Dalton comes in at #13, after Romo and Matt Ryan, and ahead of Bortles and James Flacco.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/priscos-top-100-players-ranking-all-32-nfl-starting-quarterbacks/

Thoughts?

Personally I think Dalton should be ahead of Ryan and perhaps Eli. I also think #3 for Ben and #7 for Luck are too high after the seasons they just had.

Seems like he had a better season than #13 last year before the injury.

Agree that Ben and Luck are too high considering last year. No way in hell he's above Cam

(06-02-2016, 08:13 PM)Vas Deferens Wrote: Seems like he had a better season than #13 last year before the injury.  

Agree that Ben and Luck are too high considering last year.  No way in hell he's above Cam

Yeah I have Ben around the top 7-8, but behind Cam, Palmer, Brees and maybe Wilson.

3rd is not justified, IMO.

(06-02-2016, 08:38 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Yeah I have Ben around the top 7-8, but behind Cam, Palmer, Brees and maybe Wilson.

3rd is not justified, IMO.

Agree, way over rated.

Dalton should be around 9 

If you aren't going to mov e up Dalton for only one really good year, why are Cam and Luck that high?

I remember these lists having RGIII and Kaep pretty high once, too.

Right now, Brees is not above him, and neither is Rivers, Palmer, or Ryan.

I would have Dalton about 9th with the potential to be in the top 5 after this season. As Kiper said when he was drafted to a team that was projected to have ZERO wins: "He is allergic to losing"

Dalton has reached the top 10 in my opinion. Don't see that 13 at all. Clearly he's more capable than that.

(06-02-2016, 08:00 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Dalton comes in at #13, after Romo and Matt Ryan, and ahead of Bortles and James Flacco.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/priscos-top-100-players-ranking-all-32-nfl-starting-quarterbacks/

Thoughts?

Personally I think Dalton should be ahead of Ryan and perhaps Eli. I also think #3 for Ben and #7 for Luck are too high after the seasons they just had.

No way he's not in the top 10.  Brees, Rivers and Manning should be dropped at a minimum, and Romo since he can't stay on the field.  One could argue Wilson should come in behind Dalton but he has other intangibles besides throwing the football so I'm good with that.  The rest I'm okay with but Luck is too high at 7 IMO.

It's all relative, this other guy has Dalton ranked as 5th best.

http://www.cincyjungle.com/2016/6/2/11841708/andy-dalton-ranked-as-5th-best-quarterback-in-nfl

Chiefs fans should be pissed

(06-03-2016, 07:32 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I would have Dalton about 9th with the potential to be in the top 5 after this season.  As Kiper said when he was drafted to a team that was projected to have ZERO wins:  "He is allergic to losing"

So basically experts are terrible at analyzing, predicting, and ranking talent BUT here we are 5 years later still using "Everyone thought the 2011 Bengals were going to be terrible" as some sort of proof that Andy Dalton took over an absolutely god-awful and hopeless team?

I'm not targeting this at you specifically, it's just interesting how much stock we put into some knee-jerk and stupid predictions that are 5 years old when it suits our narrative.  For Bengals fans who actually knew the players who were returning to the team after 2010, who WASN'T returning, the fact that we kept this HC that gets an amount of credit, and actually watched the game to still act like Dalton was drafted by the Browns or something is just off-base. We were one-year removed from sweeping a very good division and making the playoffs (you know...that standard by which we declare teams to be totally awesome?). Ah, but Boomer Esiason said we'd be awful so let's just act like Dalton should have been terrified to come to this pathetic franchise! I'm surprised he didn't demand an immediate Elway-style trade.

Ok, rant over.

(06-03-2016, 12:31 PM)Nately120 Wrote: So basically experts are terrible at analyzing, predicting, and ranking talent BUT here we are 5 years later still using "Everyone thought the 2011 Bengals were going to be terrible" as some sort of proof that Andy Dalton took over an absolutely god-awful and hopeless team?

