(05-22-2025, 06:38 PM)schroomytunes Wrote: I disagree I think the line is much more improved over last year. Is it a top end unit? No but I do think it is in that 15ish range. IMO. Brown only played 3 games last year so I really don't even count him.

Starters: OBJ, Fairchild, Karras, Patrick, Mims

Backups: Ford, Lee, Volson, Rivers, Cochran

PS/PUP:  Kirkland, McLaughlin, Etienne, Steuber

FA: Jedrick Wills- he's still young, maybe not a great fit in Cleveland. he could be a guy to take a gamble on and see on a 1 yr deal

The thing that gives me pause w/ Wills is Peters spent 3 years w/ him in CLV and doesn't seem to want him. I would have loved for Peters to come in and banged the table for Jed

I can't believe all these players we thought would surely get cut Moss, Stone, Volson are returning, and it's been decided before training camp even started.

(Yesterday, 08:44 AM)jj22 Wrote: I can't believe all these players we thought would surely get cut Moss, Stone, Volson are returning, and it's been decided before training camp even started.

It could still happen. A lot of time for things to change before the season begins.

(Yesterday, 09:21 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: It could still happen. A lot of time for things to change before the season begins.

I don't think they'd get guaranteed money if they were going to get cut still. But maybe. I thought when Moss restructured there was still a chance he'll get cut but the more this happens and the more they give guaranteed money to these supposed fringe roster players I'm thinking it means they stick. 

(05-22-2025, 05:13 PM)samhain Wrote: It's been said that Volson is favored by the staff.  This was true of Pollack for sure and probably extends up the chain.  I heard Rapien talk about it the other day.  He's the type of player that keeps his head down, doesn't run his mouth, and works his butt off.  

This is bad IMO.  His talent level is still below average.  He's got literally everything you want except talent.  Sometimes the off-field and intangible stuff are overrated.  It seems like a forest for trees thing with the staff.  He's really great at every aspect of being a pro football player without actually being good at football.  

No doubt. It's just, they haven't signed 2 Guards that are obvious upgrades.

As I don't have to build a roster with a salary cap, a lot of fans just look at it like get the best player at every position. But, you just can't. That said, I think there are guys out there now like Scherff that could be signed that are upgrades.

The think is, Volson is a $3.8 million cap hit. You waive him and use that money and a little more and get Scherff.

But, I don't know. Maybe Scherff wouldn't come here.

(05-22-2025, 10:48 PM)bfine32 Wrote: The thing that gives me pause w/ Wills is Peters spent 3 years w/ him in CLV and doesn't seem to want him. I would have loved for Peters to come in and banged the table for Jed

 You could say the same about Scherff from their time together in Washington. 

(05-22-2025, 06:38 PM)schroomytunes Wrote: I disagree I think the line is much more improved over last year. Is it a top end unit? No but I do think it is in that 15ish range. IMO. Brown only played 3 games last year so I really don't even count him.

Starters: OBJ, Fairchild, Karras, Patrick, Mims

Backups: Ford, Lee, Volson, Rivers, Cochran

PS/PUP:  Kirkland, McLaughlin, Etienne, Steuber

FA: Jedrick Wills- he's still young, maybe not a great fit in Cleveland. he could be a guy to take a gamble on and see on a 1 yr deal

IDK if we carry 10 OL this year or not. 9 may be the number. 

Agree on the starters: OBJ, Fairchild, Karras, Patrick, Mims. Or at least that is who they envision starting. But they aren't sure because they cheaped out in FA and only signed a borderline starter (Patrick) and waited until the 3rd forca guard (Faichild) who they *think* will start  but are not sure. 

So keeping Volson & Ford as insurance is now mandated. Of course, somply releasing Volson + Moss would have likely paid for Hernandez or Risner (or Jenkins), and maybe even Scherff. Pratt + Volson or Moss surely would. 

And of course, Burrow has offered to restructure as well. And the Chase/Higgins deals could have saved another $11 mil in cap. 

$19 for Burrow resteucture, $11 for Chase/Tee, and around $12-$13 for Pratt/Moss/Volson releases. Mikey does not have the cash flow for all 3, but I don't think 1 of 3 was asking to much. 

This way, Mikey can claim limited space in Trey negotiations and then claim all the FAs worth signing are gone when we finally release Pratt, and pocket the money for a year. 

We'll never win anything while Mike & Katie are in charge. 

(05-22-2025, 05:28 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: I am not a big believer in the ability of coach Peters to turn mediocrity into magnificence. NE sucked last year, their OL sucked, and he got fired.

Fairchild + Patrick with Ford, Volson, & Rivers as backups could be better than last year, but not by much.

And OT depth is actually worse with Brown gone.

Now, we are certainly healthier at some spots (CB), but not all (TE).

On paper, atm, most improved: NT, LB, RB, DE, OG, C depth.

Same: QB, WR, PK  P,  LS.

Worse: CB (better health, worse depth), S depth, OT depth, 3T, TE (All injury).

Now, I get we are counting on some improvement from some younger players (Iosivas, Burton, Jenkins, Jackson, D. Hill, Turner, Newton, Battle), and scheme/coaching cjanges to help us, but I really don't think we improved much roster-wise.

Our biggest "gains" have been in signing our own FA's (Higgins, Hill, Gesicki, Ossai, Ford, C. Sample, Rehkow, Adomitis), and extensions (Chase, D. Hill 5th year).

Not a big fan of any of the salary cutting renegotiations. Stone is the most understandable, as he is a starter AND has a productive NFL history, and we have zero S depth. But Moss & Volson are backups..Much rather have had the full $$ and turned that into another G, or S, or paying Trey. Perhaps 2 of 3.

I question the value of the new coach as well.  Last time I checked, the Bengals are a football team.  They aren't a Brazilian jiu jitsu organization.  IDGAF about MMA when it comes to protecting Burrow. I want a competent OL.  If NFL OL play was as simple as taking mid rounders and borderline starters then  teaching them MMA horseshit we'd have it made.  I hate to break it to you guys, but it probably isn't.

You can bring whatever gimmicks you want.  If you can't teach guys to protect the qb, it's just annoying anecdotal drivel.  It's not magic.

To that end, blaming coaches is an excuse that they are burning hard.  What happens when everyone begins to realize that to win, you actually need good football players?

(9 hours ago)samhain Wrote: I question the value of the new coach as well.  Last time I checked, the Bengals are a football team.  They aren't a Brazilian jiu jitsu organization.  IDGAF about MMA when it comes to protecting Burrow. I want a competent OL.  If NFL OL play was as simple as taking mid rounders and borderline starters then  teaching them MMA horseshit we'd have it made.  I hate to break it to you guys, but it probably isn't.

You can bring whatever gimmicks you want.  If you can't teach guys to protect the qb, it's just annoying anecdotal drivel.  It's not magic.

To that end, blaming coaches is an excuse that they are burning hard.  What happens when everyone begins to realize that to win, you actually need good football players?

Why does everyone act like we are the worst f**king team in the NFL?