If we lost out and stay at 5 wins, things could swing in our favor for draft position.

There are only 4 teams with less than 4 wins (patriots, panthers, bears, cardinals).

With Murray back with the cardinals they could win a few more, but who knows? I don’t expect us leapfrogging these 4 teams.

There are 6 four win teams above us in the draft order (jets, chargers, bucs, titans, giants, commanders).

Out of this group I think the commanders likely don’t win many more games after trading their best defensive players away. The giants also look bad and have a lot of injuries.

Otherwise the jets, chargers, titans, and bucs are talented teams and should pass below us in the draft order.

The packers, rams, saints, and raiders have 5 wins and are below us in the standings right now, but they are talented and should win more than us down the stretch.


I’m fully expecting us to drop from the 15 spot to pick 7, which would be great draft position to improve the team going into next year.

With our remaining schedule I really don’t see us with a chance to beat anyone except for the Steelers and maybe Indy. If we lose out I know it’s not great for morale, but I really think it will be best for the team long term as it will force the coaches and management to reflect, make changes, and improve the team.

Who do you think we can grab at pick 7? I’m hoping to see us grab an offensive lineman or defensive lineman.

Im tired of all the wide receiver picks. You can draft wideouts much lower with a high success rate. Lineman are harder to draft lower on the elite side. I’d be okay with an elite corner at 7 as well.

Pick 7 would be awesome but I think it's too early to lock in on that as the draft slot. At 7, I'd hope they could land Brock Bowers, TE or the most talented OL available.

(11-27-2023, 01:26 AM)Bengalstripes9 Wrote: If we lost out and stay at 5 wins, things could swing in our favor for draft position.

There are only 4 teams with less than 4 wins (patriots, panthers, bears, cardinals).

With Murray back with the cardinals they could win a few more, but who knows? I don’t expect us leapfrogging these 4 teams.

There are 6 four win teams above us in the draft order (jets, chargers, bucs, titans, giants, commanders).

Out of this group I think the commanders likely don’t win many more games after trading their best defensive players away. The giants also look bad and have a lot of injuries.

Otherwise the jets, chargers, titans, and bucs are talented teams and should pass below us in the draft order.

The packers, rams, saints, and raiders have 5 wins and are below us in the standings right now, but they are talented and should win more than us down the stretch.


I’m fully expecting us to drop from the 15 spot to pick 7, which would be great draft position to improve the team going into next year.

With our remaining schedule I really don’t see us with a chance to beat anyone except for the Steelers and maybe Indy. If we lose out I know it’s not great for morale, but I really think it will be best for the team long term as it will force the coaches and management to reflect, make changes, and improve the team.

Who do you think we can grab at pick 7? I’m hoping to see us grab an offensive lineman or defensive lineman.

Im tired of all the wide receiver picks. You can draft wideouts much lower with a high success rate. Lineman are harder to draft lower on the elite side. I’d be okay with an elite corner at 7 as well.

If we have the #7 overall pick, my #1 target is Jer'Zhan Newton. Our Dline is expensive as shit and not producing enough pass rush. Hendrickson is doing his job and Murphy is coming along, but what we really lack is an inside push. That isn't Reader's role and while Hill does get good pressure on occasion, a true game wrecker like Newton would be the X factor for this defense.

Target #2 would be Olu Fashanu/Joe Alt (depending on which is available) or, if you're concerned about the left tackle to right tackle transition (since we aren't moving Orlando Brown Jr), you got Taliese Fuaga or JC Latham, although I wonder if either would be considered a reach with a top 10 pick. At the moment, they would be considered a suboptimal pick.

This is assuming that we don't retain Williams for more than a single season (like a franchise tag). If we re-sign him, these four are off the table for me.

If those five are not available, I'd consider an edge rusher like Laiatu Latu or Jared Verse, but only if they test elite at the combine. I don't see any "generational prospects" like Myles Garrett at edge this year, so one of these guys will need to test elite to be worth this pick, especially since we already have Murphy, Hubbard and Hendrickson. We'll need to grab a second starter in the next couple off seasons, but we don't need to do it at this pick if the value isn't there.

