(09-28-2016, 03:41 PM)jfkbengals Wrote: He's been no better than the rest of them

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/andrew-whitworth-grades-out-highly-through-three-weeks-per-pff/

"Andrew Whitworth is PFF's highest graded tackle in pass protection through 3 weeks, allowing 3 pressures in 133 passing snaps."


Obviously take a grain of salt with PFF stuff, but I haven't seen a ton of problems with Whit or Boling this year. Mostly all C, RG, RT.

Waits for picture of Andy with bloody nose.

The one of CP9 was everyone's excuse for him doing something poorly.

User A: CP9 threw 3 INTs today and 1 pick 6. He needs to work on that

User B: (Posts bloody nose picture) 'nuff said.  

(09-28-2016, 04:53 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/andrew-whitworth-grades-out-highly-through-three-weeks-per-pff/

"Andrew Whitworth is PFF's highest graded tackle in pass protection through 3 weeks, allowing 3 pressures in 133 passing snaps."


Obviously take a grain of salt with PFF stuff, but I haven't seen a ton of problems with Whit or Boling this year. Mostly all C, RG, RT.

Didn't he give up a sack last week?

(09-28-2016, 05:03 PM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: Didn't he give up a sack last week?

No idea. If he did, that goes back to my grain of salt. It was more just the point that he said "He's been no better than the rest of them." and that's clearly just not true regardless.

(09-28-2016, 05:03 PM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: Didn't he give up a sack last week?

I think that was Fischer filling in as the TE on the weakside. I love Whit, but when you have to put an extra blocker on the weakside, that might tell you something.

(09-28-2016, 05:05 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: No idea. If he did, that goes back to my grain of salt. It was more just the point that he said "He's been no better than the rest of them." and that's clearly just not true regardless.

But it is.  He has been walked back into the backfield regularly in the 3 games.  He's given up at least one sack, and if they are only calling it 3 pressures it's because on the other snaps Andy was already being molested by the right side.  I love Whit as much as the next guy, and he hands down has been one of my favorite Bengals of the last decade.  That said, he has not been an exception on the line.  His play needs to be more consistent, just like the rest of them.

(09-28-2016, 05:02 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Waits for picture of Andy with bloody nose.

The one of CP9 was everyone's excuse for him doing something poorly.

User A: CP9 threw 3 INTs today and 1 pick 6. He needs to work on that

User B: (Posts bloody nose picture) 'nuff said.  

At the rate we're going.....your wait may not be long.

(09-27-2016, 06:42 PM)milksheikh Wrote: So.... how do we fix this?


http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/passing/sort/sacks

ETR........Establish The Run.

Certainly if you don't establish the run, defenses will be playing smear the nerd with your quarterback.  The best way to stop the pass is the quarterback on his back side.  The run keeps the bulls from putting their heads down and charging. ....We have Hill, Bernard and Burkhead and we must use them.  At years end I would like to see that we ran as often as we passed. That 50 / 50 blend should keep defenses from not being able to key on either the pass or the run. Plus that is what Super Bowl teams do. Winners run and pass. It is hard to defend. ......Also, Super Bowl teams with a 4th quarter lead often can run out the clock running the ball. I've seen the Bengals over the years lose to such teams. I've seen the Patriots or Steelers just run it up our rear ends in the 4th quarter in their best years, and it's frustrating when there is nothing you can do to stop it to get the ball back. I would love to Bengals have that time of run game or at least try to have it.......I like the focus Hill has after his fumble in play-offs and he really is determined to make up for it. Give him and Bernard the ball more. Hill has the ability to be a beast like Corey Dillon, or at least a Rudi or a Benson. I think Hill has more break away plays in him than those two. Hill is the power runner and Bernard is the slasher. Burkhead has up sides if needed. Use them.

(09-27-2016, 09:27 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: There is a fix but it will require a complete rethinking of the offensive line pass blocking technique.  Picture the play unfolding from above, directly over Andy Dalton in the shotgun formation.  As the ball is snapped, the linemen should push forward, thereby expanding the pocket.  The inverted "U" shape should be nice and big to give Andy room to maneuver, set his feet, and throw. Unfortunately, the opposite is happening:  The inverted "U" shape is collapsing into Andy because the Cincinnati offensive linemen, especially the tackles, back up too much.  When the defensive ends or linebackers hit the tackles who are already going backwards, the impact makes the tackles go back faster.  Such a thing is a defensive end's dream scenario and it makes getting to the quarterback much easier.

If the Bengals could expand the pocket or at least sustain pocket integrity, Andy Dalton wouldn't be sacked very much at all. The best offensive lines at expanding the pocket are New England and Pittsburgh.  Tom Brady is rarely sacked and Ben Roethlisberger always has lots of room to move while finding an open receiver.

You are absolutely correct, the aggressiveness in both aspects of blocking is missing.  They need to be firing off on the run plays, and firing off for a yard on pass plays, simply to sell the play.

Was Andre Smith more valuable than people thought? Hard to tell, maybe.

I don't think Zeitler has suddenly declined. Instead I think he's playing with the consistently ineffective Bodine on one side, and your basic rookie on the other.

I know Ced is not technically a rookie, but in terms of experience, he is. Now, I like the guy, and think he'll get better and better, and he and Zeitler will eventually play well together. I don't think there's a fix for Bodine.

One of the first steps to fixing a problem is to recognize that there is one. Alexander seems to have a blind spot when it comes to players he has advocated for picking.

All that said, though, has anyone else wondered if we might have picked Ryan Kelly if he'd been there?

Lest we forget the Bengals have been called out by people with actual NFL offensive line experience (like Anthony Munoz and Joe Walter) for poor technique on sportscasts before. And they mentioned both needlessly giving ground and engaging the DL too high up and thus losing leverage and neutralizing their own size advantage.

(09-28-2016, 08:03 PM)Thundercloud Wrote: Was Andre Smith more valuable than people thought? Hard to tell, maybe.

I don't think Zeitler has suddenly declined.  Instead I think he's playing with the consistently ineffective Bodine on one side, and your basic rookie on the other.

I know Ced is not technically a rookie, but in terms of experience, he is.  Now, I like the guy, and think he'll get better and better, and he and Zeitler will eventually play well together.  I don't think there's a fix for Bodine.

One of the first steps to fixing a problem is to recognize that there is one. Alexander seems to have a blind spot when it comes to players he has advocated for picking.

All that said, though, has anyone else wondered if we might have picked Ryan Kelly if he'd been there?

I would like to think we would have picked Kelly if he was there, but I don't think we do. 

(09-28-2016, 07:18 PM)Wyche Wrote: At the rate we're going.....your wait may not be long.

They showed a quick shot of him sitting on the bench after his helmet was ripped off last game.  It looked like he was holding a towel against his nose, so I think it has already happened...

Oline looked pretty good in the pass blocking last night. Dalton had some pressure but it was manageable and only one sack that came on an outside blitz that wasn't the Olines fault.
Don't get me started on the run blocking...

(09-30-2016, 08:21 AM)Sweetness Wrote: Oline looked pretty good in the pass blocking last night. Dalton had some pressure but it was manageable and only one sack that came on an outside blitz that wasn't the Olines fault.
Don't get me started on the run blocking...

Agreed.  MUCH better in pass pro.....run blocking is still an abomination.