I'm not targeting this at you specifically, it's just interesting how much stock we put into some knee-jerk and stupid predictions that are 5 years old when it suits our narrative.  For Bengals fans who actually knew the players who were returning to the team after 2010, who WASN'T returning, the fact that we kept this HC that gets an amount of credit, and actually watched the game to still act like Dalton was drafted by the Browns or something is just off-base.  We were one-year removed from sweeping a very good division and making the playoffs (you know...that standard by which we declare teams to be totally awesome?).  Ah, but Boomer Esiason said we'd be awful so let's just act like Dalton should have been terrified to come to this pathetic franchise!  I'm surprised he didn't demand an immediate Elway-style trade.

Ok, rant over.

I'm mixed on this. I do think some put too much stock in the 2011 turnaround, but I also think it should count for something. I was on the boards back then and I'm sure you remember the huge sig bet that took place. Well, the over-under for that was 4 wins. Only a tiny percentage of the biggest homers were predicting more than 5-6 wins. 9-7 was well above anyone's expectations.

You say that we were just a year removed from a playoff berth, but that was our only playoff berth from 2006-2010. Hardly evidence that the Bengals were a rock solid rebound candidate, IMO. 0-16 was probably a dumb prediction, but if you take any team that was 4-12, make no major FA additions, and replace the franchise QB and WR with rookies, the expectations aren't going to be high.

For Jay to get a rookie QB ready during a lockout (when he supposedly couldn't touch a playbook til August) was pretty amazing. For rookie Dalton to play the QB position better than 2010 Palmer was equally amazing. I'm not arguing that Dalton > Palmer currently, but Palmer was pretty bad in 2010. Moving on was a good thing for both sides. 

Now do I think that Dalton is 100% the reason for the turnaround and the sustained success we've had since? No, but I do think he's one of the biggest reasons and he certainly deserves more credit than he's received over the last 5 years. 

(06-03-2016, 12:31 PM)Nately120 Wrote: So basically experts are terrible at analyzing, predicting, and ranking talent BUT here we are 5 years later still using "Everyone thought the 2011 Bengals were going to be terrible" as some sort of proof that Andy Dalton took over an absolutely god-awful and hopeless team?

I'm not targeting this at you specifically, it's just interesting how much stock we put into some knee-jerk and stupid predictions that are 5 years old when it suits our narrative.  For Bengals fans who actually knew the players who were returning to the team after 2010, who WASN'T returning, the fact that we kept this HC that gets an amount of credit, and actually watched the game to still act like Dalton was drafted by the Browns or something is just off-base. We were one-year removed from sweeping a very good division and making the playoffs (you know...that standard by which we declare teams to be totally awesome?). Ah, but Boomer Esiason said we'd be awful so let's just act like Dalton should have been terrified to come to this pathetic franchise! I'm surprised he didn't demand an immediate Elway-style trade.

Ok, rant over.

It was because the Bengals didn't have any offensive weapons going into 2011. plus the defense didn't play well the year before. We still didn't have a very good roster in 2011 if you think about it. The team had some huge holes in it.

(06-03-2016, 12:31 PM)Nately120 Wrote: So basically experts are terrible at analyzing, predicting, and ranking talent BUT here we are 5 years later still using "Everyone thought the 2011 Bengals were going to be terrible" as some sort of proof that Andy Dalton took over an absolutely god-awful and hopeless team?

I'm not targeting this at you specifically, it's just interesting how much stock we put into some knee-jerk and stupid predictions that are 5 years old when it suits our narrative.  For Bengals fans who actually knew the players who were returning to the team after 2010, who WASN'T returning, the fact that we kept this HC that gets an amount of credit, and actually watched the game to still act like Dalton was drafted by the Browns or something is just off-base.  We were one-year removed from sweeping a very good division and making the playoffs (you know...that standard by which we declare teams to be totally awesome?).  Ah, but Boomer Esiason said we'd be awful so let's just act like Dalton should have been terrified to come to this pathetic franchise!  I'm surprised he didn't demand an immediate Elway-style trade.

Ok, rant over.

I think your rant is interesting, but maybe a bit misdirected.  I think the big loser here is one Carson Palmer.  He couldn't, wouldn't play for a team with such a mentality for losing, and a second round QB comes in and takes them to the playoffs.  I know the rosters weren't identical, and there were some changes in the coaching ranks like Gruden over Brat, but the teams were still pretty similar.  There is a lot to perceptions, and MANY people (fans, players, talking-heads, oh, and VEGAS!) thought they would be a disaster.  Heck, even with a roster like Denver's, without an established QB, they aren't projected to be near the same team. 