After that, I'd start looking at skill position players like Brock Bowers or Malik Nabers. I would consider Rome Odunze, but taking a WR from Washington in the top 10...well, let's just say I have PSTD in that regard. I wouldn't select either Egbuka or Coleman at #7 though. They just don't have the production profile I look for in a top 10 pick. I know, I know...measurables. But still, drafting a guy with less than 2000 career receiving yards in 3 seasons? Yeesh.

Knowing how the bengals operate, it wil be nabers if he is there. Then they tag and trade tee and can beef up the trenches later. The bengals desperately need a RB. Hopefully we can see some Chase brown down the stretch and see what we have.

(11-27-2023, 01:26 AM)Bengalstripes9 Wrote: If we lost out and stay at 5 wins, things could swing in our favor for draft position.

There are only 4 teams with less than 4 wins (patriots, panthers, bears, cardinals).

With Murray back with the cardinals they could win a few more, but who knows? I don’t expect us leapfrogging these 4 teams.

There are 6 four win teams above us in the draft order (jets, chargers, bucs, titans, giants, commanders).

Out of this group I think the commanders likely don’t win many more games after trading their best defensive players away. The giants also look bad and have a lot of injuries.

Otherwise the jets, chargers, titans, and bucs are talented teams and should pass below us in the draft order.

The packers, rams, saints, and raiders have 5 wins and are below us in the standings right now, but they are talented and should win more than us down the stretch.


I’m fully expecting us to drop from the 15 spot to pick 7, which would be great draft position to improve the team going into next year.

With our remaining schedule I really don’t see us with a chance to beat anyone except for the Steelers and maybe Indy. If we lose out I know it’s not great for morale, but I really think it will be best for the team long term as it will force the coaches and management to reflect, make changes, and improve the team.

Who do you think we can grab at pick 7? I’m hoping to see us grab an offensive lineman or defensive lineman.

Im tired of all the wide receiver picks. You can draft wideouts much lower with a high success rate. Lineman are harder to draft lower on the elite side. I’d be okay with an elite corner at 7 as well.

Historically, we've actually been much better drafting DL around the middle of the draft than WR.  Hubbard, Lawson, Atkins, and Peko were all quality starters drafted in the 3rd or 4th round. On the other end of the spectrum, we haven't drafted a WR that earned a starting spot or even a significant role on offense later than the 2nd round since 2012(the Sanu/Jones draft).  Yoshi and Chuck Sizzle may break that streak, however.

At #7, realistic targets would be...

Olumuyiwa Fashanu, T, Penn State
Brock Bowers, TE, Georgia
Kool-Aid McKinstry, CB, Alabama
Joe Alt, T, Notre Dame
Rome Odunze, WR, Washington

There's several edge rushers around that spot, but I didn't list them because of us already having a 1st round pick as a rotation player going into next year.  

(11-27-2023, 11:12 AM)Whatever Wrote: Historically, we've actually been much better drafting DL around the middle of the draft than WR.  Hubbard, Lawson, Atkins, and Peko were all quality starters drafted in the 3rd or 4th round. On the other end of the spectrum, we haven't drafted a WR that earned a starting spot or even a significant role on offense later than the 2nd round since 2012(the Sanu/Jones draft).  Yoshi and Chuck Sizzle may break that streak, however.

At #7, realistic targets would be...

Olumuyiwa Fashanu, T, Penn State
Brock Bowers, TE, Georgia
Kool-Aid McKinstry, CB, Alabama
Joe Alt, T, Notre Dame
Rome Odunze, WR, Washington

There's several edge rushers around that spot, but I didn't list them because of us already having a 1st round pick as a rotation player going into next year.  

I think Joe Alt could step over and play RT but I'm not so sure about Fashanu. 

(11-27-2023, 10:44 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: If we have the #7 overall pick, my #1 target is Jer'Zhan Newton. Our Dline is expensive as shit and not producing enough pass rush. Hendrickson is doing his job and Murphy is coming along, but what we really lack is an inside push. That isn't Reader's role and while Hill does get good pressure on occasion, a true game wrecker like Newton would be the X factor for this defense.

