(05-02-2016, 05:16 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Deuce Lutui, but I am not surer Paul was the guy who wanted him.  He went to the Titans and started for them.

But what is your point?  Bill Belichik signed Albert Haynesworth and Ochocinco.

The Bengals are known for relying heavily on their coaches to scout players.  I hope the front office isn't signing free agents without consulting with the coaches . . . which would indicate an additional problem to Paul's poor scouting.  As to my point, Deuce's cup size is bigger than Andre Smith's and Mathis was never as fat or out of shape as either of those two.

(05-02-2016, 03:56 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Andre Smith also struggled in run blocking last year.  If Bodine was the entire problem then we would have been more successful running off tackle.

You don't have to be a coach to see that.

I wonder if Smith missed having Gresham around to help block.

Eifert's downfield routes and lesser blocking skills surely had some impact.

I'll take the trade off for Eifert's receptions but Gresham was a decent blocker even if he was a knucklehead.

(05-02-2016, 05:18 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I knew he must have been a good coach because he saw how good Livings was.

Livings was injured and placed on IR before he was released before the '13 season.  He started every game he played with the Cowboys before that.  He had knee surgery after the '12 season.

He washed out of the NFL because of injury.

Per sources, his recovery time was expected to be 2-4 weeks.  That's a simple clean out.  He sucked in Cincy.  He sucked in Dallas and was expected to be beat out by a 2nd year UDFA Ronald Leary.  Putting him on IR cleared roster space.  Claiming he washed out secondary to injury is as out of touch with reality as your defense of Alexander and Bratkowski.

(05-02-2016, 03:56 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Andre Smith also struggled in run blocking last year.  If Bodine was the entire problem then we would have been more successful running off tackle.

You don't have to be a coach to see that.

Great point. Where's Andre now?

(05-02-2016, 05:46 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Per sources, his recovery time was expected to be 2-4 weeks.  That's a simple clean out.  He sucked in Cincy.  He sucked in Dallas and was expected to be beat out by a 2nd year UDFA Ronald Leary.  Putting him on IR cleared roster space.  Claiming he washed out secondary to injury is as out of touch with reality as your defense of Alexander and Bratkowski.

Recovery time for which procedure?  He had surgery after the '12 season because he had played through that season with an injury.  Then he had another procedure before training camp.

Cowboys took a salary cap hit when they released him.  He washed out because he was injured. 

(05-02-2016, 04:17 PM)Wyche Wrote:  PA needs to go if he thinks he can compare Bodine's mediocrity to the play of Richie Braham.

Bodeine has done more at this stage of his career than Braham had.

That is the point PA was making.  Don't know why you all can't grasp that..  Our O-line was total crap Brahams first two seasons yet he never even got to play.

All of you guys would have cut Braham before he had a chance to shine for us, yet you all claim you know more about O-linemen than PA.  What a joke.

(05-02-2016, 05:54 PM)TGISunday Wrote: Great point. 

Thanks for admittibg I was corret.

(05-02-2016, 05:54 PM)TGISunday Wrote: Where's Andre now?

The same place Bodine may be when his contract is up.

(05-02-2016, 06:01 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Bodeine has done more at this stage of his career than Braham had.

That is the point PA was making.  Don't know why you all can't grasp that..  Our O-line was total crap Brahams first two seasons yet he never even got to play.

All of you guys would have cut Braham before he had a chance to shine for us, yet you all claim you know more about O-linemen than PA.  What a joke.

Not playing Braham doesn't really help your argument for PA's eye for starting talent.

Game 1 of 2016 I expect Bodine to be the starting C. That said, I also expect a vigorous competition between him and Westerman.

(05-02-2016, 05:32 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: The Bengals are known for relying heavily on their coaches to scout players.  I hope the front office isn't signing free agents without consulting with the coaches . . . which would indicate an additional problem to Paul's poor scouting.  As to my point, Deuce's cup size is bigger than Andre Smith's and Mathis was never as fat or out of shape as either of those two.

Paul probably scouted him from film and had no idea that he had gotten so fat.

Lutui was a pretty good player.  He was a 2nd round draft pick that started for years for the Cards.

(05-02-2016, 06:12 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: Not playing Braham doesn't really help your argument for PA's eye for starting talent.

