If Bowers and the top couple of OT/DE are off the board when we pick, I would like to see us trade back. We need to get as many contributors on rookie contracts as possible.

Tag Tee, sign Chase and let Boyd go. Would like to see Pollack gone too but that won’t happen.

(01-10-2024, 10:35 AM)Sled21 Wrote: I think some of you guys are confused about who works for who in these scenarios. Case in point, TJ TWatts agent was attempting to get him a better deal this year until Twatt said, "That's enough money" and went in and signed the contract offered by the Stealers, put his uniform on and went to practice. One of the few things I've seen him do that I liked.

And what have you seen from Tee that makes you think he'll do the same? What have you seen from his agent that suggests this contract negotiation won't be anything but a pain in the ass? Jesse Bates could have told his agent "That's enough money" and re-signed. He didn't. I don't fault Tee for trying to get as much as he can. But if he thinks he's going to squeeze WR1 money out of the Brown Family with a Chase extension on the horizon, he and his agent will be sorely disappointed.

1.);Tag Tee and trade Tee to the highest bidder. Use those draft picks to trade for an elite or close to Elite 3T. Preferably a guy under 27.

2.) Change the offensive line approach. Sign athletic guys on the line that fit what Zac and Pollack want to run. Not a bunch big bulky guys that can't get to the second level.

3) Move Dax to NB and sign + draft a true deep Safety.

(01-10-2024, 11:48 AM)The D.O.Z. Wrote: And what have you seen from Tee that makes you think he'll do the same? What have you seen from his agent that suggests this contract negotiation won't be anything but a pain in the ass? Jesse Bates could have told his agent "That's enough money" and re-signed. He didn't. I don't fault Tee for trying to get as much as he can. But if he thinks he's going to squeeze WR1 money out of the Brown Family with a Chase extension on the horizon, he and his agent will be sorely disappointed.

yeah i dont see it either....    Didnt look like burrow took a lower rate... Chase likely wont why should Tee take a smaller deal that he can get and will get on the open market.

(01-10-2024, 11:48 AM)The D.O.Z. Wrote: And what have you seen from Tee that makes you think he'll do the same? What have you seen from his agent that suggests this contract negotiation won't be anything but a pain in the ass? Jesse Bates could have told his agent "That's enough money" and re-signed. He didn't. I don't fault Tee for trying to get as much as he can. But if he thinks he's going to squeeze WR1 money out of the Brown Family with a Chase extension on the horizon, he and his agent will be sorely disappointed.

I don't fault them for wanting to get as much as they can either. But it's not the agent's decision, it ultimately comes down to the player. If Tee wants to stay with Burrow and Chase, he will instruct his agent to get as much as he can get from the Bengals, then sign. And it's also not about dollar amount, it is about structure. Maybe Tee will chase the big money, maybe he won't. None of us know. 

Hey guys!!! Gals?? Glad to be apart been a fan for close to 40 years. Tough season but fun one as well.
First comment..

Id let Jonah walk tee walk and reader (unless we can get him back here on a deal)

Resign WR Tyler boyd

Resign TE Tanner Hudson

Sign DT Justin madubuke

Sign FS Teshaun Gipson

Draft OT Mimms in 1

Draft a WR in 2 (we seem to hit on WRs here)

We’d probably have wiggle room financially to do more in Fa but just for starters this is what I’d do to fill big needs so that FA and the off-season at the end can feel like a Win.

Who Dey!

(01-08-2024, 12:19 AM)Joelist Wrote: Despite the disappointing end to the season, the team has the resources (in terms of cap money and picks) to do a lot of needed things.

BUT

It is important to get the priorities straight because some of the needs are going to be expensive and they probably don't have the resources to do everything.

So my order of importance right now is:

1) Fix the interior DL room. This is going to be costly because we probably need a major Free Agent here AND a high pick. This is whether we resign Reader and he fully recovers or not. Trey can't be the only source of pressure up front and ideally you want the other source to be on the inside. Fix this and you see an immediate uptick on the defense.

2) Get a savvy veteran Free Safety.

3) Resign Tanner Hudson so that there is flexibility in the draft, especially as they NEED a blue chip DT and this is not a deep TE draft.

4) If both Tee and Boyd leave a veteran good possession WR is a need also.


Obviously the Tee situation has to be resolved early. The problem is his agent is notoriously hard to work with (not just with us either) and will want terms the team cannot perform if they are keeping Chase. So this may be a tag and trade (especially as draft capital is needed).