Target #2 would be Olu Fashanu/Joe Alt (depending on which is available) or, if you're concerned about the left tackle to right tackle transition (since we aren't moving Orlando Brown Jr), you got Taliese Fuaga or JC Latham, although I wonder if either would be considered a reach with a top 10 pick. At the moment, they would be considered a suboptimal pick.

This is assuming that we don't retain Williams for more than a single season (like a franchise tag). If we re-sign him, these four are off the table for me.

If those five are not available, I'd consider an edge rusher like Laiatu Latu or Jared Verse, but only if they test elite at the combine. I don't see any "generational prospects" like Myles Garrett at edge this year, so one of these guys will need to test elite to be worth this pick, especially since we already have Murphy, Hubbard and Hendrickson. We'll need to grab a second starter in the next couple off seasons, but we don't need to do it at this pick if the value isn't there.

After that, I'd start looking at skill position players like Brock Bowers or Malik Nabers. I would consider Rome Odunze, but taking a WR from Washington in the top 10...well, let's just say I have PSTD in that regard. I wouldn't select either Egbuka or Coleman at #7 though. They just don't have the production profile I look for in a top 10 pick. I know, I know...measurables. But still, drafting a guy with less than 2000 career receiving yards in 3 seasons? Yeesh.

Newton's fallen out of the Top 15 on the Consensus Big Board.  It's also a deep draft class and FA class for DT's.

Fuaga is currently the 23rd overall prospect, while Latham is 11th.  I wouldn't take either over Fashanu/Alt even with the position switch.  Latham would be my "everything has gone to shit and I can't trade down" pick.

I can't see them spending a 1st on an edge with their current investment at the position.  We need a starter at #7, not a rotation player.

No way I'd take Egbuka at 7, and I would have to see how Coleman tests to consider him.

(11-27-2023, 11:14 AM)Synric Wrote: I think Joe Alt could step over and play RT but I'm not so sure about Fashanu. 

In fairness, there's a small chance Fashanu makes it to 7, currently.

Currently, my board at 7 would be...

Harrison(pipe dream)
Alt
Brockers
Fashanu
Odunze
Kool-Aid
Latham

Let Reader, Jonah, Boyd and Chido leave in FA and try and TAG/Trade Tee for a late round 1st early 2nd. All the money being saved make a big splash and sign Chris Jones or Christian Wilkins, draft Penn State OT or Joe Alt for RT and draft WR with the Tee pick, 2nd round pick give me a center if it's not a reach (billy price) and move Ted to LG. Sign a TE in FA not named Irv Smith.

(11-27-2023, 11:43 AM)Whatever Wrote: In fairness, there's a small chance Fashanu makes it to 7, currently.

Currently, my board at 7 would be...

Harrison(pipe dream)
Alt
Brockers
Fashanu
Odunze
Kool-Aid
Latham

 I like the list you know I have Fuaga over Latham especially for the Bengals but I also wanted to mention that a trade back if Brockers or either of the top 2 tackles in the class aren't there at #7 would be a good move in this draft class.

(11-27-2023, 12:47 PM)Synric Wrote:  I like the list you know I have Fuaga over Latham especially for the Bengals but I also wanted to mention that a trade back if Brockers or either of the top 2 tackles in the class aren't there at #7 would be a good move in this draft class.

I would personally be excited with any of the first 6 on the board.  Odunze would be our Higgins replacement and Kool-Aid gives Turner another year of development before presumably taking over slot duties when Hilton leaves.  However, if I'm picking Top 10, I need a Top 10 talent and Latham isn't it.  I would really be trying to move down at that point.  However, it's unlikely only one QB and no edge rushers go in the first 6 picks.

What would make anyone think that the Bengals will be drafting 7th, let alone in the top 10? I mean, C'mon we haven't even reached the "dead cat bounce" portion of an otherwise miserable season, yet. I predict that they'll be drafting somewhere between the 13th and 17th slots.

(11-27-2023, 11:12 AM)Whatever Wrote: Historically, we've actually been much better drafting DL around the middle of the draft than WR.  Hubbard, Lawson, Atkins, and Peko were all quality starters drafted in the 3rd or 4th round. On the other end of the spectrum, we haven't drafted a WR that earned a starting spot or even a significant role on offense later than the 2nd round since 2012(the Sanu/Jones draft).  Yoshi and Chuck Sizzle may break that streak, however.

