(11-17-2023, 10:37 AM)jj22 Wrote: It's time to quit suspending and banning posters for speaking the truth and suspend and ban those posters who demand positivity and dictate which arguments are legit and which aren't. They are the one's that have been wrong more often then not the last two decades. Joe has been hurt. His arm was wrapped a couple weeks ago after the SF game and folks shot down anyone who brought it up for being negative drama queens after a win..... yet we were right once again.

Here's the truth that's been said and it's time for folks around here to face... Joe Luck has the body of a 50 year old. The beatings have taken there toll. He is injury prone, has been yearly since 2016, he can't stay healthy, and it's only going to get worse in the following seasons as his body continues to break down. We are stuck with him for the next 7 years, and these injury issues/story will be repeated over and over again over those 7 years. This contract may end up being worse than the Watson contract.

This team's moment has passed, the window is closed, and we have questions at QB, WR, TE, RB, OLine, DL, CB, S, HC, OC, DC...... Nothing that will be fixed in 1 offseason. A rebuild is needed with some youth and speed. This team looks fat off of "success" and doesn't have the energy or the drive that you seen when they were trying to prove themselves.

We weren't witnessing a dynasty in the making the last two years. This isn't the Brady Patriots or the Mahomes Chiefs. It was the 2009 / 2010 JETS and we all know how that "dynasty" ended.

No, it's not. 

They still have a lot of good pieces and a shit ton of cap room for next year. They can address pieces in FA. 

(11-17-2023, 10:47 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: For the bad OL play yes.  But everyone within the bengals organization is in question.  You need to protect players from themselves.  

I sprained my wrist (above the wrist “bone”, below my pinky) last year that is still not back to full strength .  I went down the X-ray, mri, multiple cortisone shots, etc.  

I had hardly enough strength and stability to hold a frying pan.  Hitting a golf ball sent radiating pain through my arm.  Luckily it was my left, not dominate hand.

This is no small thing, wrists are sooooo tricky with so many bones/ligaments enter twined, especially as you get closer up into the hand, and judging by the swelling this is in that area.  

Considering this is on his throwing hand, and the location of the perceived injury… which you can diagnose the location pretty simply with simple hand movement tests… this was always going to be the outcome.

Long story short, the bad performance of the OL is on Frank.  The decision is on the entire bengals organization.

It's the same thing with the calf. He really shouldn't have been out there weeks 1-2 playing. It's malpractice. 

Burrow is a 270 million dollar investment. Idk if he wants to play, someone in the organization needs to step up and have the balls to protect this man from himself. 

(11-17-2023, 11:01 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: No, it's not. 

They still have a lot of good pieces and a shit ton of cap room for next year. They can address pieces in FA. 

Which one of those positions / coaches do we not have questions about?

Did you see how slow the team looked? 

Did you see the lack of energy and confidence? Drive and urgency the last two weeks? They look like they've arrived, they don't look like they are out to prove themselves. You can see that in their body language and their play compared to opposing teams. 

Opposing teams with less talent are playing up, above their potential. Backups! Bengals act like those teams should treat them like teams treated the Patriots going in feeling defeated. It ain't working. Bengals aren't playing like they are hungry. They are playing fat and full and entitled to victory based on reputation.

and they are getting their lunch handed to them in the process.

Now the league is looking into why they didn't list Burrow on the injury list, but people are saying it's an IPad glove, so I don't know

Well, I'm probably not going to sit around all week for the rest of the season in anticipation of the next game..That's a relief anyway. Time is gonna fly a little faster. 
I'll look forward to Go Reds! in anticipation of the next starting pitching staff getting Tommy John surgery instead..

(11-17-2023, 11:03 AM)jj22 Wrote: Which one of those positions / coaches do we not have questions about?

Did you see how slow the team looked? 

Did you see the lack of energy and confidence? Drive and urgency the last two weeks? They look like they've arrived, they don't look like they are out to prove themselves. You can see that in their body language and their play compared to opposing teams. 

Opposing teams with less talent are playing up, above their potential. Backups! Bengals act like those teams should treat them like teams treated the Patriots going in feeling defeated. It ain't working. Bengals aren't playing like they are hungry. They are playing  fat and full and entitled to victory based on reputation.

and they are getting their lunch handed to them in the process.

Man, what are you even talking about? 

Everyone was flying high on this team just two weeks ago. Now we lose two straight (without some of our best players) and everyone wants to blow it up? 

Sorry, but thats an overreaction. Do I think this team has some holes? Yes - mainly the OL and that unit and a couple pieces on defense. You can add to it though and fix it. The window is certainly not "closed". 

