(02-17-2016, 04:44 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: OrlandoBengal said nothing about winning a super bowl though.

Honestly I've been a fan long enough to see the mood of players on crap teams and it's not good. Losing sucks and it's definitely hard on the players. So there's something to be said for being on a "winning team", whether or not the Bengals are viewed as Super Bowl contenders.

Money trumps everything though, for most players. If a bad team offers 7 million per and more guaranteed money (the reason we lost JJo) and the Bengals offer 5-6 and less guaranteed, say bye to MLJ.

I hear you, but I can see why being disappointed 2 or 3 weeks later might not be worth 2 million bucks.  Still, I don't know how players view the Bengals...maybe they are seen as a contender, and maybe they're seen as the winning-est dead-end in the NFL.

(02-17-2016, 05:26 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I hear you, but I can see why being disappointed 2 or 3 weeks later might not be worth 2 million bucks.  Still, I don't know how players view the Bengals...maybe they are seen as a contender, and maybe they're seen as the winning-est dead-end in the NFL.

As frustrated as I get with the playoff losses, I imagine 12-4 and a playoff L is a little easier to stomach than having to face the media 12-13 times after a loss every year. That stuff really seems to wear out players and coaches mentally.

You and I seem to agree that money trumps all though, for these players. I don't think MLJ would hesitate to join the Browns for 1-2 extra mil.

(02-17-2016, 05:44 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: As frustrated as I get with the playoff losses, I imagine 12-4 and a playoff L is a little easier to stomach than having to face the media 12-13 times after a loss every year. That stuff really seems to wear out players and coaches mentally.

You and I seem to agree that money trumps all though, for these players. I don't think MLJ would hesitate to join the Browns for 1-2 extra mil.

Agreed.  Then again, if many fans and the media see Mike Brown and Marvin Lewis as a dead-end to real success I would imagine some players caught on, too.  We all know the Browns aren't going to catch fire and win anything, but it seems like every year some other team leapfrogs us when it comes to playoff success.  I'm a pessimist though, so perhaps I'm going overboard.

(02-17-2016, 04:44 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: OrlandoBengal said nothing about winning a super bowl though.

No, but Nately did as an aside tot he original topic, and that's who I was answering. It's an interesting question: is this a destination for those looking to win a championship? I cannot imagine it being so, but players may consider different critera than our playoff record.

(02-17-2016, 10:29 PM)Awful Llama Wrote: No, but Nately did as an aside tot he original topic, and that's who I was answering.  It's an interesting question:  is this a destination for those looking to win a championship?  I cannot imagine it being so, but players may consider different critera than our playoff record.

I just assumed the idea of "winning" involved making a push at a championship.  I can't honestly expect a player to say "Well, I'll take a 2 million dollar paycut to go to Cincy and get 10 or more wins!"

(02-18-2016, 01:44 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I just assumed the idea of "winning" involved making a push at a championship.  I can't honestly expect a player to say "Well, I'll take a 2 million dollar paycut to go to Cincy and get 10 or more wins!"

Many players know we are capable of making a run in the playoffs.  Unlike some fans they realize that the past does not 100% control the future.

(02-17-2016, 05:44 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: As frustrated as I get with the playoff losses, I imagine 12-4 and a playoff L is a little easier to stomach than having to face the media 12-13 times after a loss every year. That stuff really seems to wear out players and coaches mentally.

You and I seem to agree that money trumps all though, for these players. I don't think MLJ would hesitate to join the Browns for 1-2 extra mil.

At the end of the day, I think it is about the money.  Say it is an extra $2 million per year over five years, with an extra $4-5 in guaranteed money.  That is life changing, it is more than 95% of the population will make in their entire lives.  Losing and facing the media on Sunday is probably a lot easier when you think of the automatic deposit that will be sitting in your account on Monday morning!

(02-16-2016, 05:13 PM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: I think you hit it on the head.  We must remember that this is a business.  Winning is important, but what is more important when you retire?  Having been on a winning team, or an extra $7-10 million in the bank?  You probably have better stories from a winning team, but that money means that you and your family should be set for life.

The "lifespan" of an NFL player is very short.  These guys have to make the most of the opportunity while it exists and no one should blame them for doing so.

(02-16-2016, 09:37 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I'm not an NFL player so I don't know this for sure, but do you think the Cincinnati Bengals are brought up when players think of "taking less to go to a team that can get me a ring?"  Serious question.  Making the playoffs 5 years in a row and 6 of the last 7 years is great and all, but I wouldn't be surprised if the Bengals weren't mentioned as one of those championship destinations.  Nor do I think Marvin Jones going to the LA Rams would be met with cries of "Well, there goes his chance to win a ring!" etc.  Just saying.  Maybe things change soon, though.

(02-16-2016, 10:09 PM)Awful Llama Wrote: I can't see us being a destination in that repect.  Yeah, we win in the regular season, but if you've made your bank and now you want a ring before you hang up your cleats, 0-7 in thr playoffs can't be a selling point.

(02-17-2016, 04:44 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: OrlandoBengal said nothing about winning a super bowl though.

Honestly I've been a fan long enough to see the mood of players on crap teams and it's not good. Losing sucks and it's definitely hard on the players. So there's something to be said for being on a "winning team", whether or not the Bengals are viewed as Super Bowl contenders.

Money trumps everything though, for most players. If a bad team offers 7 million per and more guaranteed money (the reason we lost JJo) and the Bengals offer 5-6 and less guaranteed, say bye to MLJ.

