So how do we think they should approach the offseason?

[puddycat]

Free Agency: Fill all holes possible before the draft. (RT, TE, WR, DT, CB, FS) Include veteran leadership to young rooms (Safety, DB, WR). This is not the time for high risk, high reward. Sign a competent RT, even better if they can kick in to guard after the draft; sign a veteran DT (I like Reader; also Tart), get a veteran true FS to add to very young room of Hill, Battle, and Anderson. Sign someone to compete at WR2 who can go deep (I'm assuming Chase and Jones can play inside or out and Iosivas either outside spot.) Add depth to the CB room. Re-sign Hudson and Sample. All defensive FAs can be on a snap count or in a rotation so they can be older or injury-prone.
Splurge on a TE; we will continue to use double TEs and can use a good one. If I would choose a second position to splurge on it would be CB; JMO. If there's still money, QB pressure can be bought on short-term contracts.
What not to do: Sign a big long contract that will place the team in a position not to draft BPA and not develop younger players who show promise.
My targets: RT George Fant, TE Noah Fant, WR Bourne, DT Tart, CB Ya-Sin, S Whitehead Premium: Q Williams DT (pass-rush only), Autrey DE/DT, Gilmore CB

[Essex Johnson]

(01-10-2024, 11:48 AM)J24 Wrote: 1.);Tag Tee and trade Tee to the highest bidder. Use those draft picks to trade for an elite or close to Elite 3T. Preferably a guy under 27.

2.) Change the offensive line approach.  Sign athletic guys on the line that fit what Zac and Pollack want to run.  Not a bunch big bulky guys that can't get to the second level.

3) Move Dax to NB and sign + draft a true deep Safety.

#1 I like tagging Tee and trading but using those picks for more draft picks, assuming we sign Chase , we need long term plan with Burrow and Chase here for a while so I prefer to use picks to fill holes and keep us on a competitive trajectory.
#2 Pollack wants glass eaters remember that is what we have focused on especially in FA, too much time and $$ invested in our FAs to send packing, that is why disappointed we kept Pollack.

[casear2727]

Im not sure how excited I am regarding this year's free agency. I fully support addressing needs in free agency instead of the draft. I just dont see us making any type of splash.

DT
My pick: Leonard Williams, 30, is an excellent pass rusher and run defender. Will be expensive but guessing a tier below Wilkins & Madubuike numbers. Would be considered a splash for us.

Christian Wilkins, if not tagged, will demand north of 20M with multiple suitors.
Justin Madubuike (see Wilkins)
Chris Jones wants 30M on a multi-year deal.
Sheldon Rankins, 30, is solid, he is not Reader vs the run but is ok, consistent pass rusher.
Teair Tart, 27, ok DT, terrible tackler, Titans cut due to attitude. We tried to sign him off waivers.


RT
My pick: Onwenu, Eluemunor, T Brown

Mike Onwenu, solid, only 26, terrible vs Watt.
Jermaine Eluemunor, solid, 29, terrible vs Watt.
George Fant, pass for me, not a bad pass blocker, never been a good run blocker, 32
Trent Brown, 31, played LT this year but has played RT, was good this season when he played, was a headache for the staff, could be a solid bridge to a younger player. Like OBj he is 6'8, 370.


RB
My pick: Any of these guys would be good to great.

Singletary and Swift could be targets if we let Mixon walk
Barkely, Jacobs, Henry and Pollard are bigger names at higher costs


TE
My pick: Fant, 26, 6-4 250, ok blocker with good hands and speed.

Noah Fant or Hunter Henry would be nice
Also available is the same list we have passed on previously, all would be upgrades:
Everett, Gesicki, Schultz


I can see us pick up an Eli Apple type vet CB, or re-sign Awuzie if he is affordable.

I am not sure we will sign a vet safety unless one is cheaper and better than Nick Scott.

[TecmoBengals]

(01-16-2024, 11:51 AM)casear2727 Wrote: Im not sure how excited I am regarding this year's free agency. I fully support addressing needs in free agency instead of the draft. I just dont see us making any type of splash.