(11-17-2023, 11:17 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Man, what are you even talking about? 

Everyone was flying high on this team just two weeks ago. Now we lose two straight (without some of our best players) and everyone wants to blow it up? 

Sorry, but thats an overreaction. Do I think this team has some holes? Yes - mainly the OL and that unit and a couple pieces on defense. You can add to it though and fix it. The window is certainly not "closed". 

Is it? and were we? They started 1-3, they only have 1 win in the AFC in 10 games. 1. The NFCW outside of SF sucks but SF was in a slump. Who was flying high but the same o'le posters who somehow are still flying high this morning? Can we trust their assessment of team? They have dictated this board but many of us knew better an saw through it. We have holes everywhere. I'll ask again which one's did I list that you disagreed with and I can tell you why I listed them.....

(11-17-2023, 10:37 AM)jj22 Wrote: It's time to quit suspending and banning posters for speaking the truth and suspend and ban those posters who demand positivity and dictate which arguments are legit and which aren't. They are the one's that have been wrong more often then not the last two decades. Joe has been hurt. His arm was wrapped a couple weeks ago after the SF game and folks shot down anyone who brought it up for being negative drama queens after a win..... yet we were right once again.

Here's the truth that's been said and it's time for folks around here to face... Joe Luck has the body of a 50 year old. The beatings have taken their toll. He is injury prone, has been yearly since 2016, he can't stay healthy, and it's only going to get worse in the following seasons as his body continues to break down. We are stuck with him for the next 7 years, and these injury issues/story will be repeated over and over again over those 7 years. This contract may end up being worse than the Watson contract.

This team's moment has passed, the window is closed, and we have questions at QB, WR, TE, RB, OLine, DL, CB, S, HC, OC, DC...... Nothing that will be fixed in 1 offseason. A rebuild is needed with some youth and speed. This team looks fat off of "success" and doesn't have the energy or the drive that you seen when they were trying to prove themselves.

We weren't witnessing a dynasty in the making the last two years. This isn't the Brady Patriots or the Mahomes Chiefs. It was the 2009 / 2010 JETS and we all know how that "dynasty" ended.

Never change.

(11-17-2023, 01:44 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Lol, IF that was true that would mean that either Burrow was wearing a wrist brace for fashion on the same wrist he ended up hurting, or Zac is completely unaware of what's going on with his own franchise QB.

Well, he was a full participant on Tuesday, correct? I saw video of him in practice throwing the ball and running the offense. It's the short turnaround week, everyone is dinged a little. I may be mistaken, but I think his official designation before game time was probable. If that's the case, they covered their bases. Him practicing Tuesday and listed as full should make this a nothing burger.

(11-17-2023, 11:17 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Man, what are you even talking about? 

Everyone was flying high on this team just two weeks ago. Now we lose two straight (without some of our best players) and everyone wants to blow it up? 

Sorry, but thats an overreaction. Do I think this team has some holes? Yes - mainly the OL and that unit and a couple pieces on defense. You can add to it though and fix it. The window is certainly not "closed". 

I think he is talking about how the Bengals look flat and a step behind on both sides of the ball since the SF game. And I agree 100%. They DO look flat and out of sync as seen in the Texans and Raven losses. Something is way off. Our D secondary with so much supposed speed is getting beaten with our DB's nowhere close to the ball. Our O has trouble getting snaps off before clock runs out and our Oline looks terrible. JB is taking way to many hits even when he gets a pass off  and receivers not getting open. Last night they burned 2 timeouts unable to get a play off and the one where Burrow was yelling at our receiver which side to line up on. UN-organized on both sides of the LOS.

(11-17-2023, 11:17 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Man, what are you even talking about? 

Everyone was flying high on this team just two weeks ago. Now we lose two straight (without some of our best players) and everyone wants to blow it up? 

Sorry, but thats an overreaction. Do I think this team has some holes? Yes - mainly the OL and that unit and a couple pieces on defense. You can add to it though and fix it. The window is certainly not "closed". 

Yeah agree with this. We've had our QB fairly injured for 5 of our 10 games, and we're still 5-5. In the games he's clearly been close to 100%, we've gone 4-1. The schedule here on out was tough, but we would've been in those games by and large. The secondary has been the drop off for me, a year extra experience for those guys in itself should see that group improve, and I'd like to see us add to it in the offseason.

OL Im not convinced we'll ever fix, feels like we've been trying for a decade plus at this point. We also need to find a run game from somewhere.