Sure it does.  Braham took a while to develop.  He was actually released by the team that drafted him (Arizona), but even though he was not yet a finished product Paul saw the potential in him.  Just like he sees the potential in Bodine.

(05-02-2016, 03:42 PM)3wt Wrote: That is my issue.   Any other position on the field they're going to look at raising the floor of the room.  It's not like TJ Johnson is knocking on the door at the center position and he is a dubious backup.

To me it's irresponsible not to foster better competition and improve your depth.  I know I'm reading into whether they didn't bring someone in because it might threaten Bodine, but I don't see any other logical reason why they did not apparently try.   If Westerman is that guy then great.   But if it's going to take him a year or more to get up to speed with the position I would say he is NOT that guy.

As far as Alexander's rant, I don't think it was just the Westerman question but the constant question by fans and the media as to whether Bodine is competent.   But he did not need to get snide about it and throw his best O Lineman under the bus.  It's not like Whit has been questioning Bodine publicly.

(05-02-2016, 03:47 PM)McC Wrote: Well said.  It comes down to this...Are you willing to let one position stand between you and a SB?  The running game goes nowhere because the NT lives in the backfield.  You don't even need to be a coach to see that.

Very brilliant posts. PA is the only coach that seems to not like to foster competition.

He plays favoritism. Worst thing a coach can do.

(05-02-2016, 06:26 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Very brilliant posts. PA is the only coach that seems to not like to foster competition.

You must not have been a Bengal fan last year when Whit was crying about Paul bringing in competition.

Oh wait, yes you were.

Guess you just don't think before you post.

(05-02-2016, 06:28 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You must not have been a Bengal fan last year when Whit was crying about Paul bringing in competition.

Oh wait, yes you were.

Guess you just don't think before you post.

Always defend PA, always.

Just pathetic, especially coming from you. Hypocrite.

(05-02-2016, 05:55 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Recovery time for which procedure?  He had surgery after the '12 season because he had played through that season with an injury.  Then he had another procedure before training camp.

Cowboys took a salary cap hit when they released him.  He washed out because he was injured. 

For the scope he had before the beginning of the 2013 season.  His salary of $1.7 was guaranteed and if he signed somewhere else it would off set what the Cowboys owed him.  You can Google the information the same as me and you can read multiple reports Ronald Leary was going to beat him out anyway.  He was 31 years old and being out played by someone younger and cheaper. 

(05-02-2016, 06:26 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Sure it does.  Braham took a while to develop.  He was actually released by the team that drafted him (Arizona), but even though he was not yet a finished product Paul saw the potential in him.  Just like he sees the potential in Bodine.

(05-02-2016, 06:01 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Bodeine has done more at this stage of his career than Braham had.

That is the point PA was making.  Don't know why you all can't grasp that..  Our O-line was total crap Brahams first two seasons yet he never even got to play.

All of you guys would have cut Braham before he had a chance to shine for us, yet you all claim you know more about O-linemen than PA.  What a joke.

Who has Bodine competed with for the starting job?

(05-02-2016, 06:23 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Paul probably scouted him from film and had no idea that he had gotten so fat.

Lutui was a pretty good player.  He was a 2nd round draft pick that started for years for the Cards.

Bull.

Lutui's weight was an annual problem.  Don't act like he got stung by a bee and swolled the **** up overnight.

Guycheck, Livings, Roland, and Andrews started for the Bengals (some for years) and the years they started didn't make them suck any less on the field nor did their draft position.

Quote:The Cardinals won't miss Lutui's annual battles making weight (he once reported at 396 pounds)

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/41655/ever-entertaining-lutui-ran-course-in-Arizona
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/31/overweight-deuce-lutui-flunks-bengals-physical-returns-to-cardinals/
If he reported to the Bengals at 338, he was down right svelte compared to usual.

(05-02-2016, 07:08 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Who has Bodine competed with for the starting job?

No one.

That is the point I am trying to get you to understand.  Bodine was never given the chance to sit a couple of years to learn the position like Braham.

(05-02-2016, 07:18 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Bull.

Lutui's weight was an annual problem.  Don't act like he got stung by a bee and swolled the **** up overnight.

And he started every single year from his rookie season.

What is your point?