I tend to agree about not getting excited about this year's free agent pool. Take WR, for example: https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/all/wide-receiver/?ref=trending-pages

I've seen a few posts suggesting Chris Samuel as an option, but is he even a sizeable upgrade over Boyd for the price? I can't wait to see how Duke and the organization approaches FA this year.

[casear2727]

(01-16-2024, 01:19 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: I tend to agree about not getting excited about this year's free agent pool. Take WR, for example: https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/all/wide-receiver/?ref=trending-pages

I've seen a few posts suggesting Chris Samuel as an option, but is he even a sizeable upgrade over Boyd for the price? I can't wait to see how Duke and the organization approaches FA this year.

This WR draft class is way better than the free agency group, IMO.

[TecmoBengals]

(01-16-2024, 01:43 PM)casear2727 Wrote: This WR draft class is way better than the free agency group, IMO.

Yes, I wonder how it shapes up.

If they tag Tee and resign Boyd, then I suppose they don't draft a WR.

If they only tag Tee but let Boyd walk, are they comfortable with Iosivas and Jones? Do they invest a 1st or later round pick on another WR?

There is a lot in play here. WR is a likely need, but I mostly hope they prioritize OL/DL, CB, and TE.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-16-2024, 11:51 AM)casear2727 Wrote: Im not sure how excited I am regarding this year's free agency. I fully support addressing needs in free agency instead of the draft. I just dont see us making any type of splash.

DT
My pick: Leonard Williams, 30, is an excellent pass rusher and run defender. Will be expensive but guessing a tier below Wilkins & Madubuike numbers. Would be considered a splash for us.

Christian Wilkins, if not tagged, will demand north of 20M with multiple suitors.
Justin Madubuike (see Wilkins)
Chris Jones wants 30M on a multi-year deal.
Sheldon Rankins, 30, is solid, he is not Reader vs the run but is ok, consistent pass rusher.
Teair Tart, 27, ok DT, terrible tackler, Titans cut due to attitude. We tried to sign him off waivers.


RT
My pick: Onwenu, Eluemunor, T Brown

Mike Onwenu, solid, only 26, terrible vs Watt.
Jermaine Eluemunor, solid, 29, terrible vs Watt.
George Fant, pass for me, not a bad pass blocker, never been a good run blocker, 32
Trent Brown, 31, played LT this year but has played RT, was good this season when he played, was a headache for the staff, could be a solid bridge to a younger player.  Like OBj he is 6'8, 370.


RB
My pick:  Any of these guys would be good to great.

Singletary and Swift could be targets if we let Mixon walk
Barkely, Jacobs, Henry and Pollard are bigger names at higher costs


TE
My pick: Fant, 26, 6-4 250, ok blocker with good hands and speed.

Noah Fant or Hunter Henry would be nice
Also available is the same list we have passed on previously, all would be upgrades:
Everett, Gesicki, Schultz


I can see us pick up an Eli Apple type vet CB, or re-sign Awuzie if he is affordable.

I am not sure we will sign a vet safety unless one is cheaper and better than Nick Scott.

Nice post Casear, I get all your thoughts here. All for most of these guys, have to add that Jonah was terrible vs Twatt as well as is 
about any RT in the NFL, he is just that good. Good thing for the Bills he didn't play last night as the game would of been much closer.

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

My approach would be dictated by where I think our problems are. It could go a lot of ways, depending, but here are my bedrock assumptions & problems.

Problems this year:

1. Defense: poor secondary play led to a lot of mistakes & big plays.

Solution: hope Dax & Turner improve. Battle helped a ton starting for Scott. FA/drafting for depth most likely.

2. Defense: poor run defense.

Solution: bring back Reader. Draft/sign a stand in who is better than Tupou/Tufele. If Sweat falls in my lap Rd2, I take him. Like Jackson Rd3, Jefferson Day 3.