I was just thinking about player moves and not the higher level things like potential evolving of the scheme on both sides of the ball to fit the player skillsets better.

Tag and swing a trade for Tee if a lucrative draft haul can be done.  
Damn near malpractice the Bengals haven't done this already.

DL needs some starting talent.
RT needs some starting talent.
Big RB.  Preferably fast.
TE please!  Get a starting guy who can scare the defense.  
Keep hitting the WR in the later rounds.

Of those, FA probably for DL and RT, draft for the rest.

Release Mixon, wave goodby to Boyd, keep Jake, he's become essential to keep, cut Carman & D'ante Smith.

I think we approach it thru the lens of trying to win a SB next year AND improving upon our problem areas.

Problems first.

1) Defense: inexperienced/poor secondary play led to a LOT of big plays.
2) Defense: Poor run defense, even with Reader.
3) Defense: Not much pass rush outside of Trey, especially on the interior.
4) Offense: Burrow's injury hampered the O early and did not help late. Too one dimensional.
5) Offense: TE play sucked.
6) Offense: OL mediocre.
7) Offense: WR drops.
8) Special teams: Punter stunk
---------------
9) FA holes: WR2, WR3, RT, TE, NT.
10) FA upgrades?: P, CB, S

Some of this can get solved without a new signings. Burrow being healthy and Browning being marginally competent help solve the #1 problem for the O. Hopefully ZT learned a lot in terms of philosophy & playcalling.

The #1 problem on D was poor secondary play. Chido coming off injury was subpar. Turner took his lumps as the year wore on. Scott was poor. And Dax made a lot of mental mistakes despite some flashes. And now with Ivey out, who played very well in limited snaps, we are down 2 corners. Battle coming in for Scott stabilized SS. If you are believer in Hill & Turner improving, this becomes a depth issue. If not, then this is flasing light bad and needs addressed.

But to fix everything else, we need FA/draft help.

Again, for me, Higgins & Reader are difference makers. You don't let those walk unless you have to, and we don't have to given we have a ton of cap space. We should have more info on the DJs' injury rehab process by March, but if it likely he can play by midseason, but due to Reader's health issues,,we likely still need a NT and we have our DT issues.

I totally let Jonah walk and draft an OT at #18. This class is so deep there should be one there.

We have $70 mil in cap space, but it is functionally more like $55.

I try to lock up my cheap/min FA's quickly. Adomitis & Browning. Drew Sample. Irwin. T. Williams. Ford. Scharping. Bailey & Bachie. Tupou. Even Wilcox. ADG & Hudson might cost a smidge more. If I have to cut one of them later, there will likely be little to no dead cap, and a good chance I can PS them.

I figure Tee + Reader is $30-$35 mil. So I have around $20-$25 mil left. I am gonna try to land a real difference maker with that money. DT 1st. If I whiff there, then secondary (deep S FA class), and maybe TE/WR/CB next.

If I cannot land a difference maker with that cash, I circle back to Chido & Boyd.

Day 2 draft is what I have open most, most likely WR (great class), DT/NT (good class), TE (thin class), or CB/S.

I draft that kid from Iowa, 5th round if I have to, to fix P. I'd also explore trading up in Rd 2 if I really want a guy (Sweat, Murphy, Legette). We have 9 picks, not sure they all make the squad, I am willing to burn 1-2 to move up on Day 2.

If I have to cut salary, Scott & Carman could save me clise to $3 mil. If I land a big fish DT, I might try to trade BJ Hill, but with Reader hurt, I'd try really hard not to.

By the numbers:

Signed roster locks:

Starters = 17/25. Burrow, Mixon, Chase, O. Brown, Volson, Karras, Cappa; Hendrickson, BJ Hill, Hubbard, Wilson, Pratt, CTB, Hilton, Battle, D. Hill; McPherson.

Adomitis is an ERFA, so he will be back. Make it 18.

Higgins & Reader would get to 20. P is a draft/UDFA issue. 21. OT in RD1 makes 22. If you believe in Turner is 23 with only WR3 and TE.

That's 23 guys. Signed reserves who I think are locks (or close) and not mentioned: C. Brown, Iosivas, C. Jones; C. Sample, Murphy, Ossai. Carter is a decent bet, 30.

FA's I'd think we can re-sign easily: Browning, T. Williams, Irwin, D. Sample, Wilcox, Ford, Scharping, Tupou, Bailey, Bachie. That's 38. ADG & Hudson could be trickier, and a touch pricier, 40.