(11-17-2023, 12:06 PM)TheCincinnatiKid Wrote: Yeah agree with this. We've had our QB fairly injured for 5 of our 10 games, and we're still 5-5. In the games he's clearly been close to 100%, we've gone 4-1. The schedule here on out was tough, but we would've been in those games by and large. The secondary has been the drop off for me, a year extra experience for those guys in itself should see that group improve, and I'd like to see us add to it in the offseason.

OL Im not convinced we'll ever fix, feels like we've been trying for a decade plus at this point. We also need to find a run game from somewhere.

People are overreacting. The bengals aren’t 5-5 if Burrow starts the year healthy. They’re most likely 7-3 or better. So when Burrow is healthy, this is still a 1st place tier, absolute playoff team

But people won’t relax and use their brain

(11-17-2023, 11:17 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Man, what are you even talking about? 

Everyone was flying high on this team just two weeks ago. Now we lose two straight (without some of our best players) and everyone wants to blow it up? 

Sorry, but thats an overreaction. Do I think this team has some holes? Yes - mainly the OL and that unit and a couple pieces on defense. You can add to it though and fix it. The window is certainly not "closed". 

I'm on the negative boat. I can certainly see both sides. I think the problem for the negative folks is the Bengals can certainly fix some issues in the off-season. But the list is growing and it's hard to trust this organization to make the correct needed moves.

(11-17-2023, 11:08 AM)sloSTI Wrote: Now the league is looking into why they didn't list Burrow on the injury list, but people are saying it's an IPad glove, so I don't know

Who knows… there is something called an iPad “drawing glove” and he was holding some sort of tablet. Knowing (not literally) joe burrow, he very well may have drawing as a hobby, or more likely, if he was drawing, it would be drawing plays.

If that’s the case, then the bengals deleting their post spoke this into existence.

(11-17-2023, 12:08 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: People are overreacting. The bengals aren’t 5-5 if Burrow starts the year healthy. They’re most likely 7-3 or better. So when Burrow is healthy, this is still a 1st place tier, absolute playoff team

But people won’t relax and use their brain

Yep I agree. Like I said Burrow has been quite clearly limited in 5 of our 10 games. We're 4-1 when he looks like he's not struggling with the calf this year. The idea we've 'fallen off a cliff' is just silly. The defence has certainly regressed though, im not saying we're as good as we were last year, but we'd have certainly been in the division race etc.

(11-17-2023, 12:08 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: People are overreacting. The bengals aren’t 5-5 if Burrow starts the year healthy. They’re most likely 7-3 or better. So when Burrow is healthy, this is still a 1st place tier, absolute playoff team

But people won’t relax and use their brain

The problem is Burrow will never be healthy! That is what folks seem to be slow to realize. He's injury prone and has been injured every year since 2016.

Sure if Burrow's health could be trusted he will cover for all those issues. The problem is we'll be saying if Burrow is healthy ..... for the next 7 years ....

(11-17-2023, 12:11 PM)TheCincinnatiKid Wrote: Yep I agree. Like I said Burrow has been quite clearly limited in 5 of our 10 games. We're 4-1 when he looks like he's not struggling with the calf this year. The idea we've 'fallen off a cliff' is just silly. The defence has certainly regressed though, im not saying we're as good as we were last year, but we'd have certainly been in the division race etc.

The defense always hits the next level come playoff time. Lou’s defense is never elite during the regular season.

Plus we should’ve seen this coming with Bell, Bates, and even Apple leaving

If Burrow gets healthy, and the bengals get in the playoffs, I still have no doubt the defense will step up like they most always do in the post season

The Oline is the big disappointment to me. They sign Collins which didn't work, They sign Cappa, Karras and OBJ and I thought good, a solid line even with the rook Volson but they are not playing well together like me and I think others expected. Cappa, Karras and OBJ all have rings which I would think brings some experience with it but it isn't working here. This Oline isn't playing much better if any than the losing SB Oline.

(11-17-2023, 12:08 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: People are overreacting. The bengals aren’t 5-5 if Burrow starts the year healthy. They’re most likely 7-3 or better. So when Burrow is healthy, this is still a 1st place tier, absolute playoff team

But people won’t relax and use their brain

No they don’t. Right now 7-3 would be about right.

(11-17-2023, 12:14 PM)jj22 Wrote: The problem is Burrow will never be healthy! That is what folks seem to be slow to realize. He's injury prone and has been injured every year since 2016.

Sure if Burrow's health could be trusted he will cover for all those issues. The problem is we'll be saying if Burrow is healthy for the next 7 years ....

He just has to be healthy enough, and he was healthy enough in 21 and 22

If something like this happens again in 24, then I will really be worried