3. Defense: poor pass rush outside of Trey, especially inside.

Solution: aggressively pursue top DT's in FA (Wilkins, Madubuike, Williams). Rd2 DT firmly on table if whiff (Murphy, Jenkins, etc). Rd 3 as well (Davis, Orhorhoro, etc).

4. Offense: Injured/limited/poor QB play made things too predictable.

Solution: Hope ZT learned something. He said he did.

5. Offense: Mediocre OL play.

Solution: draft a Jonah upgrade Rd1. Continued Volson improvement, he got better the 2nd half. Possible FA RT as stopgap to open up draft (Smith, Brown), but likely only possible if we whiff on DTs.

6. Offense: poor TE play.

Solutions: bring Hudson back, he helped a ton. Sample too as TE2/3, he is better than Wilcox. Gotta draft a TE this time. Bowers in Rd1 is likely gone. Ditto Sanders in Rd2. Stover Rd 3 or Johnson or one of the others later. Schultz is the only FA TE I like, & he is likely overpriced.

7. Offense: lack of explosiveness from receivers outside of Chase.

Solutions: Keep Tee. Give Iosivas & Jones more run. Draft a Boyd replacement Rd2-3. Or swap in Shed Jackson for Irwin. If the price is right, I am not opposed to Boyd being back, but he is below Tee, Reader, FA DT, FA OTs, Henry, and Schultz on my shopping list.

8. Special teams: the punter stinks.

Take the kid from Iowa Rd6. Maybe even with the compensatory 5th.
---------------

Here I list my bedrock assumptions that will guide me through this offseason.

1. I am riding with Hill & Turner starting next year. I won't spend big on a FA DB. Depending on how the draft falls, maybe a pick, but Rd 1 is highly doubtful, even Day 2 unlikely. Looking for depth here.

2. I bring Tee & Reader back. Jonah walks.

I have cap space. I don't want to spend big on guys who are NOT difference makers (Jonah). I think Tee & Reader are, when healthy. No way I let Tee walk for nothing, but a pick coming back needs to be in the teens, and this year, for me to consider it, or have more picks attached if later.

Signing Reader means I have, at min, my entire starting Defense pencilled in. FA & draft is then for upgrades (DT) and depth and Reader stand-in while he gets healthy. Tee takes WR2 off the board. Upper part of draft would then (likely) be RT, WR3, TE1 in some order. Though a too good to pass up draft option might push that back (Bowers, Newton, Wiggins/DeJean in Rd1, Sweat in Rd2).

3. Not averse to spending BIG on 1 more FA. But it has to be a real difference maker. I don't want to spend big for marginal improvement. DT is the priority.

Likely, Tee & DJ cost me $30 mil vs the cap next year. Could be $25 if I get favorable deals. Depending on how Tee/DJ go, I can afford a $20 mil guy. Wilkins & Madubuike are muly targets. I think it unlikely either hit the market. Williams is likely cheaper, but also borderline on the difference maker threshold.

4. I aggressively try to get vet guys to restructure/extend to free up more cap space: Burrow, Cappa, Trey, OBJ, Karras, Hilton, BJ Hill.

How much I can free up here, along with how much Tee/DJ cost me, and if I hit on a DT or not, dictate how much I can do from here. I would prioritize thusly:

5. FA OT.

There are two I would consider. Tyrod Smith in Dallas and Trent Brown in NE. Am looking to pay $7-$10 mil here. But I think it is unlikely we land either. Doing so would not prevent me from taking OT in Rd1, and not being able to guarantee either a starting spot makes it unlikely they sign here. And paying big for a reserve OT is not great cap management.

However, there is no guarantee Mims or Fuaga or Latham is there at #18. Having a fallback plan is needed.

Having one of these guys in hand would free us up in Rd1 to take BPA (Bowers, Newton, CB/WR if the OTs are gone) and puts trading back & taking Guyton on the table.

B. Derrick Henry.

I would not cut Mixon for anyone but Henry. Especially since he took a haircut for the team last year & I want to encourage others to follow suit. I'd even consider carrying both if I have the room and Mixon wants to stay. But if you cut Mixon, this could be done for under $5 mil net.

