Play calling is infinitely more difficult when an offensive line gets beaten up in the trenches by the defensive line.

(09-17-2023, 07:31 PM)KyBengalfan94 Wrote: That' another thing.  Where is the play action?  It doesn't exist!   Play action passes have been completely deleted by this non sense of always snapping from the shotgun.  Then they cut La'El Collins for Jonah Williams for f*** sake!  I know Collins is still hurt but he's better than Williams and about half the price.  Would have been some nice depth come playoff time if they get there.  

NOPE... can't have that sh*T

"completely deleted ",  we did do some play action from under center, I can remember a couple off the top of my head.  And we have no idea what is up with LC, it is stupid to act as if any of us (you) do. 

(11-12-2023, 10:58 PM)PCB Bengal Fan Wrote:  the QB draw play was ludicris. 

QB draw was actually the perfect play call.  Oline was simply beat.

The Bengals aren't very scheme-reliant like the Texans and other teams that will heavily use play-action and try to create easy throws for their QB.

They rely on Burrow and Chase to be superheroes. They're slow at RB, WR, TE and OL. Those guys all need scheme help. https://t.co/tnwod9KeoC

— Goodberry (@JoeGoodberry) November 13, 2023

I was sort of disappointed seeing Burrow out of the shotgun virtually the entire game.It was fun to watch when he went under Center and using effective play action against the SF forty niners.The Offense was hitting on all cylinders in that game.

It may just be me, but why does it seem like every other team throws to the first down marker, and if the WR makes the catch it's a first down, and we always seem to throw just short of the 1st down marker, then make the WR or TE try to get a yard or two on the ground, which they often don't.

(11-14-2023, 10:22 AM)Sled21 Wrote: It may just be me, but why does it seem like every other team throws to the first down marker, and if the WR makes the catch it's a first down, and we always seem to throw just short of the 1st down marker, then make the WR or TE try to get a yard or two on the ground, which they often don't.

I 100% see other teams throw short as well.

It's all timing.

Guess we're lucky we're not the Bills. Just went to their forum to see the responses to being so badly outcoached last night. Of course, they want to get rid of their coaches. And they have had some of the most painful losses imaginable, including a couple that have their own name, like "13 seconds." Here is one post that shows their anguish:

"This is so messed up. Literally traumatized. For life. We should file a trillion dollar class action lawsuit for pain and suffering over the last 30 years. Days like this make me wish the bills moved to Toronto so I could have been done with them then. Liking this team is a sickness."

(11-14-2023, 10:22 AM)Sled21 Wrote: It may just be me, but why does it seem like every other team throws to the first down marker, and if the WR makes the catch it's a first down, and we always seem to throw just short of the 1st down marker, then make the WR or TE try to get a yard or two on the ground, which they often don't.

There is actually data on this. It's mostly just you. When Burrow drops back, he throws the ball short of the first down marker 60% percent of the time, eighth most in the league. Kansas City is actually even higher, throwing it short of the first down marker 63% of the time. Houston does it the least at 46% of the time. The average is roughly 58% of the time, so Cincinnati is just slightly above league average in this regard. 

On these same plays, Cincinnati converts it into a first down 20% of the time. League average is 20%, also. The lowest is PIT at 15% and the highest is SF at 27%.

I still say we need to stop doing the play calling by committee approach. They can keep doing what they've been doing for opening drives 'cause that's working great. But, play calling in-game needs to go to 1 individual who will be responsible and if the offense doesn't improve or gets worse, than the job goes to someone else.

In no way am I a ZT play calling "defender", but I think it's important to look at the context in which each game is called.

Against the Texans, we were down a TON of offensive personel. Chase was banged up and limited, no Higgins, Chase Brown, Charlie Jones, Yoshi missed 3/4 of the game. Callahan came out and said they didn't move Chase around much because of the lack of prep and practice time throughout the week.

Also, people want to complain about how we don't throw the ball "vertically" down the field. That's more on recievers getting open and Burrow finding them and pulling the trigger than it is on the "play calling".

My ONE criticism of Burrow is that his play style has become a bit conservative over the years. He doesn't push the ball until he needs to. Some of this is the by product of him having a good defense and him trusting it. You saw it against the Titans. After we got the initial lead he was super convservative and actually passed up taking chances on pretty wide open explosive plays to dump it off to the flat. In the second half he started pushing the ball because he needed to.

Again, people complain about "play calling" but you really do need to watch the film and understand the context of each game and play to understand just what is exactly going on.

The Texans were missing way more players than us.

