"I think the expectation was keeping those guys together would net, and it didn't. And maybe I needed to influx. Maybe I needed to change more of that going in, but we ran it back with a lot of guys, and it just didn't come together." - Duke Tobin https://t.co/AbsgeTpPfj

— Kelsey Conway (@KelseyLConway) January 29, 2025

  

 

Congrats, Duke! Admitting that there's a problem is the first step toward finding a solution.

(01-29-2025, 03:01 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Congrats, Duke! Admitting that there's a problem is the first step toward finding a solution.

totally!!!

(01-29-2025, 02:56 PM)pally Wrote:

"I think the expectation was keeping those guys together would net, and it didn't. And maybe I needed to influx. Maybe I needed to change more of that going in, but we ran it back with a lot of guys, and it just didn't come together." - Duke Tobin https://t.co/AbsgeTpPfj

— Kelsey Conway (@KelseyLConway) January 29, 2025

  

 

Who was he referring to specifically?
The only one I can think of would be Hubbard. Maybe Pratt?
I thought BJ Hill and Mike Hilton played fine.

Hubbard did have 6 sacks the year prior though, which was around his typical yearly production, so I can't imagine they would have thought to dump him due to declined performance.

Maybe he was referring more to the coaches?

(01-29-2025, 03:34 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Who was he referring to specifically?
The only one I can think of would be Hubbard. Maybe Pratt?
I thought BJ Hill and Mike Hilton played fine.

Hubbard did have 6 sacks the year prior though, which was around his typical yearly production, so I can't imagine they would have thought to dump him due to declined performance.

Maybe he was referring more to the coaches?

Hubbard, Hilton, Cappa, going back to Bell, Pratt potentially, Sample (hodgepodge of TE), Maybe he is talking about hanging on to Mixon as long as they did, Could maybe even look at Jonah. Sounds like this is a look back at essentially now all the way back to the SB. I wonder if he is even acknowledging there could have been guys you could have moved for some value at various times he didn't (think Bates).

(01-29-2025, 03:37 PM)Au165 Wrote: Hubbard, Hilton, Cappa, going back to Bell, Pratt potentially, Sample (hodgepodge of TE), Maybe he is talking about hanging on to Mixon as long as they did, Could maybe even look at Jonah. Sounds like this is a look back at essentially now all the way back to the SB. I wonder if he is even acknowledging there could have been guys you could have moved for some value at various times he didn't (think Bates).

Quote mentions a conversation where Tobin was speaking about the core of the Superbowl defense.

Tobin just leaning over and getting the answers off someone else's test?  

https://apnews.com/article/indianapolis-colts-ballard-nfl-2519a6fa88cb2d89999a31b6362cca38

Quote:“I thought we were playing really good football at the end of last season, lost a tough game at the end to Houston, could have gone either way,” Ballard said. “So I said, ‘OK, we’re trending up’ and instead of really creating competition throughout the roster and throwing new blood into the locker room, I said ‘We’re going to run it back.’ That was a mistake.”

(01-29-2025, 03:40 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Quote mentions a conversation where Tobin was speaking about the core of the Superbowl defense.

Interesting missed that. I do think they it was potentially not invest in DT while they had Reader, not going to get another CB maybe in FA, and not figuring out a better plan at safety. I mean heck even look at DE not ever really figuring out a plan there across from Trey. There were opportunities for that "influx" of proven talent but they never really wanted to do that.

(01-29-2025, 03:42 PM)Au165 Wrote: Interesting missed that. I do think they it was potentially not invest in DT while they had Reader, not going to get another CB maybe in FA, and not figuring out a better plan at safety. I mean heck even look at DE not ever really figuring out a plan there across from Trey. There were opportunities for that "influx" of proven talent but they never really wanted to do that.

I think a big one was relying on Cordell Volson to "improve" for a couple off-seasons without adding any kinda competition or depth at the position.

(01-29-2025, 02:56 PM)pally Wrote:

"I think the expectation was keeping those guys together would net, and it didn't. And maybe I needed to influx. Maybe I needed to change more of that going in, but we ran it back with a lot of guys, and it just didn't come together." - Duke Tobin https://t.co/AbsgeTpPfj

— Kelsey Conway (@KelseyLConway) January 29, 2025

  

 

Held on to Bates and Reader too long too...