At #7, realistic targets would be...

Olumuyiwa Fashanu, T, Penn State
Brock Bowers, TE, Georgia
Kool-Aid McKinstry, CB, Alabama
Joe Alt, T, Notre Dame
Rome Odunze, WR, Washington

There's several edge rushers around that spot, but I didn't list them because of us already having a 1st round pick as a rotation player going into next year.  

It's been what, like 10 years since we hit on a mid-round dlineman pick (with the exception of Hubbard who is far from elite)? Besides Atkins the dlineman that have been good that we drafted in the mid rounds have been a little above average, or sollid players.

The best dlines have elite players and that's what I would love to add if we can. Not sure if there are really any elite dlineman we can add in this draft with pick 7-11. Oline or corner makes sense to me.

We already have a top-end WR, we have no ability to re-sign another top-end WR, so I'd prefer to fill out the team with the more high level players on defense or along the oline. We can find solid-great WRs and RBs in the 2nd or later.

(11-27-2023, 01:25 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: What would make anyone think that the Bengals will be drafting 7th, let alone in the top 10?  I mean, C'mon we haven't even reached the "dead cat bounce" portion of an otherwise miserable season, yet.  I predict that they'll be drafting somewhere between the 13th and 17th slots.

I think there is a chance we pick 7th, looking at the teams between us and that pick. I think the Steelers game is winnable, and possibly the Colts and Vikings games. Both the Colts and Vikings have played much more consistent ball this year, though. 

We don't have a chance against Jax next week. We don't have a chance against KC or Cleveland to end the year. 

I would give the edge to the Colts and Vikings in those matchups, and a slight edge to the Steelers as well. All three of these teams have been playing much better than we have.

I think we're looking at pick 7-11 in the draft when all is said and done.
I think we're looking at no changes to the coaching staff.
I think we're looking at no real changes to the coaching philosophy and game plan.
I think we're looking at improving through the draft.

We can win with our system. I would prefer a more balanced approach where we develop the oline and running game and reduce the risk of injuring Burrow. 
I don't think we have an elite offensive coaching staff, and it holds us back from being a team that blows out opponents like the Dolphins, Chiefs, and Niners do. But I don't see any way for us to improve our coaches other than them learning on the job, because that is how the organization opperates. 

We need to learn from the Ravens. They have built an elite defense that carries their team. They can win multiple ways via their rushing attack or throwing it, or with defense alone. 

Our winning formula is throwing the ball and creating turnovers on defense to win close games. We need to manufacture more ways to win games. 

To do that we need to develop our secondary more. Adding an elite corner in the draft would help put our unit over the top. Adding an elite dlineman to create more pressure could improve our pass rush and run defense a lot as well. Those are two positions I would target.

Also, improve our running game and pass protection by continuing to invest in the oline.

We can add more skill players but it won't do any good if we cant run and pass block at an elite level. We need to develop a balanced attack to keep defenses off balance. We need a strong line to be successful and make a deep run. 

My wish list: Alt OT, Latu DE, Newton D3, Fuaga RT, DeJean CB/S
I'm guessing we're drafting around 13; we lose all the tie-breakers with the best strength of schedule.
At 7 I'm trading down if Alt and Latu are gone.
If we're drafting in the top half of the round, we shouldn't be drafting on "potential".

(11-27-2023, 02:52 PM)Bengalstripes9 Wrote: It's been what, like 10 years since we hit on a mid-round dlineman pick (with the exception of Hubbard who is far from elite)? Besides Atkins the dlineman that have been good that we drafted in the mid rounds have been a little above average, or sollid players.

The best dlines have elite players and that's what I would love to add if we can. Not sure if there are really any elite dlineman we can add in this draft with pick 7-11. Oline or corner makes sense to me.

We already have a top-end WR, we have no ability to re-sign another top-end WR, so I'd prefer to fill out the team with the more high level players on defense or along the oline. We can find solid-great WRs and RBs in the 2nd or later.


I think there is a chance we pick 7th, looking at the teams between us and that pick. I think the Steelers game is winnable, and possibly the Colts and Vikings games. Both the Colts and Vikings have played much more consistent ball this year, though. 