Imagine a scenario on offense where we bring back Tee, take Fuaga in Rd1, draft Sanders in Rd2, and Roman Wilson in Rd 3. If they play 2 deep, Henry feasts. If not, Chase & Burrow do.

C. Cleanup.

It is very unlikely we snag one of the premium DTs. Ditto Smith or Jones at OT without being able to guarantee them a starting spot. We'd now likely be sitting on $20-$25 mil (or more, depending on restructures). RT, WR3, TE1, a Reader stopgap, DT pass rush, and DB depth are all still on the table.

I'd try to take 2-3 of those off the table with what I have left. WR3 (Boyd) and TE1 (Schultz) would be my top targets. I might even bet on a Chido bounce back if the price is right. Then I can go DT/NT or CB/S on day 2 if I want to.

Henry + 1 of the above off the table is also an acceptible outcome.

D. Pass on Chase extension this year.

He does not seem in a rush & if I can spend that $7 mil or so on quality FA's to make us better this year, I will. But it would be better this year to get it done. Save $$ in long run.

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

We could use a more dynamic LB and better OL depth as well, but that is lower priority stuff.

[007BengalsFan]

(01-16-2024, 11:51 AM)casear2727 Wrote: TE
My pick: Fant, 26, 6-4 250, ok blocker with good hands and speed.

Noah Fant or Hunter Henry would be nice
Also available is the same list we have passed on previously, all would be upgrades:
Everett, Gesicki, Schultz.....

Fant had 32 receptions this year with 0 TDs 414 yards and graded out at 62.9 PFF.  Tanner Hudson had 39 receptions 1 TD 352 yard and a 73.0 PFF grade.  Im not sure spending a bunch of money on Fant is worth it when we can re-sign Hudson for much less and get similar production.

others mentioned:

Hunter Henry 42 receptions 6 TDs  419 yards PFF 69.3

Gerald Everett 51 reception 3 TDs 411 yards  PFF  65.6

Mike Gesicki   73 receptions 2 TDs 780 yards  PFF  68.7

Dalton Schultz  59 receptions 5 TDs 635 yards PFF 72.8

[casear2727]

(01-16-2024, 08:44 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Fant had 32 receptions this year with 0 TDs 414 yards and graded out at 62.9 PFF.  Tanner Hudson had 39 receptions 1 TD 352 yard and a 73.0 PFF grade.  Im not sure spending a bunch of money on Fant is worth it when we can re-sign Hudson for much less and get similar production.

others mentioned:

Hunter Henry 42 receptions 6 TDs  419 yards PFF 69.3

Gerald Everett 51 reception 3 TDs 411 yards  PFF  65.6

Mike Gesicki   73 receptions 2 TDs 780 yards  PFF  68.7

Dalton Schultz  59 receptions 5 TDs 635 yards PFF 72.8

No one in their in right mind thinks Tanner Hudson is close to Noah Fant.

Hudson will be 30 years old.  He was not drafted, runs a 4.8 forty, he has been on 4 teams none of which played him very much, he was a practice squad guy for us.  

Hudson had 50 targets for 9 ypc with a long of 26, Fant had a higher reception %, averaged 12.9 ypc. with a long of 51. 

Fant has 74 starts under his belt and is 3 years younger.  This is not a contest.   Jake Browning had better stats than Burrow, lets cut Joe and roll with Jake, that is how insane this comparison is....



Geisicki is 2 years older than Fant and has had diminishing numbers 2 years in a row.  Wouldnt hate it if we sign him.

Gerald Everett will be 30 and has decreasing numbers.  Ok with signing him.

Dalton Schultz same age as Gesicki and would be ok signing him.


Fant played with Geno Smith and three very good receivers and he was still productive, he was still a threat to defenses.  He is way more athletic than any TE on this list.  He can provide explosive plays.  Fant would be gem to sign to a 3-4 year deal with Burrow.  This TE draft class is very very poor. 


