Last night, I heard on a podcast that both Hunt/Clark has never played more than 17% of snaps per season.

Granted, they are rotational players but can we write them off by such a small sample.

I assumed being fresh would benefit them.

I wonder if the coaching staff is considering MJ taking less snaps this season?

They have to earn their snaps. The fact that they haven't is very concerning.

(05-29-2016, 02:47 AM)J24 Wrote: They have to earn their snaps. The fact that they haven't is very concerning.

agreed 

The whole 'earn their reps' argument is valid.

I wonder how they have done in previous camps/ preseasons?

Is the 17% of snaps justified?

*Edit: Completely justified.

I found another interesting stat on those two.... Clark and Hunt have no stats.

I suppose you could make the Jerome Simpson argument -- they were behind good talent. I'm not saying I believe that, just that it is possible.

(05-29-2016, 02:25 AM)jeremydc Wrote: Last night, I heard on a podcast that both Hunt/Clark has never played more than 17% of snaps per season.

Granted, they are rotational players but can we write them off by such a small sample.

I assumed being fresh would benefit them.

I wonder if the coaching staff is considering MJ taking less snaps this season?

Up to this point I would not call them rotational players at all, but more like prospects getting getting some token time. Hunt is going into his 4th year and has yet to earn significant role. For a 2nd round pick that's deep in the bust territory.

Sean williams barely ever saw the field. If it werent for injuries we still wouldnt know what he could do and he definitely wouldnt have got a new 20 million $ contract.

Hell our first round corners have/had a tough time getting on the field.

Brandon Thompson barely ever saw the field.

This is one of my biggest complaints with Marvin. Getting young guys valuable real game reps doesnt mean shit to him.

Wasnt it Tank Johnson that had to tell the coaches to play Geno Atkins. One of the best DTs in the league. Dunlap was behind a washed up Geathers for a little bit too.

You bring up MJ getting less snaps.

Hunt was here when we didn't have MJ. He was expected to be a part of the defense and actually do something.

Meanwhile Robert Geathers got more playing time and did more with the opportunity than Hunt did.

Hunt needs to earn it, and he hasn't. Nor has Clarke thus far. Just because they don't get snaps doesn't mean they'll get better with more snaps. That doesn't always happen.

Remember Dontay Moch?

It's interesting that Dalton, Green, Zeitler,Bodine Gio, Hill,Ogbueh etc play immediately because they are the only options yet on defense it appears to be a very different story. On defense guys need grooming through special teams or they need to learn from the vets in front of them.

It doesn't make sense when you think about it.

Clark I'm still holding out hope for, most likely false hope but we'll soon see.

Hunt on the other hand I have next to no faith in. If he does turn it around this season it will be an epic one ! The football instincts just aren't there.

Hunt played all last season with a back injury. Now that he's back to his training regimen I'm looking forward to seeing him step it up. If he doesn't he'll be gone, if he does he could become a monster for us.

(05-29-2016, 09:32 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Hunt played all last season with a back injury. Now that he's back to his training regimen I'm looking forward to seeing him step it up. If he doesn't he'll be gone, if he does he could become a monster for us.

Hunt was active for 7 games and made 1 tackle. He didn't really play.

The year before when Gilberry and Geathers were our next best DEs outside of Dunlap, what was his excuse then?

(05-29-2016, 02:52 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Sean williams barely ever saw the field. If it werent for injuries we still wouldnt know what he could do and he definitely wouldnt have got a new 20 million $ contract.

Hell our first round corners have/had a tough time getting on the field.

Brandon Thompson barely ever saw the field.

This is one of my biggest complaints with Marvin. Getting young guys valuable real game reps doesnt mean shit to him.

Wasnt it Tank Johnson that had to tell the coaches to play Geno Atkins. One of the best DTs in the league. Dunlap was behind a washed up Geathers for a little bit too.

DB is a very different situation because their not expected to rotate as much as Dlineman are. Also Geno played regularly his first season as did Dunlap and Johnson. If Hunt was good enough to play he would have same as Clark.

(05-29-2016, 02:47 AM)J24 Wrote: They have to earn their snaps. The fact that they haven't is very concerning.

Spot on J24.

(05-29-2016, 02:52 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Sean williams barely ever saw the field. If it werent for injuries we still wouldnt know what he could do and he definitely wouldnt have got a new 20 million $ contract.

Hell our first round corners have/had a tough time getting on the field.

Brandon Thompson barely ever saw the field.

This is one of my biggest complaints with Marvin. Getting young guys valuable real game reps doesnt mean shit to him.

Wasnt it Tank Johnson that had to tell the coaches to play Geno Atkins. One of the best DTs in the league. Dunlap was behind a washed up Geathers for a little bit too.

I don't disagree with your general message, but I disagree with the content you wrote to make it....

Brandon Thompson saw plenty of snaps on the field. He's seen 818 defensive snaps, which is a lot considering how often he's been hurt and how mediocre he's been when he was healthy. To put that in context? Geno Atkins was 1st Team All-Pro and a Pro Bowler in 2015. He did it on 768 defensive snaps.

As I say about people who want to give the ball to Hill 30 times a game. If the guy is sucking/mediocre, you can't keep giving him endless amounts of snaps. You have a game to win and that means putting the best people on the field. Same applies to Hunt and company.