I just really like that Dalton took everything in stride, came in without OTAs, and made the playoffs his rookie season. 

One can make an argument for Dalton being about as high as 9, but that's about it. I think 13 is fair.

All of Ryan, Eli, Romo, Rivers, and Luck have had multiple seasons of 4000+ yards whereas Dalton has only had one. He likely would have hit that mark again in 2015 if not for injury though. All of the above except Luck have also had multiple seasons of 30+ TD passes, Dalton has only had one.

If Dalton continues the pace he was at last season while staying healthy, he'll hit the magical 4000+ yards and 25+ TD mark again. And therefore will also likely move up at least a couple spots in rankings like these.

I didn't realize Brees finished the season that strong overall. I knew he started off pretty rough.

As for the other rankings...
-Luck is really overrated (as always)
-Eli is a little bit overrated (though he's looked a lot better since OBJ has arrived)
-Matt Ryan is vastly overrated (ever since he was "great" when he had Roddy White/Julio Jones/Tony Gonzalez/Michael Turner to start his career)
-Romo is underrated (as always)
-The Rapist is overrated (but still good, just not #3 good)

13 isn't too far off where I would put him (11-ish), so that's alright for Dalton.

(Don't care so much about the people under Dalton, but I do know I will try to snag Blake Bortles in my fantasy league later in the draft.)

(06-03-2016, 01:45 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: I think your rant is interesting, but maybe a bit misdirected.  I think the big loser here is one Carson Palmer.  He couldn't, wouldn't play for a team with such a mentality for losing, and a second round QB comes in and takes them to the playoffs. 

Meh, Dalton was a 2nd rounder who took a 4-12 teams to the playoffs and Palmer was a washed-up bargain bin vet who took a team with two 5-win seasons in 3 years to the NFC Championship game.  You and I have had obvious disagreements about Palmer that are never changing, but it's not like Palmer left Cincy to coast into a bed of roses.

My point is that people seem to really like to over-exaggerate how awful the Bengals were after 2010 and I think 2010 looked really bad because we had a brutal schedule...seriously, we played:

Patiots (14-2)
Falcons (13-3)
Steelers (12-4)
Steelers (12-4)
Ravens (12-4)
Ravens (12-4)
Jets (11-5)
Saints (11-5)
Colts (10-6)
Chargers (9-7)

...and we lost to some crap teams (and beat 2 good ones), just to hedge our bets.  That schedule probably would have led to the 2011 squad being something around 4-12, too.  It's just night and day from what the 2011 team faced SO I was never all that convinced we learned to be winners again overnight.  Plus we dumped an over the hill pair or WRs and got a top WR prospect, we FINALLY ditched Brat, we had the same HC and Zimmer returning, Benson stopped fumbling as much, and the defense pulled it together mostly because we didn't play 9 teams with 10-14 wins in 2011.

It was clear changes needed to be made after 2010, but not playing an absurdly difficult schedule sure helped.

Lest we forget in both 2011 and 2012 we played a LOT of good defenses (2011 IIRC the average ranking of the defenses we played was 9). And succeeded anyway.

It's also why I think some of the QB rankings he did were WAY off - defenses played. Luck looked like garbage before he got hurt and it was against decidedly average if not worse defenses (kind of like he has gotten to play against his whole career). Then you have Newton who likewise has had one of the easiest careers in terms of quality of defenses played in league history and last year overall had possibly the most cream puff schedule the NFL has had since they revised the scheduling system. And the results showed in the Super Bowl (which they only got to because the Cards and Seahawks played mistake filled offense and then could not catch up enough) where the Broncos defense treated Newton like their plaything (and he acted like a Baby just as usual).

Before last season season I could name 20 guys I would take over Dalton.

Now, I could only name 3 or 4

Looking at his career so far 13 sounds right. Last year he was top 5 before the injury. If Dalton has another year similar to last year he'll easily move into the top 10.



Big Ben at 3 is laughable.

At this point I'd rather have Dalton ranked last and criticized by the entire media. Seems like Andy is at his best with a bit of a chip on the shoulder. As for what I personally think? I'm glad he's a Bengal.