Signed guys probable to iffy for 53: Scott, Anderson, Carman, D. Smith, Evans, Tufele, Harper. That's 47.

Two more FA signings + 8 more picks is 57. And that is not counting sime of the other signed/future's guys (Cochran, Maxwell, etc). Point being, I think we van burn a pick or two to move up if we have to.






Anyway, the questions/issues are now NT while Reader hurt, DT pass rush, TE1, WR3, another corner, and maybe S depth. Worst case, that is 6.

Day 2 of the draft can take 2. Your FA cash should be able to land you 1-2 of the others. Day 3 draft plus holding your nose on the others may have to happen (hope for Dax/Turner improvement, start Tupou while Reader recovers, live with Scott/Anderson as S depth, etc).

Matt Ariza is just standing there, waiting to be signed. No need to waste any more draft capital on Special Teams players.

Bad publicity my ass. The entire story has gotten worse for everyone but Ariza as time as gone on.

(01-08-2024, 12:19 AM)Joelist Wrote: Despite the disappointing end to the season, the team has the resources (in terms of cap money and picks) to do a lot of needed things.

BUT

It is important to get the priorities straight because some of the needs are going to be expensive and they probably don't have the resources to do everything.

So my order of importance right now is:

1) Fix the interior DL room. This is going to be costly because we probably need a major Free Agent here AND a high pick. This is whether we resign Reader and he fully recovers or not. Trey can't be the only source of pressure up front and ideally you want the other source to be on the inside. Fix this and you see an immediate uptick on the defense.

2) Get a savvy veteran Free Safety.

3) Resign Tanner Hudson so that there is flexibility in the draft, especially as they NEED a blue chip DT and this is not a deep TE draft.

4) If both Tee and Boyd leave a veteran good possession WR is a need also.


Obviously the Tee situation has to be resolved early. The problem is his agent is notoriously hard to work with (not just with us either) and will want terms the team cannot perform if they are keeping Chase. So this may be a tag and trade (especially as draft capital is needed).

I was just thinking about player moves and not the higher level things like potential evolving of the scheme on both sides of the ball to fit the player skillsets better.

Tag and swing a trade for Tee if a lucrative draft haul can be done.  
Damn near malpractice the Bengals haven't done this already.

DL needs some starting talent.
RT needs some starting talent.
Big RB.  Preferably fast.
TE please!  Get a starting guy who can scare the defense.  
Keep hitting the WR in the later rounds.

Of those, FA probably for DL and RT, draft for the rest.

Release Mixon, wave goodby to Boyd, keep Jake, he's become essential to keep, cut Carman & D'ante Smith.

While it would be tough to turn down a trade haul for Higgins (2 FRP is a no-brainer), I don't think that offer will happen. It didn't for Lamar Jackson.

One is tempting if it is higher than ours. But it needs to be this year. Harrison, Nabers, & Odunze are all likely gone before we pick, and after that it looks like WR3 guys to me.

(01-10-2024, 06:43 PM)NotBigzo Wrote: Matt Ariza is just standing there, waiting to be signed. No need to waste any more draft capital on Special Teams players.

Bad publicity my ass. The entire story has gotten worse for everyone but Ariza as time as gone on.

Dude, when 32 teams are passing on him, they know something you don't. Even the dirtbag teams like the Stealers are taking a pass. Sure, he wasn't at the house when that girl alleged he raped her, but the leagues investigators have obviously found something else no one wants to be part of.

(01-10-2024, 10:28 AM)Sled21 Wrote: And if I remember right, he ran it out of the end zone and got to the three, instead of taking the touchback.

Yup. An enigma wrapped on a won ton.

(01-08-2024, 01:10 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Spending half your cap on a QB and 2 WRs, especially when your team can't draft, is an absolute recipe for disaster. 

This.

Let tee walk
Draft another stud WR in the second.

(01-08-2024, 12:19 AM)Joelist Wrote: Despite the disappointing end to the season, the team has the resources (in terms of cap money and picks) to do a lot of needed things.

BUT

It is important to get the priorities straight because some of the needs are going to be expensive and they probably don't have the resources to do everything.

So my order of importance right now is:

1) Fix the interior DL room. This is going to be costly because we probably need a major Free Agent here AND a high pick. This is whether we resign Reader and he fully recovers or not. Trey can't be the only source of pressure up front and ideally you want the other source to be on the inside. Fix this and you see an immediate uptick on the defense.

2) Get a savvy veteran Free Safety.

