(08-31-2024, 02:54 PM)Timanky12 Wrote: Yea, but the White Sox were not expected to make the playoffs, and everyone was expecting the Reds to make the playoffs.
That’s what makes this just a disappointing season, they have taken 3 steps backwards, with no hope in sight with the current  players on the roster.

Were the White Sox expected to set a new MLB record for most losses in a season. That is real futility. Reds were expected to compete for a wildcard spot which they were going into August before the injuries took their toll. No team could overcome that many injuries. The only real disappointment is not getting to see the full expected roster this season.

(08-31-2024, 05:29 PM)cinci4life Wrote: Were the White Sox expected to set a new MLB record for most losses in a season. That is real futility. Reds were expected to compete for a wildcard spot which they were going into August before the injuries took their toll. No team could overcome that many injuries. The only real disappointment is not getting to see the full expected roster this season.

The Brewers have had the exact same number of injured players this season, and more total days missed than the Reds. They’re 23 games over .500.

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/injured/_/year/2024/view/team

(08-31-2024, 04:05 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: None of our pitchers can ever handle a starter's workload. 
We haven't had someone throw 150 innings in a season since 2021. 
We have the 21st pitcher ERA in MLB.
Last year we had the 25th pitcher ERA in MLB.
In 2022 we had the 28th pitcher ERA in MLB.
OUR STARTERS HAVEN'T HAD AN ABOVE-AVERAGE BB/9 RANK SINCE 2014.

Nobody should be safe.

We need a wholesale cleanout of the entire team. From ownership to batboy.


- - - - - - - -

As for McLain, I always assumed he was going to be out for the season. They've gotten real good at repairing knees and elbows, but shoulders are still a really serious injury that can end careers if they don't go well and heal well. Them trying to rush him back while not having had a winning record in 3 months and having a setback is peak Reds. 

Your take is plenty reasonable,but I don't think the current staff and it's issues are a complete reflection of Johnson's methods.  

In reality, any team with a middling MLB payroll would have found ways to keep guys that Johnson actually had immense success with.  Sonny Gray wasn't lighting the world on fire when we brought him in.  Now he's back to being one of the better pitchers in the league.  Castillo was a no-doubt stud.  Miley returned to serviceability under Johnson.  He also did a fine job with Mahle. 

Before DJ came along, the Reds' highly drafted pitching prospects were a total disaster.  The Bob Steves, Traviesos, even the laborious development of Homer Bailey were laughingstock caliber.  

A non joke ownership group would have this staff looking much different.  You'd have a starting 5 anchored by Castillo, and Gray with Mahle eating innings.  Greene would be 3rd or 4th guy knocking on the door to being a TOR arm.  Abbott would be a great 5th starter and Lodolo would be working his issues out on the farm.  


The shape of the current rotation has a lot more to do with this team's soon to be 50 mil thrift store payroll than player development.  They've developed and even rehabilitated multiple quality players.  They just get rid of them as soon as they start earning real money.  

The 10000 foot view is just revolting.  They could sign a stud like Juan Soto to a a deal roughly the size of the total current payroll and still barely break 100 mil.  Not saying they will or even should, just trying to illustrate a point.  You can develop and draft.  It can even be the main driver of player development.  You still need to be willing to pay some talent.  

(08-31-2024, 05:29 PM)cinci4life Wrote: Were the White Sox expected to set a new MLB record for most losses in a season.

Reds were expected to compete for a wildcard spot which they were going into August before the injuries took their toll. No team could overcome that many injuries.

Yes, kind of. They lost 101 last year, cut ~$30m in payroll, and were projected to lose 100+ again by pretty much everyone. I am not sure you'll find a season pre-Opening Day team ranks list where they're not bottom-3.

The Reds haven't had a winning record since May 1st. They were never competing for a wildcard spot in August. Ownership wanted this 3rd wildcard just so bad teams could sell their fans that they were still "competing" even when they stink. Has there been a single year in Cincinnati sports history where a non-playoff season isn't blamed on injuries? As if we're the only ones ever with them and they're insurmountable obstacles.

