006 since after that Henry missed a lot of time. Plus our current trio has only been together 1.5 years so far. 

I do think our current trio is better but I think that's largely because Higgins is a lot better than Henry. TJ at that point of his career was as good or better than Boyd is currently. Chad at that point of his career was as good as Chase is now. 

Chad and TJ were a lot farther into their career than Chase and Higgins though. 

I think Henry got just about all this yardage from deep passes. I can't even remember ever getting a slot pass, considering he was so skinny that was maybe a good thing.

(11-13-2022, 04:10 PM)TheFan Wrote: You're looking at career averages and not the time that they actually played together. More specifically, like Essex said, 2005 and 2006 since after that Henry missed a lot of time. Plus our current trio has only been together 1.5 years so far. 

I do think our current trio is better but I think that's largely because Higgins is a lot better than Henry. TJ at that point of his career was as good or better than Boyd is currently. Chad at that point of his career was as good as Chase is now. 

Chad and TJ were a lot farther into their career than Chase and Higgins though. 

Had front row seats throughout their entire career and like them all a lot.

Plus the times weren't different really as some suggest, in Carson's the first 3 seasons when he was healthy still and played all 16 games
he threw 509, 520, 575 despite playing one less game even than nowadays. Did not count his year 1 because he did not play a full year. They were definitely a pass heavy offense. Burrow threw 520 times. 

So lets look, Chad and company only got 4 years together starting in 05. Will only factor in there first 3 years because their stats fall off so much in 08 that they only got 10 combined TD's as a group and want to give them a fair chance. Chase and company have only played 1 full year together so will go by that year even though Chase was a rookie and Tee was just in his 2nd year. Chad and TJ were much more seasoned in these 3 years but should be noted Henry was in his first three years but only played 4 total. 

in 05, 06, and 07 Chad and company averaged 

Chad........92 - 1,413 yds ......8 TD's..........Chase.....81 - 1,455 yds....13 TD's 
Housh......93 - 1,060 yds.......9 TD's...........Tee........74 - 1,091 yds......6 TD's
Henry.......29 - 456 yds..........5 TD's...........Boyd......67 - 828 yds.........5 TD's
..................................................................................................................
Total........214 - 2,929............22 TD's ...................222 - 3,374.............24 TD's 

So Chase had more yds  and 5 more TD's than Chad with 11 less receptions. By the way Chads most TD rec in any year was 10. 
Higgins had more yds than Housh with 19 less receptions yet had 3 less TD's, but again 19 less receptions. 
Henry did average the same # of TD's as Boyd in half the receptions which is impressive, but much less yds. 

Plus if you even tried to compare Chad's or TJ's rookie stats with Chase's or Higgins stats it would be very lopsided and laughable. So went with the time frame you suggested when they all played together. 

So the total amount of catches are similar with the current regime having only 8 more catches despite being targeted 15 less times than the old regime and has more yds and TD's as well.

Again more catches, more yds, and more TD's, in less targets.

Chad's group had 17 years of experience by the time factored and Chase's had 9 years with Boyd accounting for 6 of the 9 years. So their #1 and #2 WR only had 3 years experience between them compared to 14 by Chad and TJ.

Would also add that one squad is 3-1 in the playoffs and one never won a single game in the playoffs and two of the new regime are just starting their careers.  TJ did not even start playing well until his 4th season and Henry never really did equal his talent and maybe things change if he did. 

Think I will stick with my opinion that Chase, Higgins, and Boyd are better but that's not a slight on Chad and TJ who were great but rather to say just how elite this group is actually. Both regimes also had a #1 overall draft pick as QB but the 05-07 group had a much better O-line. 

(11-13-2022, 11:07 AM)Bengalitis Wrote: HENRY CHAD HOUZ best TRIO we've ever had. Short lived but unstoppable.

Yeah, not even close to the actual best 3.

(11-13-2022, 10:37 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Had front row seats throughout their entire career and like them all a lot.

Plus the times weren't different really as some suggest, in Carson's the first 3 seasons when he was healthy still and played all 16 games
he threw 509, 520, 575 despite playing one less game even than nowadays. Did not count his year 1 because he did not play a full year. They were definitely a pass heavy offense. Burrow threw 520 times. 

So lets look, Chad and company only got 4 years together starting in 05. Will only factor in there first 3 years because their stats fall off so much in 08 that they only got 10 combined TD's as a group and want to give them a fair chance. Chase and company have only played 1 full year together so will go by that year even though Chase was a rookie and Tee was just in his 2nd year. Chad and TJ were much more seasoned in these 3 years but should be noted Henry was in his first three years but only played 4 total. 

in 05, 06, and 07 Chad and company averaged 

Chad........92 - 1,413 yds ......8 TD's..........Chase.....81 - 1,455 yds....13 TD's 
Housh......93 - 1,060 yds.......9 TD's...........Tee........74 - 1,091 yds......6 TD's
Henry.......29 - 456 yds..........5 TD's...........Boyd......67 - 828 yds.........5 TD's
..................................................................................................................
Total........214 - 2,929............22 TD's ...................222 - 3,374.............24 TD's 

So Chase had more yds  and 5 more TD's than Chad with 11 less receptions. By the way Chads most TD rec in any year was 10. 
Higgins had more yds than Housh with 19 less receptions yet had 3 less TD's, but again 19 less receptions. 
Henry did average the same # of TD's as Boyd in half the receptions which is impressive, but much less yds. 

