I am curious, what in your opinion is the magic number? 0-4, 0-10, 0-17?

One season wouldn't do it. Not even close. You'd have to have multiple seasons where this team falls flat on its face before that discussion would even begin in the FO. He probably bought himself the better part of a decade with that SB appearance.

Only chance even with 0-17 is Burrow threatens retirement and demands a trade. MB wouldn't have the leverage he had with Carson. This would be an Ohio born kid doing this to the team would be a PR nightmare.

I am in no way upset at ZT. His team has lost 3 1 score games.

I think Lou should go. I have never been in love with this nickel based zone defense. The league seems to have figured it out, it seems way too complicated for the young guys, & the players he wants (Bengals have drafted defense horribly) aren't cutting it.... But ZT is very loyal and I don't see Lou getting the axe any time soon. And, really, for 2024 it's way too late for that.

The lack of development of young defensive guys warrants a change, let alone the absolutely bizarre games from the defense we've seen over the years.

I don't think ZT is the problem. I think the league has figured out his DC & Lou hasn't been very evolutionary on what he's doing. The sun has set on him.

(4 hours ago)PDub80 Wrote: I am in no way upset at ZT. His team has lost 3 1 score games.

I think Lou should go. I have never been in love with this nickel based zone defense. The league seems to have figured it out, it seems way too complicated for the young guys, & the players he wants (Bengals have drafted defense horribly) aren't cutting it....  But  ZT is very loyal and I don't see Lou getting the axe any time soon. And, really, for 2024 it's way too late for that.

The lack of development of young defensive guys warrants a change, let alone the absolutely bizarre games from the defense we've seen over the years.

I don't think ZT is the problem. I think the league has figured out his DC & Lou hasn't been very evolutionary on what he's doing. The sun has set on him.

The team comes out to start each year unprepared for the 1st month of the season.

It's on the coach.

Yes - The defense sucked in this game.

The offense lost us the Patriots game.

This team will lose some games with offense and some with defense. It's the hallmark of this team.

I'd be more willing to replace Lou at this point than Zac Taylor. Lou's defense has never been consistent, and they usually open games looking like some of the worst you will ever see.  

Zac's play calls are infuriating at times, but the defense is a glaring problem right now and it's tiring always hoping they get hot in the second half.

Armageddon

I would think a 4 wins (or less) in a season and a completed contract.  

Both conditions would need to be satisfied for Mike Brown (yes, not Katie) to pull the trigger.

Can't get your money's worth out of a coach if he's not coaching, right?!

My guess is MB would make Taylor give up play-calling to the Offensive Coordinator before he would flat out fire him.

(4 hours ago)Sled21 Wrote: My guess is MB would make Taylor give up play-calling to the Offensive Coordinator before he would flat out fire him.

....or tell him to part ways with his DC.

(4 hours ago)Wyche Wrote: ....or tell him to part ways with his DC.

I think MB is astute enough to realize that right now the defense is decimated by injury.

(4 hours ago)PDub80 Wrote: I am in no way upset at ZT. His team has lost 3 1 score games.

I think Lou should go. I have never been in love with this nickel based zone defense. The league seems to have figured it out, it seems way too complicated for the young guys, & the players he wants (Bengals have drafted defense horribly) aren't cutting it....  But  ZT is very loyal and I don't see Lou getting the axe any time soon. And, really, for 2024 it's way too late for that.

The lack of development of young defensive guys warrants a change, let alone the absolutely bizarre games from the defense we've seen over the years.

I don't think ZT is the problem. I think the league has figured out his DC & Lou hasn't been very evolutionary on what he's doing. The sun has set on him.

LOL. You sound like the Reds in having the worst W-L record in MLB in one-run games. There's something that attributed to that and it was terrible, ridiculous base-running day in and day out, terrible defense and trusting a BP that was in the bottom 10 in MLB. A whole bunch of that is directly on the manager. 

Why harp on Lou and not ZT? You think Lou wanted to get rid of an all pro S in Bates, get rid of Bell and a stud run defender in Reader and not signing, a year ago, a veteran(s) to replace both S's?

I'm not here to tell you that the Bengals should or need to fire ZT but there's alot of things that go into losing close, tight games. Fundamentals, coaching players up, scheme, preparation, running a disciplined team, etc. etc. and all of these involve the HC and coaching staff. 

(3 hours ago)Sled21 Wrote: I think MB is astute enough to realize that right now the defense is decimated by injury.

It is, but I would have rather them gone down swinging (i.e. blitzing the hell out of a rookie QB, stunts, etc) than sitting back in zone and rushing four when you know you have issues up front.

(4 hours ago)PDub80 Wrote: I am in no way upset at ZT. His team has lost 3 1 score games.

I think Lou should go. I have never been in love with this nickel based zone defense. The league seems to have figured it out, it seems way too complicated for the young guys, & the players he wants (Bengals have drafted defense horribly) aren't cutting it....  But  ZT is very loyal and I don't see Lou getting the axe any time soon. And, really, for 2024 it's way too late for that.

The lack of development of young defensive guys warrants a change, let alone the absolutely bizarre games from the defense we've seen over the years.

I don't think ZT is the problem. I think the league has figured out his DC & Lou hasn't been very evolutionary on what he's doing. The sun has set on him.

This isn't really very descriptive, though. Every team does this, not just Lou. Nickel is just a personnel package that is ran to match three wide receivers (typically). All NFL defenses run majority zone coverage. Or, the vast majority of them do. It takes elite CB talent to even think about going majority man coverage, and strong pass rushers. Lou's defense has multiple looks they provide depending on offensive personnel. In heavy sets, they have showed everything from a 3-4 front to 5-2 fronts. 

Lou is a creative DC on the X's and O's side. He has had some really good players, too. However, at some point, you have to have dudes on that side of the ball to make something work and the Bengals don't really have that right now. They have an atrocious defensive line outside of Hendrickson, solid linebackers and safeties that seem to be just a step behind. They have talent in the CB group. This isn't a super talented defense. When they were a more respectable defense, they had Bates in center field, arguably the best S in the league. They had a nice pass rush duo with Hill and Larry O. Awuzie was playing at a high level. 

All this to say that saying you don't like his "nickel based zone defense" is akin to saying something like "I don't like Lou because he is an NFL defensive coach." You're going to see defenses running a lot of nickel and a lot of zone on every team in the league. 

Zac serves at the pleasure of Burrow and no one else.

Where are all the Mike Zimmer fanboys?    

Him walking into browns office and saying FIRE ME. Other than that nothing

If we view it as similar to Marvin Lewis' coaching tenure then Zac won't resign or get fired until 2034.

Zac Taylor is 37-47-1. On the other 31 teams in the league this would be just cause for being shitcanned.

(5 hours ago)Awful Llama Wrote: One season wouldn't do it.  Not even close.  You'd have to have multiple seasons where this team falls flat on its face before that discussion would even begin in the FO.  He probably bought himself the better part of a decade with that SB appearance.

Forrest Gregg left the Bengals after 2 years from a SB and was probably the best HC the Bengals ever had.