(02-02-2023, 11:01 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: No way on Hurst.. he is not that valuable to our offense for that price.. let him walk like we did CJ if he wants anything over 3 year 18 million

Wasn't Hurst getting like 6 Mil this year?  I think If he signs for 3 year 21 mil, it would work.  

(02-02-2023, 10:51 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Bell is way more important than Hurst .. if we tag anyone it would be him, especially if we let Bates go, im sure we don;t want to lose both safeties in same year

Not saying Hurst is more important than Bell, Bell is the main person I want back.
But $14 mill is way too much for Bell.

(02-02-2023, 11:12 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Wasn't Hurst getting like 6 Mil this year?  I think If he signs for 3 year 21 mil, it would work.  

Hurst signed for only $3.5 mill on a prove-it deal.

He's worth double that.

(02-02-2023, 11:22 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Hurst signed for only $3.5 mill on a prove-it deal.

He's worth double that.

Well, I think Musgrave, Kraft, or even Washington would look great in stripes.  I like Hurst and think he was more productive compared to CJ.  I don't know if he is worth 7-8 mil per though.  

(02-02-2023, 11:12 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Wasn't Hurst getting like 6 Mil this year?  I think If he signs for 3 year 21 mil, it would work.  

he was on a 1 year 3.5 M, and no way im doubling the salary for a TE that was near the bottom of YPC and only had 5 catches that went for over 20 yards.  We need to look for more speed TE that can open the middle of the field up... if we let C.J walk for 24 M, i let Hurst walk if he wanted 21 to 24 m also.

(02-02-2023, 08:49 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: If these projections are close, some are doable IMO.

Bengals in the Top 100 with contract projections:

Bates: 5-$75M (40M GTD)
Bell: 3-$22M (13.25M GTD)
Pratt: 3-$24.75M (14.75M GTD)
Hurst: 3-$28.5M (17M GTD) https://t.co/yAybRpBZET

— Andrew Russell (@Andrew_Russell7) February 2, 2023

Bell at that price seems reasonable. The others seem too rich. Apple had a good run, but failed to cover Valdez-Scantling-a guy who is basically Cody Core. Great players, I loved watching them, but I could say the same about Uzomah and Carl Lawson. 

(02-02-2023, 11:21 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Not saying Hurst is more important than Bell, Bell is the main person I want back.
But $14 mill is way too much for Bell.

The tag is too rich for Bell for sure, but the contract projections posted have him at 3 years $22 million which seems very doable for him to me. 

Heck I did not even want to tag Bates at that price last year after some incredible playoff performances even.

Tags are the top 5 average right? I no way is Hurst a top 5 TE. Would love him back, but still. Unless someone else wants to pay him all that I could definitely see him back.

(02-03-2023, 12:26 AM)Bilbo Saggins Wrote: Bell at that price seems reasonable. The others seem too rich. Apple had a good run, but failed to cover Valdez-Scantling-a guy who is basically Cody Core. Great players, I loved watching them, but I could say the same about Uzomah and Carl Lawson. 

I don't know, I am done with Apple.  I do not like trash talkers.  It doesn't help the cause.  

(02-03-2023, 01:27 AM)Go Cards Wrote: The tag is too rich for Bell for sure, but the contract projections posted have him at 3 years $22 million which seems very doable for him to me. 

Yea it all comes down to what he's willing to take for a long-term deal.
If Bengals feel it might be near the tag price, it may justify using the tag on him.
I don't think he will command anywhere near the tag price for APY for a new contract though.
I think it will be $10 mill or less APY.

(02-02-2023, 11:27 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Well, I think Musgrave, Kraft, or even Washington would look great in stripes.  I like Hurst and think he was more productive compared to CJ.  I don't know if he is worth 7-8 mil per though.  

I've not looked into Musgrave, but after looking at him now, I see he probably would have been in for a big receiving year had he been able to play more than just a couple games. He put up 169 yards in just those two games, he can block, and he has ideal TE size.

Kraft maybe as a late-round pick, but I've heard he's really raw. I'd rather find someone a little more polished if that's the case.

Washington is a great fit. I could see him being a candidate in Rd 1 or Rd 2.
If he puts up at the Combine, it probably will require that 1st round pick.