We don't have a chance against Jax next week. We don't have a chance against KC or Cleveland to end the year. 

I would give the edge to the Colts and Vikings in those matchups, and a slight edge to the Steelers as well. All three of these teams have been playing much better than we have.

I think we're looking at pick 7-11 in the draft when all is said and done.
I think we're looking at no changes to the coaching staff.
I think we're looking at no real changes to the coaching philosophy and game plan.
I think we're looking at improving through the draft.

We can win with our system. I would prefer a more balanced approach where we develop the oline and running game and reduce the risk of injuring Burrow. 
I don't think we have an elite offensive coaching staff, and it holds us back from being a team that blows out opponents like the Dolphins, Chiefs, and Niners do. But I don't see any way for us to improve our coaches other than them learning on the job, because that is how the organization opperates. 

We need to learn from the Ravens. They have built an elite defense that carries their team. They can win multiple ways via their rushing attack or throwing it, or with defense alone. 

Our winning formula is throwing the ball and creating turnovers on defense to win close games. We need to manufacture more ways to win games. 

To do that we need to develop our secondary more. Adding an elite corner in the draft would help put our unit over the top. Adding an elite dlineman to create more pressure could improve our pass rush and run defense a lot as well. Those are two positions I would target.

Also, improve our running game and pass protection by continuing to invest in the oline.

We can add more skill players but it won't do any good if we cant run and pass block at an elite level. We need to develop a balanced attack to keep defenses off balance. We need a strong line to be successful and make a deep run. 

What mid-round WR have we hit on that's been as good as Hubbard?  Marvin Jones certainly isn't equivalent, not to mention you're considering Atkins the only real hit.  If you want to prioritize DL, that's one thing.  However, this myth that you can always get WR's and RB's later in the draft is just that, a myth.

Why would any team be modeling themselves after a club that has one playoff win since 2015?  The Ravens have a unanimous MVP at QB who's 1-3 as a starter in playoffs.  Why copy a team that's less successful than ours?

It’s EASILY newton and it’s not close(assuming MHJ ain’t there) but I’d trade back multiple times

Rome Odunze is a riser to me. Kiper in his pod last week was comparing him to Ja'Marr Chase.

(11-27-2023, 01:25 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: What would make anyone think that the Bengals will be drafting 7th, let alone in the top 10?  I mean, C'mon we haven't even reached the "dead cat bounce" portion of an otherwise miserable season, yet.  I predict that they'll be drafting somewhere between the 13th and 17th slots.

Hypothetically, if the Bengals only win 2 games of less the rest of the way, it will (or should) show the FO that the coaching staff has no idea how to operate without Burrow out there, and that would hopefully lead to some changes in the coaching staff.

If they continue playing like they are offensively, I really only see maybe up to 4 wins the rest of the way - MIN, PIT, IND, CLE.
That's not to say I'm favoring the Bengals for any of those games, but I think some/all of those will be close and Bengals might be able to squeak out a win.

(11-28-2023, 09:29 AM)Goalpost Wrote: Rome Odunze is a riser to me.  Kiper in his pod last week was comparing him to Ja'Marr Chase.

I feel like this draft will be offense first.

I doubt the Bengals go TE in Rd 1 unless Bowers makes it to them.

I think it will either be WR or OT, but it will depend on FA.

Would you rather - keep Higgins and draft an OT in Rd 1 knowing the history of Bengals drafting/developing OL, or keep Jonah and draft Odunze in Rd 1 knowing how well they have been able to draft WRs early?

(11-28-2023, 11:12 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Hypothetically, if the Bengals only win 2 games of less the rest of the way, it will (or should) show the FO that the coaching staff has no idea how to operate without Burrow out there, and that would hopefully lead to some changes in the coaching staff.

If they continue playing like they are offensively, I really only see maybe up to 4 wins the rest of the way - MIN, PIT, IND, CLE.
That's not to say I'm favoring the Bengals for any of those games, but I think some/all of those will be close and Bengals might be able to squeak out a win.

I have a feeling that the offense will be simplified somewhat going forward.  More under center formations, straight ahead runs, short PA passes to backs, TEs and receivers underneath, at least until this inexperienced QB gains a little confidence.