The major issue was Tobin’s young draft picks didn’t step up Murphy , Zac Carter , Cam Britt-Taylor , DJ Turner, Battle, Volson. Stone and Rankins were new high priced additions and both disasters. He lets a stud in his prime like Bates walk and replaces Reader with Rankins and he says he held on to some guys too long ? Maybe losing the guys you let walk is the bigger issue and your crappy drafts.

(01-29-2025, 03:37 PM)Au165 Wrote: Hubbard, Hilton, Cappa, going back to Bell, Pratt potentially, Sample (hodgepodge of TE), Maybe he is talking about hanging on to Mixon as long as they did, Could maybe even look at Jonah. Sounds like this is a look back at essentially now all the way back to the SB. I wonder if he is even acknowledging there could have been guys you could have moved for some value at various times he didn't (think Bates).

The quoted question was specifically about the defense though.

"The biggest takeaway I had from my convo with him was that they tried to keep the core of the SB defense together & now realized they held on to a few players a little too long"

I guess when I hear them say holding on for too long, Bell wouldn't be part of that because he did leave for a year.

I didn't personally think there was anything wrong with keeping the guys they had going into last season.
The problem was more that they haven't developed hardly any of the young guys to take over.

DB room had declined with the losses of Awuzie and especially Bates.
DL depth was not good.

He has to be thinking of Hubbard as one of those guys. I never believed they would cut him but maybe they will.
At the very least restructure to make him count less against the cap and easier to get rid of down the road.

Even during his prime Hubbard was never a great pass rusher but now they have to get someone who can provide some pressure to help Trey. I believe we can now all say with confidence that Murphy isn’t that guy…

(01-29-2025, 03:45 PM)Synric Wrote: I think a big one was relying on Cordell Volson to "improve" for a couple off-seasons without adding any kinda competition or depth at the position.

Others have pointed out the embedded tweet below mentions defense.

feels like he's trying to trick the fans with this statement

(01-29-2025, 03:52 PM)ochocincos Wrote: The quoted question was specifically about the defense though.

"The biggest takeaway I had from my convo with him was that they tried to keep the core of the SB defense together & now realized they held on to a few players a little too long"

I guess when I hear them say holding on for too long, Bell wouldn't be part of that because he did leave for a year.

I didn't personally think there was anything wrong with keeping the guys they had going into last season.
The problem was more that they haven't developed hardly any of the young guys to take over.

DB room had declined with the losses of Awuzie and especially Bates.
DL depth was not good.

Awuzie wasn't good after his injury that was just a crappy fact of how dudes decline. I don't know I think there is plenty of regret in bringing Bell back. I also go to his "influx" comment and say I think he regrets maybe not swapping some out. In terms of development, I think that is why they went with a new staff. We can look back in hindsight and claim all the picks were bad but plenty were well thought of and our staff got nothing out of them.

I think the real problem was he got rid of good players, hoping to replace them with cheaper players, so he can make deals with Burrow and Chase and maybe Teggins. Seems only Burrow and that was really a "given"... so he not only has he failed in that respect, the replacement players he got for the defense, were too green, too little, too late. He should have fire himself instead of sending Anarumo out the door.

(01-29-2025, 03:42 PM)Au165 Wrote: Interesting missed that. I do think they it was potentially not invest in DT while they had Reader, not going to get another CB maybe in FA, and not figuring out a better plan at safety. I mean heck even look at DE not ever really figuring out a plan there across from Trey. There were opportunities for that "influx" of proven talent but they never really wanted to do that.

I think that the plan was for Cam Sample or Joseph Ossai to develop into the role. That didn't happen, Sam is looking washed from injuries with still a hole to fill.

(01-29-2025, 03:55 PM)Au165 Wrote: Others have pointed out the embedded tweet below mentions defense.

Maybe but the point still stands lol.

They let two of their top three defensive players go  from the Superbowl defense go and seem willingly to let Trey go next off-season. I'm sorry but Duke sounds like  a dumbass here and doesn't understand how his own roster was built.