Hurst can be a solid 3rd option in an offense. He's not more than that.
That's worth $7-8 mill APY nowadays.
I wouldn't go higher than what Uzomah signed with the Jets for though.

(02-03-2023, 01:50 AM)CarolinaBengalFanGuy Wrote: Tags are the top 5 average right? I no way is Hurst a top 5 TE. Would love him back, but still. Unless someone else wants to pay him all that I could definitely see him back.

Top-5 cap hits averaged over the last 5 years.

I don't expect the Bengals to us the tag this year.

(02-02-2023, 11:38 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: he was on a 1 year 3.5 M, and no way im doubling the salary for a TE that was near the bottom of YPC and only had 5 catches that went for over 20 yards.  We need to look for more speed TE that can open the middle of the field up... if we let C.J walk for 24 M, i let Hurst walk if he wanted 21 to 24 m also.

Whoever the Bengals get at TE, that player has to be able to block.
As much as I'd love a good pass-catching TE, I've come to accept that blocking is a higher priority for the TE in this offense.

(02-03-2023, 12:26 AM)Bilbo Saggins Wrote: Bell at that price seems reasonable. The others seem too rich. Apple had a good run, but failed to cover Valdez-Scantling-a guy who is basically Cody Core. Great players, I loved watching them, but I could say the same about Uzomah and Carl Lawson. 

(02-03-2023, 02:38 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: I don't know, I am done with Apple.  I do not like trash talkers.  It doesn't help the cause.  

We must look past Eli's trash talking.  Looking solely at our team and its needs now and in the future, personnel priority is performance that far exceeds price.

No player can match Eli, under 4M and played CB1 for 10 straight wins.

And to say "failed to cover Valdez-Scantling" is beyond silly.  Eli was not man up on MVS the entire game.  He scored on Hilton after Bates left his spot.  

(02-02-2023, 06:57 PM)ochocincos Wrote: https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/nfl-sets-franchise-transition-tags-for-2023/ar-AA16V3ja

Some ones that will apply to Bengals:
- Safety (Bell): $14.46mill, $11.87mill TT
- TE (Hurst): $11.36mill FT, $9.72mill TT
- LB (Pratt): $20.93mill FT, $17.48mill TT

Note that Bates will be higher than the listed safety tag because he was already tagged this past season.

its a 20% increase if tagged 2x in a row right?

(02-03-2023, 02:38 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: I don't know, I am done with Apple.  I do not like trash talkers.  It doesn't help the cause.  

But his play on the Field has helped us alot the last 2 season

(02-03-2023, 02:27 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: its a 20% increase if tagged 2x in a row right?

Yes

(02-03-2023, 02:28 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: But his play on the Field has helped us alot the last 2 season

This is one of the better cornerback classes in the draft I've seen in the last few years.  The Bengals could find someone better than Eli Apple in the fourth or fifth round. I think they have to sign Bell to a multi-year deal. They can't have a need at safety and cornerback. 

(02-02-2023, 11:21 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Not saying Hurst is more important than Bell, Bell is the main person I want back.
But $14 mill is way too much for Bell.

(02-03-2023, 12:26 AM)Bilbo Saggins Wrote: Bell at that price seems reasonable. The others seem too rich. Apple had a good run, but failed to cover Valdez-Scantling-a guy who is basically Cody Core. Great players, I loved watching them, but I could say the same about Uzomah and Carl Lawson. 

(02-03-2023, 01:27 AM)Go Cards Wrote: The tag is too rich for Bell for sure, but the contract projections posted have him at 3 years $22 million which seems very doable for him to me. 

(02-03-2023, 01:00 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Yea it all comes down to what he's willing to take for a long-term deal.
If Bengals feel it might be near the tag price, it may justify using the tag on him.
I don't think he will command anywhere near the tag price for APY for a new contract though.
I think it will be $10 mill or less APY.

Bell is absolutely our #1 priority of the re-signs.  We have no back up SS.  No Tycen Anderson isnt it, at least not yet.  With Lou's adjustments, assuming he returns, we desperately need Bell for that complicated system.  $7-8M per is my number, if he wants more we must pick up a vet. Dax did not get nearly enough reps at safety, having 2 very young guys as our last line of defense could be a major problem.