3) Resign Tanner Hudson so that there is flexibility in the draft, especially as they NEED a blue chip DT and this is not a deep TE draft.

4) If both Tee and Boyd leave a veteran good possession WR is a need also.


Obviously the Tee situation has to be resolved early. The problem is his agent is notoriously hard to work with (not just with us either) and will want terms the team cannot perform if they are keeping Chase. So this may be a tag and trade (especially as draft capital is needed).

I was just thinking about player moves and not the higher level things like potential evolving of the scheme on both sides of the ball to fit the player skillsets better.

Nice thread Joelist. Agree with most everything you say here no surprise. I would tag Tee and trade him for a game changer on Defense
like a Josh Allen End from the Jags to pair with Trey. I would add Madubuike the 3-tech from the Ravens so our pass rush goes up another
notch and bring back Reader as he should be cheaper now with the injury and the fact we don't know if he will even play again. I would 
add a NT early in the Draft and a WR like either Rome Odunze or Malachi Corley.

We are pretty good at Drafting WR's and there are lots of good ones. Also in FA I would add Eluemunor as our RT who I think would be an
upgrade over Jonah. Lots of ways to improve this team and we have the dough and all the options available. Oh, and move on from Frank 
Pollack as well and add an OL coach that can develop the youth and help the vets get better.

Talking about Tight Ends last night, I just want to say the 2023 Bengals threw passes to the TE 115 times last season.

6.8 passes per game with the worst TE room in the league.

They use the TE. They'd use a good one even more.

They'd used a good TE a whole bunch when Boyd…

— Goodberry (@JoeGoodberry) January 15, 2024

I've seen several stating that the Bengals should "tag and trade" Tee Higgins, without adding any context.

Who are you proposing would trade with the Bengals for Higgins? And what are you supposing the Bengals will be getting in return? In this hypothetical 'tag and trade' scenario are the Bengals actively shopping Higgins, or are teams approaching them about a possible deal?

Personally, I see the team making every attempt at signing Higgins to a long term deal keeping him with the team. Not saying that is my biggest wish, just what I think will happen.

(01-15-2024, 02:06 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote:

Talking about Tight Ends last night, I just want to say the 2023 Bengals threw passes to the TE 115 times last season.

6.8 passes per game with the worst TE room in the league.

They use the TE. They'd use a good one even more.

They'd used a good TE a whole bunch when Boyd…

— Goodberry (@JoeGoodberry) January 15, 2024

Hope Brock Bowers falls to us. I think from what we have seen this year we would use him big time.

Hudson and Sample had a pretty good year, bring them back as well. But I am all for Bowers in the 1st if he falls to us.

Need to add a DT and RT in FA though first.

(01-15-2024, 02:29 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I've seen several stating that the Bengals should "tag and trade" Tee Higgins, without adding any context.

Who are you proposing would trade with the Bengals for Higgins?  And what are you supposing the Bengals will be getting in return?  In this hypothetical 'tag and trade' scenario are the Bengals actively shopping Higgins, or are teams approaching them about a possible deal?

Personally, I see the team making every attempt at signing Higgins to a long term deal keeping him with the team.  Not saying that is my biggest wish, just what I think will happen.

I think Tee actually might be more affordable after this injury ridden season, but if we did Tag him we should be open to offers.

We will see, all I know is that Chase is the guy we should be extending and I don't want to overpay Tee who is banged up a lot.

(01-15-2024, 03:05 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Hope Brock Bowers falls to us. I think from what we have seen this year we would use him big time.

Hudson and Sample had a pretty good year, bring them back as well. But I am all for Bowers in the 1st if he falls to us.

Need to add a DT and RT in FA though first.

Bowers would be an awesome pick for us. I just don't see him making it to our pick. This year's TE class is much weaker compared to last year's. I think we'll most likely get another 1 year FA, or possibly actually attempt to sign a legit TE and not just put out a cheap deal and see who's desperate enough to sign it.

(01-16-2024, 01:32 AM)Bengal Dude Wrote: Bowers would be an awesome pick for us. I just don't see him making it to our pick. This year's TE class is much weaker compared to last year's. I think we'll most likely get another 1 year FA, or possibly actually attempt to sign a legit TE and not just put out a cheap deal and see who's desperate enough to sign it.

TE Free Agents in 2024, age

Dalton Schultz, 28
Hunter Henry, 30
Noah Fant, 26
Gerald Everett, 30
Mike Gesicki, 29