(11-13-2023, 02:54 AM)casear2727 Wrote: QB draw was actually the perfect play call.  Oline was simply beat.

How is it a perfect play call if there is no hole & he lost a yard or 2? It's only a perfect play call if he gains 15 yards or scores. Your definition of perfect is weird or you're a but but but if if if guy.

(11-14-2023, 02:09 PM)PCB Bengal Fan Wrote: How is it a perfect play call if there is no hole & he lost a yard or 2? It's only a perfect play call if he gains 15 yards or scores. Your definition of perfect is weird or you're a but but but if if if guy.

Burrow checked into it....he had the proper read, his oline failed to execute it.

(11-14-2023, 02:48 PM)Wyche Wrote: Burrow checked into it....he had the proper read, his oline failed to execute it.

Yep

(11-14-2023, 02:09 PM)PCB Bengal Fan Wrote: How is it a perfect play call if there is no hole & he lost a yard or 2? It's only a perfect play call if he gains 15 yards or scores. Your definition of perfect is weird or you're a but but but if if if guy.

(11-14-2023, 03:07 PM)casear2727 Wrote: It is only a perfect play call if it works?    What an amateur.

It was the PERFECT call.  Your lack of ball knowledge is impressive, please continue with the ignorant takes and snarky remarks while embarrassing yourself.

(11-14-2023, 11:38 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: In no way am I a ZT play calling "defender", but I think it's important to look at the context in which each game is called.

Against the Texans, we were down a TON of offensive personel. Chase was banged up and limited, no Higgins, Chase Brown, Charlie Jones, Yoshi missed 3/4 of the game. Callahan came out and said they didn't move Chase around much because of the lack of prep and practice time throughout the week.

Also, people want to complain about how we don't throw the ball "vertically" down the field. That's more on recievers getting open and Burrow finding them and pulling the trigger than it is on the "play calling".

My ONE criticism of Burrow is that his play style has become a bit conservative over the years. He doesn't push the ball until he needs to. Some of this is the by product of him having a good defense and him trusting it. You saw it against the Titans. After we got the initial lead he was super convservative and actually passed up taking chances on pretty wide open explosive plays to dump it off to the flat. In the second half he started pushing the ball because he needed to.

Again, people complain about "play calling" but you really do need to watch the film and understand the context of each game and play to understand just what is exactly going on.

So are you saying that Burrow was... coached out of being as aggressive as he used to be?

(11-14-2023, 11:14 AM)KillerGoose Wrote: There is actually data on this. It's mostly just you. When Burrow drops back, he throws the ball short of the first down marker 60% percent of the time, eighth most in the league. Kansas City is actually even higher, throwing it short of the first down marker 63% of the time. Houston does it the least at 46% of the time. The average is roughly 58% of the time, so Cincinnati is just slightly above league average in this regard. 

On these same plays, Cincinnati converts it into a first down 20% of the time. League average is 20%, also. The lowest is PIT at 15% and the highest is SF at 27%.

Interesting. Is that third down or every down?

(11-14-2023, 11:38 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: In no way am I a ZT play calling "defender", but I think it's important to look at the context in which each game is called.

Against the Texans, we were down a TON of offensive personel. Chase was banged up and limited, no Higgins, Chase Brown, Charlie Jones, Yoshi missed 3/4 of the game. Callahan came out and said they didn't move Chase around much because of the lack of prep and practice time throughout the week.

Also, people want to complain about how we don't throw the ball "vertically" down the field. That's more on recievers getting open and Burrow finding them and pulling the trigger than it is on the "play calling".

My ONE criticism of Burrow is that his play style has become a bit conservative over the years. He doesn't push the ball until he needs to. Some of this is the by product of him having a good defense and him trusting it. You saw it against the Titans. After we got the initial lead he was super convservative and actually passed up taking chances on pretty wide open explosive plays to dump it off to the flat. In the second half he started pushing the ball because he needed to.

Again, people complain about "play calling" but you really do need to watch the film and understand the context of each game and play to understand just what is exactly going on.

(11-14-2023, 06:50 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: So are you saying that Burrow was... coached out of being as aggressive as he used to be?

The onset of predominantly deep cover 2 has played an integral role in Joe’s diminished aggressiveness. Also he came from LSU where it was aggressive as hell as they could be. The script so far is simple. Joe’s calf injury got them off to a slow start, our rush defense yards per attempt was #5 last year and is #31 this year, our scoring offense 7th last year 20th this year, scoring defense 5th last year and 16th last year. The whole lot of them aren’t playing well.

(11-14-2023, 09:04 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Interesting. Is that third down or every down?

Every down and distance.