(08-10-2016, 10:37 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Chad Johnson went to the Patriots, and Owens went to the Seahawks for a little bit in 2012. That still doesn't take away from my point that our top 2 receivers left though.

TO didn't make the team and Chad was sitting on the bench...my point is Chad and TO leaving Cincy doesn't quite seem like the burden you want to make it.

(08-10-2016, 04:54 PM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: How do you figure that Luck has had the better offense?  Listen to any analysis and they always talk about how poor the line is.  Yes, he had Reggie Wayne and Andre Johnson, but it was at the extreme tail end of their careers.  Are you saying that Hilton is better than Green?  They have basically no rushing game.

I wouldn't go as far as saying Luck has always had a better offense, but it hasn't been significantly worse, either. Hilton is a fine #1 WR. Reggie Wayne was better than you're letting on, even towards the end. He was a damn good #2 and certainly better than Andre Johnson was. Luck's always had a very good TE in Coby Fleener and/or Dwayne Allen.

He hasn't had a very effective run game to back him (average rank of 24th in YPC), but Dalton hasn't had much better (average rank of 22nd). Dalton - believe it or not - has actually been sacked at a slightly higher rate (once per 17.8 attempts) than Luck (18.3). 

Overall, I just think that people exaggerated how awesome Dalton's weapons were early in his career to explain why he was having more success than anticipated. In contrast, people exaggerated how BAD Luck's supporting cast was to explain why he's been mildly disappointing.

Dalton's cast finally matched the hype last year, but before that I don't think the casts were far off.

All things being equal, I would take Luck. Circumstances being what they are, I say Dalton puts up slightly better numbers this year.

(08-10-2016, 10:49 PM)Nately120 Wrote: TO didn't make the team and Chad was sitting on the bench...my point is Chad and TO leaving Cincy doesn't quite seem like the burden you want to make it.

Agree there, but outside of a rookie AJ Green, the weapons were Simpson, Caldwell, Gresh and Benson.


Pretty ugly list of names, looking back.

[quote pid='245592' dateline='1470881186']
All things being equal, I would take Luck. Circumstances being what they are, I say Dalton puts up slightly better numbers this year.
[/quote]

One thing Luck does better than Dalton is throw the long pass. Dalton does better in the rest of the game.

If Eifert misses more than half of the season I may have to change my pick to Luck.

(08-10-2016, 10:49 PM)Nately120 Wrote: TO didn't make the team and Chad was sitting on the bench...my point is Chad and TO leaving Cincy doesn't quite seem like the burden you want to make it.

And that still doesn't take an ounce away from my point. The Bengals top 2 receivers couldn't even start on other teams, so the people behind those receivers must have bee great, right? Dalton didn't have anyone but a rookie WR his first year. Luck had 2 vets and a really good rookie + a great TE his first year. Seems painfully obvious that Luck had better weapons.

(08-10-2016, 11:12 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Agree there, but outside of a rookie AJ Green, the weapons were Simpson, Caldwell, Gresh and Benson.


Pretty ugly list of names, looking back.

I recall people (around these parts) saying Green and Simpson would be an uncoverable duo.

(08-11-2016, 12:09 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I recall people (around these parts) saying Green and Simpson would be an uncoverable duo.

What's new? Any swinging dick that goes into camp seems to get that treatment.

(08-11-2016, 12:12 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: What's new? Any swinging dick that goes into camp seems to get that treatment.

Let's stop the fussin' and a feudin' and just agree on this.