Plus if you even tried to compare Chad's or TJ's rookie stats with Chase's or Higgins stats it would be very lopsided and laughable. So went with the time frame you suggested when they all played together. 

So the total amount of catches are similar with the current regime having only 8 more catches despite being targeted 15 less times than the old regime and has more yds and TD's as well.

Again more catches, more yds, and more TD's, in less targets.

Chad's group had 17 years of experience by the time factored and Chase's had 9 years with Boyd accounting for 6 of the 9 years. So their #1 and #2 WR only had 3 years experience between them compared to 14 by Chad and TJ.

Would also add that one squad is 3-1 in the playoffs and one never won a single game in the playoffs and two of the new regime are just starting their careers.  TJ did not even start playing well until his 4th season and Henry never really did equal his talent and maybe things change if he did. 

Think I will stick with my opinion that Chase, Higgins, and Boyd are better but that's not a slight on Chad and TJ who were great but rather to say just how elite this group is actually. Both regimes also had a #1 overall draft pick as QB but the 05-07 group had a much better O-line. 

This stuff is kinda fun, but it's also silly. It's not like these guys are ever gonna face off, and they did play in different eras. They aren't that far apart, but I'll tell you that Chad, TJ, and Slim took hits to the dome that weren't flagged because they weren't illegal. I know Tee has gotten rocked in the head twice this season, I believe one of them was flagged.

Anyway... My take... Henry doesn't really belong in the discussion. He was fun to watch, and made some great plays. He was a matchup nightmare, but wasn't on the level of the 5 other guys in this conversation.

Chad is probably the best WR in Bengals history, but that crown is gonna be short lived. Injuries derailed AJ Green's claim at it, but Ja'Marr is coming. I'm not a stat guy, but pretty sure Ja'Marr just had the best WR season in franchise history before he could buy a beer.

TJ was a throwaway pick that might carve a notch playing special teams. He had a great 4 year run in Cincinnati, and had an above average career for an NFL player.

Tee Higgins should've never slipped to the 2nd round... Seriously; Henry Ruggs was drafted before him. The guy is gonna have a better career than TJ or Henry, and could approach Chad's numbers should be find himself in the right situation. I'd take Chad if we were in a pick-up game, and this is where the different eras come in.

Boyd should be better than TJ... He was a better prospect.

(11-14-2022, 12:13 AM)jason Wrote: This stuff is kinda fun, but it's also silly. It's not like these guys are ever gonna face off, and they did play in different eras. They aren't that far apart, but I'll tell you that Chad, TJ, and Slim took hits to the dome that weren't flagged because they weren't illegal. I know Tee has gotten rocked in the head twice this season, I believe one of them was flagged.

Anyway... My take... Henry doesn't really belong in the discussion. He was fun to watch, and made some great plays. He was a matchup nightmare, but wasn't on the level of the 5 other guys in this conversation.

Chad is probably the best WR in Bengals history, but that crown is gonna be short lived. Injuries derailed AJ Green's claim at it, but Ja'Marr is coming. I'm not a stat guy, but pretty sure Ja'Marr just had the best WR season in franchise history before he could buy a beer.

TJ was a throwaway pick that might carve a notch playing special teams. He had a great 4 year run in Cincinnati, and had an above average career for an NFL player.

Tee Higgins should've never slipped to the 2nd round... Seriously; Henry Ruggs was drafted before him. The guy is gonna have a better career than TJ or Henry, and could approach Chad's numbers should be find himself in the right situation. I'd take Chad if we were in a pick-up game, and this is where the different eras come in.

Boyd should be better than TJ... He was a better prospect.

Agree mostly but would take Chase first in a pick up game but Chad would definitely be 2nd. Don't really see the game changing that much in last 15 years. Now 25 to 50 years ago they were killing WR's and QB's. Most of TJ's catches were over the middle it seems but Palmer always threw it low where TJ was sliding down while making catch usually avoiding big hits. He was crafty like that. 

Now did see Chad take some big hits and to his credit kept on going. Nowadays the concussion protocol takes them out but don't think it's by the players choice. Believe most would keep playing as Chad did. 

Now I definitely like Chad, my buddy who went the games with me for 30 years bought him a hot dog for a sideline stunt and they became best friends. He came to shake hands after the Star Spangled banner was played for every game in 09 and gave us 3 TD balls, another game ball, his cleats, and gloves. Had TJ take our phones and snap a pic of him and us. Still plays Fortnite with my buddy and mentions him in tweets to this day. The last time was during pre-season when he referenced the hot dog stunt. 