The Reds have a longer playoff advancement drought than any other team in any of the major US professional sports. That's not injuries.

Someone at the Enquirer agrees with me, that someone else should be making player personnel decisions. Because the current upper management misses more than the hit on quality players.

(08-31-2024, 05:50 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: The Brewers have had the exact same number of injured players this season, and more total days missed than the Reds. They’re 23 games over .500.

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/injured/_/year/2024/view/team

Thank you for making my point.

The Reds are sitting at a plus 11 run differential even after the disaster of last night's game. It's been as high as 29 recently. They lose a ton of 1 run games.

This is a management/culture issue. One run losses are what you get with bad fundamentals on defense, stupid base running, and confounding lineup decisions.

(08-31-2024, 06:22 PM)samhain Wrote: The Reds are sitting at a plus 11 run differential even after the disaster of last night's game.  It's been as high as 29 recently.  They lose a ton of 1 run games.

This is a management/culture issue.  One run losses are what you get with bad fundamentals on defense, stupid base running, and confounding lineup decisions.

On August 14th, they were 60-61 after sweeping the Cardinals and had a +55 run differential . . . and then the Royals came into town.

(08-31-2024, 05:59 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote:  They were never competing for a wildcard spot in August. 

(08-31-2024, 08:05 PM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: On August 14th, they were 60-61 after sweeping the Cardinals and had a +55 run differential . . . and then the Royals came into town.

And at that point they were 2.5 back of the last wildcard spot. How exactly is that not still competing for a wildcard spot?

Marte should not go back out there on defense after that base running blunder. If he's out there, Bell has no idea how to develop talent.

(08-31-2024, 09:17 PM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: Marte should not go back out there on defense after that base running blunder. If he's out there, Bell has no idea how to develop talent.

Hello, have you been watching the Reds this year. Of coarse Bell no idea how to develop talent. They make the same stupid mistakes every game.

That's bs he was out!

Son of a..........

August is the new May!

Lack of competence trickles down from this lethargic owner/CEO. At this point, I don't think Bell matters and he is going nowhere. I do not know how to fix this team.

(09-01-2024, 03:45 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: Lack of competence trickles down from this lethargic owner/CEO.  At this point, I don't think Bell matters and he is going nowhere.  I do not know how to fix this team.

I don't think it's rocket science.  Maybe try not to have the 25th highest payroll in MLB.  Also, stop spending your money on functionally useless players like Montas, Candelario, and Pagan.  Imagine what they could have gotten if they went for a bona-fide RH bat instead of that combination of players.  

I hate rooting for failure, but I hope the meltdown this month is spectacular.  I want them to have no choice but to fire Bell.  I've said before that he wasn't the most impactful issue, but I've changed my mind.  The personnel isn't what it could be, but it's a hell of a lot better than the result they're getting on the field.  That's on the manager.  

Dumping him should be good for a minimum of 6 or 8 wins if you bring in the right replacement.

(09-01-2024, 03:45 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: Lack of competence trickles down from this lethargic owner/CEO. At this point, I don't think Bell matters and he is going nowhere. I do not know how to fix this team.

Having fully healthy regulars all back is likely a good start.

Brandon Williamson set to make his season debut. Very interested in seeing him throw the ball, he was slowly figuring it out last year.

(08-31-2024, 09:17 PM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: Marte should not go back out there on defense after that base running blunder. If he's out there, Bell has no idea how to develop talent.

They're going to have to be very careful with Marte.

He's clearly not major-league ready in terms of his professionalism or production.  He's got a great athletic base to build on but it just isn't translating.  

I'd be cautious of giving up on him.  They rode a wave of excitement about rookie call-ups when they brought him to the majors.  Unlike the others, his was probably premature. 

I hope they don't pay twice for this mistake by giving him away for peanuts.  Start him next year in AAA and let him reset.  I'd do the same with CES.  It would be easy to do if the team had the guts to sign some legit outfielders and let Steer man 1B.  

The results they have from this year should force them to adjust their view of the current rebuild.

Another base running blunder again today. When does it ever end.