I think this is a huge year for Duke.

The front office needs to have some accountability if they expect the coaches and players to follow suit. That is hard to do if it's a family member making all the decisions.

I saw Mike Brown sitting in the draft room front and center. So idk what actually took place and has been taking place. If they have allowed Duke to be the actual architect, if he has been the architect, and if he is indeed the driving force responsible for assembling our roster. Then he deserves the accountability that should come with the pay check.

If we stay relatively healthy and miss the playoffs should we fire Duke?

I feel like there's two different questions here. One in the title and one in the poll.

Should Tobin be fired if we miss the playoffs for a third consecutive season? Yes.
Is Tobin on the hotseat? No, and he will never be. He's not even the "GM". (Or at least not so long as Mike Brown is alive.)

The Bengals hot seat is the seat warmers set on high in my wife’s Subaru.

Bring out….the Comfy Chair!!!

Tobin should already be fired years ago. So yes. Should.

But also... won't.

As long as Mike Brown is alive Duke Tobin’s job is safe

Definitely not.

Tobin should definitely be on the hot seat. If Zac is fired for not making the playoffs at some point it’s on Tobin. We’ve had 4 offensive line coaches since 2018 because Tobin went 13 years without drafting a good one. We fired the DC and d-line coach even tho we have a ton of young high draft picks on defense. I get working for Mike Brown is hard but he literally just needs to draft good young guys on rookie deals. I’m not even talking about free agency and what he is or isn’ allowed to spend. The scouting department is small ok ? So small you can’t even hit on early round picks ?
I liked Mims good pick but he went 13 years without hitting on a lineman. Been a lot more misses than hits when you look at the last few drafts.

No, Duke gets to work with the Bengals organization until he decides to retire or walk away. The Brown family won't cut ties with him.

(Yesterday, 09:39 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: No, Duke gets to work with the Bengals organization until he decides to retire or walk away. The Brown family won't cut ties with him.

Exactly

I remember another NFL person saying a couple years ago if Tobin lost his job today he'd get hired as a GM by somebody else tomorrow. Or in other words I agree with them and don't believe Tobin is the real problem here.

(Yesterday, 09:43 AM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Exactly

I remember another NFL person saying a couple years ago if Tobin lost his job today he'd get hired as a GM by somebody else tomorrow. Or in other words I agree with them and don't believe Tobin is the real problem here.

From our outside perspective as fans, and for decades now, I've always found it hard to develop any concrete opinions about the front office, coaching, or players because inevitably there is the lingering question about how much Mike Brown is heavy handed and, excuse my vulgar language, ***** shit up.

I can't determine if Duke sucks or is good at his job. He doesn't have the actual GM title, access to resources (scouting) that real GMs have, and, for all we know, is constantly overruled by the Owner-GM. I think I've read more Hobson articles going on about how a former coach advised to draft a player more than Duke made the pick (Alexander and OL, for example). That's messed up.

ZT will befired before Tobin is fired.

Tobin aint going anywhere.

We should have fired Duke a long time ago.

If the team and Burrow stay healthy and miss the playoffs for the 3rd straight year, then Zac and Duke should both be canned. Will they be? Not a chance. Look how long the front office kept Lewis around and he didn't even win a playoff game or take the team to a Super Bowl. I hope we don't have to call for their heads. I hope we finally get off to a fast start and get back into the playoffs. If you're a fan of this team, you must have hope because a lot of the time, that's all we have.

(Yesterday, 09:52 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: From our outside perspective as fans, and for decades now, I've always found it hard to develop any concrete opinions about the front office, coaching, or players because inevitably there is the lingering question about how much Mike Brown is heavy handed and, excuse my vulgar language, ***** shit up.

I can't determine if Duke sucks or is good at his job. He doesn't have the actual GM title, access to resources (scouting) that real GMs have, and, for all we know, is constantly overruled by the Owner-GM. I think I've read more Hobson articles going on about how a former coach advised to draft a player more than Duke made the pick (Alexander and OL, for example). That's messed up.

Agree, nI don't believe Tobin has the final say in many cases. So I kinda give him a break.

Oh I think all teams have a "draft panel, think tank" but the GM has the final word. I don't believe Tobin carries as much weight as most true GM's.

(Yesterday, 12:11 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Agree, nI don't believe Tobin has the final say in many cases. So I kinda give him a break.

Oh I think all teams have a "draft panel, think tank" but the GM has the final word. I don't believe Tobin carries as much weight as most true GM's.

In conversations like the one we are having, I always think about the Hard Knocks episode where Mike Brown suggested the DE be moved to TE based on his athleticism. It exemplified how Brown likes to be in the decision-making weeds.

Duke is on the hot seat as much as Katie is..he's a permanent fixture.

Yes, his drafting and philosophy on team building as a whole is our biggest problem.

(Yesterday, 09:52 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: From our outside perspective as fans, and for decades now, I've always found it hard to develop any concrete opinions about the front office, coaching, or players because inevitably there is the lingering question about how much Mike Brown is heavy handed and, excuse my vulgar language, ***** shit up.

I can't determine if Duke sucks or is good at his job. He doesn't have the actual GM title, access to resources (scouting) that real GMs have, and, for all we know, is constantly overruled by the Owner-GM. I think I've read more Hobson articles going on about how a former coach advised to draft a player more than Duke made the pick (Alexander and OL, for example). That's messed up.

Pretty much nailed my thoughts on the subject. Hard to judge who has the power to do what around here. I think Mikey Boy has a lot less say 
than he used to as he is almost 90 years old, but he still signs off on everything. Duke hasn't hit on OL picks for years until Mims just last year
though, but even then, what did the OL Coach's opinions have to do with this? The few scouts we DO have? Or Katie, the Blackburns or the other 
coaches? Even a former OL coach in PA had advice that evidently was a part of the reason for picking Carman, as you say Tecmo.

Just a strange situation and no Duke is not on the hotseat.

(Yesterday, 02:40 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: In conversations like the one we are having, I always think about the Hard Knocks episode where Mike Brown suggested the DE be moved to TE based on his athleticism. It exemplified how Brown likes to be in the decision-making weeds.

you remember why they were having that conversation right? They had ZERO Healthy TEs for that days practice.

(Yesterday, 03:07 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I feel like there's two different questions here. One in the title and one in the poll.

Should Tobin be fired if we miss the playoffs for a third consecutive season? Yes.
Is Tobin on the hotseat? No, and he will never be. He's not even the "GM". (Or at least not so long as Mike Brown is alive.)

I'm with you, but there's also non-Duke Tobin related reasons why we could miss the playoffs. Just sayin'.

But, generally speaking, yes he SHOULD be fired if we miss the playoffs and he will never be fired if Mike Brown still has a say in what happens in this organization.