- - - - - - - - - -
I think you're mixing up Tank Johnson/Geno Atkins... with John Thornton/Pat Sims in 2008. Tank and Geno did play together in 2010, but Tank started all 7 of the games he played in before getting a season-ending knee injury. So certainly wasn't Tank benching himself.

Lets not do this revisionist history.... angers me because now I am defending Marvin Lewis and I don't want to.

Geno NEEDED a year in the NFL to get his Pro muscles. He was weighed in at 290 before getting drafted. He needed that year to put on 10-15 pounds of muscle.

Dunlap NEEDED to sit behind Geathers. That is the reason why he lasted to the 2nd round. He was young and had serious questions about his work ethic and drive. He also needed to learn to defend against the run on an NFL level. If you recall, they tried to give him more snaps in his 2nd season after his great limited 1st season, and his sack total dipped from 9.0 to 4.5. Carlos Dunlap came into the NFL at the age of 21, so it's not surprising it took him two seasons before he broke out as an all-around player at the age of 23, which is a common age people come into the NFL normally. He got his chances, and when he showed he was ready to be a good all around player, he became the full time starter from then on.

(05-29-2016, 11:37 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I don't disagree with your general message, but I disagree with the content you wrote to make it....

Brandon Thompson saw plenty of snaps on the field. He's seen 818 defensive snaps, which is a lot considering how often he's been hurt and how mediocre he's been when he was healthy. To put that in context? Geno Atkins was 1st Team All-Pro and a Pro Bowler in 2015. He did it on 768 defensive snaps.

As I say about people who want to give the ball to Hill 30 times a game. If the guy is sucking/mediocre, you can't keep giving him endless amounts of snaps. You have a game to win and that means putting the best people on the field. Same applies to Hunt and company.

- - - - - - - - - -
I think you're mixing up Tank Johnson/Geno Atkins... with John Thornton/Pat Sims in 2008. Tank and Geno did play together in 2010, but Tank started all 7 of the games he played in before getting a season-ending knee injury. So certainly wasn't Tank benching himself.

Lets not do this revisionist history.... angers me because now I am defending Marvin Lewis and I don't want to.

Geno NEEDED a year in the NFL to get his Pro muscles. He was weighed in at 290 before getting drafted. He needed that year to put on 10-15 pounds of muscle.

Dunlap NEEDED to sit behind Geathers. That is the reason why he lasted to the 2nd round. He was young and had serious questions about his work ethic and drive. He also needed to learn to defend against the run on an NFL level. If you recall, they tried to give him more snaps in his 2nd season after his great limited 1st season, and his sack total dipped from 9.0 to 4.5. Carlos Dunlap came into the NFL at the age of 21, so it's not surprising it took him two seasons before he broke out as an all-around player at the age of 23, which is a common age people come into the NFL normally. He got his chances, and when he showed he was ready to be a good all around player, he became the full time starter from then on.

This isnt revisionist. Just facts.
Geno led the team in pressures and was second on the team in sacks as a rookie. He was ready to make an impact.

Dunlap had 9.5 sacks as a rookie. He needed to mature. His football skills were there. Playing him behind Geathers didnt make him better. Had injuries that slowed him year 2 and 3. Still rediculous our coaches gave one of the best 4-3 DEs in the league 2 freaking starts his first 3 years in the league.

You can say whatever you want. Hopefully it was the DL coach who left deciding the pecking order. But the fact Dunlap had 2 career starts going in to his 4th year proves there is something broke there.

We had a great opportunity to get Hunt and Clarke a good look in 2014. Instead we rode Gilberry to a league worst sack total.

I hope the change at DL coach changes this and we start to properly utilize the talent we have.

(05-30-2016, 12:23 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: You can say whatever you want. Hopefully it was the DL coach who left deciding the pecking order. But the fact Dunlap had 2 career starts going in to his 4th year proves there is something broke there.

All it proves is that you did not look deeply enough into what really happened.  Despite missing time with injury every season his fiorst three years in the league dunlap was still playing 2/3rds of the snaps.

Starts don't really mean that much, and in hjis second and thrid seasons Dunlap was nothing close to the player he is now.  

(05-30-2016, 12:23 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: This isnt revisionist. Just facts.
Geno led the team in pressures and was second on the team in sacks as a rookie. He was ready to make an impact.

Dunlap had 9.5 sacks as a rookie. He needed to mature. His football skills were there. Playing him behind Geathers didnt make him better. Had injuries that slowed him year 2 and 3. Still rediculous our coaches gave one of the best 4-3 DEs in the league 2 freaking starts his first 3 years in the league.

You can say whatever you want. Hopefully it was the DL coach who left deciding the pecking order. But the fact Dunlap had 2 career starts going in to his 4th year proves there is something broke there.

We had a great opportunity to get Hunt and Clarke a good look in 2014. Instead we rode Gilberry to a league worst sack total.

I hope the change at DL coach changes this and we start to properly utilize the talent we have.

Never liked Hayes, really hope the Burney change will help the DL as a whole.

Bringing in Freeney sure would help.

Haven't seen enough of Clarke, but Hunt has looked fine every time I've seen him play. Don't care that he hasn't seen the field much, as that has more to do with the guys ahead of him than his performance. Guys have to wait their turn.