You're right though that Chase will have to have longevity to surpass him, but believe he is slightly better if he does and will probably be in HOF if he lasts as long as Chad imo. Yet Chad still has the best foot control that  Ive ever seen live and is incredible in his own right. Plus we all should feel indebted to him for buying all those tickets to keep games from being blacked out in down years. 

(11-14-2022, 12:38 AM)Go Cards Wrote: Agree mostly but would take Chase first in a pick up game but Chad would definitely be 2nd. Don't really see the game changing that much in last 15 years. Now 25 to 50 years ago they were killing WR's and QB's. Most of TJ's catches were over the middle it seems but Palmer always threw it low where TJ was sliding down while making catch usually avoiding big hits. He was crafty like that. 

Now did see Chad take some big hits and to his credit kept on going. Nowadays the concussion protocol takes them out but don't think it's by the players choice. Believe most would keep playing as Chad did. 

Now I definitely like Chad, my buddy who went the games with me for 30 years bought him a hot dog for a sideline stunt and they became best friends. He came to shake hands after the Star Spangled banner was played for every game in 09 and gave us 3 TD balls, another game ball, his cleats, and gloves. Had TJ take our phones and snap a pic of him and us. Still plays Fortnite with my buddy and mentions him in tweets to this day. The last time was during pre-season when he referenced the hot dog stunt. 

You're right though that Chase will have to have longevity to surpass him, but believe he is slightly better if he does and will probably be in HOF if he lasts as long as Chad imo. Yet Chad still has the best foot control that  Ive ever seen live and is incredible in his own right. Plus we all should feel indebted to him for buying all those tickets to keep games from being blacked out in down years. 

Oh for sure... I'd take Chase first. I was talking Chad vs Tee.

Bottom line; all 6 of the players in this discussion (and AJ for that matter) are my boys. We've been spoiled by WRs.

(11-14-2022, 01:02 AM)jason Wrote: Oh for sure... I'd take Chase first. I was talking Chad vs Tee.

Bottom line; all 6 of the players in this discussion (and AJ for that matter) are my boys. We've been spoiled by WRs.

Absolutely have been spoiled with WR's 

 and believe Isaac Curtis who we have not included per talking about the groups of 3 would also be in the conversation with Chase, Chad, and AJ imho. Eddie Brown and Carl Pickens were formidable as well.  Get in the red zone and just throwing a jump ball to Pickens was virtually unstoppable. Too bad he never played on a good team. 

sorry, didnt meant to turn this thread 3 vs 3 whe it's a memorial thread on Henry. it should be 3 vs 4 since this team finally has a formidable TE, Hurst. what a weapon this guy turned out to be...

Nostalgia and the fact he has passe makes people remember Henry as better than he was. In all reality, he would be lucky to be in the top 10 Bengals receivers. Better than Chase...... LMAO,that's just nonsense.

Off the top of my head, Henry has these people in front of him, in no particular order.... Isaac Curtis, Carl Pickens, Chris Collinsworth (yeah, I said it), AJ Green, Chad Johnson, Jamar Chase, Tee Higgins, TJ Whosyourmama, Tim McGee, Darnay Scott, Eddie Brown. May be a couple I'm forgetting.

Henry reminds me of Aaron Hernandez. All the talent God gave him, and he couldn't quit being a thug long enough to enjoy the life his talent would have afforded him to live.

(11-15-2022, 10:50 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Nostalgia and the fact he has passe makes people remember Henry as better than he was. In all reality, he would be lucky to be in the top 10 Bengals receivers. Better than Chase...... LMAO,that's just nonsense.

Off the top of my head, Henry has these people in front of him, in no particular order.... Isaac Curtis, Carl Pickens, Chris Collinsworth (yeah, I said it), AJ Green, Chad Johnson, Jamar Chase, Tee Higgins, TJ Whosyourmama, Tim McGee, Darnay Scott, Eddie Brown. May be a couple I'm forgetting.

Henry reminds me of Aaron Hernandez. All the talent God gave him, and he couldn't quit being a thug long enough to enjoy the life his talent would have afforded him to live.

Bad take bro. Murderer, vs someone who was actively trying to turn his life around. Not even close. You been around a while, and this might be the worst post of all.

One died in an accident, the other went to prison for murder then decided to take his own life.

(11-15-2022, 12:00 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: Bad take bro.  Murderer, vs someone who was actively trying to turn his life around.  Not even close.  You been around a while, and this might be the worst post of all.

One died in an accident, the other went to prison for murder then decided to take his own life.

Re read my post. All I said was neither could quit breaking the law long enough to.be NFL greats. Yes, Hernandez was a murderer amd way worse than Henry, but Henry was a consistent drug user who couldn't put the pot pipe down long enough to have an NFL career and was in the middle of a domestic dispute when he died.