(02-17-2016, 10:29 PM)Awful Llama Wrote: No, but Nately did as an aside tot he original topic, and that's who I was answering.  It's an interesting question:  is this a destination for those looking to win a championship?  I cannot imagine it being so, but players may consider different critera than our playoff record.

Look. Nately was quoting and responding to something Orlando said, - and Orlando said nothing about Super Bowls. He said "winning team". Being a "winning team" doesn't require winning Super Bowls or even playoff games. That's why I said what I said. If a free agent is deciding between say...the Browns and Bengals - and the money is even - I think the Bengals are going to be the preferred destination every time because they're winning consistently and the Browns...are the Browns.

Are the Bengals viewed as a place to go to win championships? Probably not, but I don't think many teams are viewed that way except for New England and up til now, whichever team Peyton played for. There's no debating whether or not the Bengals are viewed as a "winning" team though, and I'm sure that's at least somewhat of a factor in the minds of free agents. Although - again - nothing trumps $$$.

(02-18-2016, 12:17 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Many players know we are capable of making a run in the playoffs.  Unlike some fans they realize that the past does not 100% control the future.

I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's hard to leave the past behind when Marvin Lewis and Mike Brown are both here forever.  Maybe people are skeptical we can break through this ceiling we seem to be hitting every year.

(02-18-2016, 04:29 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's hard to leave the past behind when Marvin Lewis and Mike Brown are both here forever.  

NFL players don't care that Marvin lost a playoff game ten years ago or that Jeff Fisher went to a Super Bowl 12 years ago.  Instead they look at the team's chances THIS YEAR.

(02-18-2016, 04:29 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's hard to leave the past behind when Marvin Lewis and Mike Brown are both here forever.  Maybe people are skeptical we can break through this ceiling we seem to be hitting every year.

If getting a ring is a free agent's top priority, he is not coming to Cincinnati.  It would be almost foolish for anyone to think that would be the case.  Regardless of what is possible, it has been almost three decades since the team won a playoff game.  Yes, they now consistently make the playoffs, but that is as far as they get.  If you're looking for a championship I think you go to New England, Seattle, Pittsburgh, Denver, maybe Green Bay, etc.

(02-18-2016, 04:41 PM)fredtoast Wrote: NFL players don't care that Marvin lost a playoff game ten years ago or that Jeff Fisher went to a Super Bowl 12 years ago.  Instead they look at the team's chances THIS YEAR.

And yet every year we hear how the Rams and Bengals are going to turn it around and they both stall out in the same place.  I feel like players might notice this.

Well apparently we're looking at also losing Sanu. The Giants are big fans of him so I imagine they'll overpay for him.

(02-18-2016, 04:48 PM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: If getting a ring is a free agent's top priority, he is not coming to Cincinnati.  It would be almost foolish for anyone to think that would be the case.  Regardless of what is possible, it has been almost three decades since the team won a playoff game.  Yes, they now consistently make the playoffs, but that is as far as they get.  If you're looking for a championship I think you go to New England, Seattle, Pittsburgh, Denver, maybe Green Bay, etc.

Sadly if the money were the same I wouldn't leave Dallas, Minnesota, Houston, Indy, both NY, Philly (others?) as destinations a FA would pick over us either regardless of our 5 year regular season record. Hell maybe even Miami because it's Miami. If only we had a wall of honor or something. Heritage, we desperately need some nice heritage here in Bengal land.

(02-18-2016, 05:37 PM)Bengal Dude Wrote: Well apparently we're looking at also losing Sanu. The Giants are big fans of him so I imagine they'll overpay for him.

Fine. They can sign Sanu and we can sign Reuben Randle. 

Sanu pretty much said he is gone.

(02-18-2016, 12:29 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Look. Nately was quoting and responding to something Orlando said, - and Orlando said nothing about Super Bowls. He said "winning team". Being a "winning team" doesn't require winning Super Bowls or even playoff games. That's why I said what I said. If a free agent is deciding between say...the Browns and Bengals - and the money is even - I think the Bengals are going to be the preferred destination every time because they're winning consistently and the Browns...are the Browns.

Are the Bengals viewed as a place to go to win championships? Probably not, but I don't think many teams are viewed that way except for New England and up til now, whichever team Peyton played for. There's no debating whether or not the Bengals are viewed as a "winning" team though, and I'm sure that's at least somewhat of a factor in the minds of free agents. Although - again - nothing trumps $$$.

What exactly is your problem? I answered Nately's question which was - as I said before - an aside to the original question. That's why I said what I said. Christ, get over it already.

(02-18-2016, 04:41 PM)fredtoast Wrote: NFL players don't care that Marvin lost a playoff game ten years ago or that Jeff Fisher went to a Super Bowl 12 years ago.  Instead they look at the team's chances THIS YEAR.

Agree with this 100% unless the money is outrageously different.   

But will Bengals seek FA impact players ?

From looks of it, we could lose both wide receivers...

Yikes..

(02-18-2016, 10:26 PM)Awful Llama Wrote: What exactly is your problem?  I answered Nately's question which was - as I said before - an aside to the original question.  That's why I said what I said.  Christ, get over it already.

I was just explaining to you that the original question in that chain of replies was started by Orlando, not Nately.

Nately just kind of twisted what Orlando said. Whatever though, I won't respond again.