Tanner Hudson will NOT keep us from signing these guys, that is not even close to being a debate.  

[Bengal Dude]

(01-16-2024, 01:44 AM)casear2727 Wrote: TE Free Agents in 2024, age

Dalton Schultz, 28
Hunter Henry, 30
Noah Fant, 26
Gerald Everett, 30
Mike Gesicki, 29

Fant is the guy I see the Bengals going after if they choose to pursue one in free agency.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(01-17-2024, 01:33 AM)Bengal Dude Wrote: Fant is the guy I see the Bengals going after if they choose to pursue one in free agency.

He likes our QB…

Is it inaccurate to say that Joe Burrow has completely turned around the Bengals? He’s NICE bruh ??

— Noah Fant (@nrfant) January 16, 2022

[Bengal Dude]

(01-17-2024, 01:40 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: He likes our QB…

Is it inaccurate to say that Joe Burrow has completely turned around the Bengals? He’s NICE bruh ??

— Noah Fant (@nrfant) January 16, 2022

Well the stars seem to be aligning. Going off the rumors of this past draft, the Bengals are looking for an athletic TE. Hell, some media mocked him to us back in 2019.

[The D.O.Z.]

Noah Fant is intriguing to me. He's still young, was a decent prospect coming out in his draft, and I feel like his career, thus far, COULD have been a bit better with better QB play. Look at what Denver and Seattle has fielded at QB since he was drafted. Nothing against Geno Smith, but he's no Burrow. And Denver? Lol. A real Murderers Row of guys you'll have to Google. I bet he'd be a real weapon here.

What's his injury history like? He certainly looks to have the size to play in the AFCN!

[jj22]

Browns have fired their whole offensive coaching staff (except Callahan) after making the playoffs and winning 11 games with 5 starting QB's....

We can't even even fix the Oline problem.... Firing Pollack made so much sense, as the first step to approaching the offseason.

[Whatever]

(01-17-2024, 05:24 AM)The D.O.Z. Wrote: Noah Fant is intriguing to me. He's still young, was a decent prospect coming out in his draft, and I feel like his career, thus far, COULD have been a bit better with better QB play. Look at what Denver and Seattle has fielded at QB since he was drafted. Nothing against Geno Smith, but he's no Burrow. And Denver? Lol. A real Murderers Row of guys you'll have to Google. I bet he'd be a real weapon here.

What's his injury history like? He certainly looks to have the size to play in the AFCN!

Fant has missed 1 game in 4 years.

He's actually a bit undersized at 6'4", 249.  Though he will likely see a decent amount of time as a move TE instead of inline if he came here.

[TecmoBengals]

(01-17-2024, 10:02 AM)jj22 Wrote: Browns have fired their whole offensive coaching staff (except Callahan) after making the playoffs and winning 11 games with 5 starting QB's....

We can't even even fix the Oline problem.... Firing Pollack made so much sense, as the first step to approaching the offseason.

We all know the deal though with how the Brown family operates. Use whatever word or phrase you want: complacency, conservative decision-making, second/third/fourth+ chance type of people, liking consistency and routine, or seeing strength with longevity by keeping coaches. Ownership isn't quick to make changes.

I'm a fan of Taylor as the coach, but I think all leadership has to adapt. If Pollack remains then hopefully something else changes to improve how the team operates on Sundays.

[Nicomo Cosca]

Ah yes, the Browns - the team with 1 playoff win since 1995. Why can’t we be more like them dammit!

:ninja:

[jj22]

Ok, well look at the Eagles who were just in the SB and won one awhile back. Their HC is currently fighting for his job in a meeting with Ownership today.

The point. It isn't asking much to give another Oline coach a shot. Burrow career is already on shaky grounds. Why not recognize the urgency to figure out whatever it is that needs to be done to fix the Oline.

People are going to hate to hear this but Burrow's career is likely going to be over (if it isn't already with the wrist injury) after another year behind Pollacks line. The urgency is there.