(10-29-2016, 04:16 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: It's chain of command. If a company (team) constantly brings in new employees (players) and gets similar disappointing results, you start looking at management (coaches). If you've been through several supervisors, you start looking at the head manager (head coach). If the owner of the company refuses to look at the head manager, you start looking at him.

Ultimately,  the disappointment of these teams has to fall on Marvin and ultimately, Mike. 0-7 doesn't happen by some odd twist of bad luck.

Bingo.  The buck stops with the obtuse old fool at the top.  

Unfortunately the Bengals don't trade for players. If anything they will do a trade for draft picks ala Carson or during the draft like they did for Zeitler by moving down. Even then that is very rare.

(10-29-2016, 11:44 AM)Beaker Wrote: Depends on what you mean by actions....baby.

If you mean what most fans cry about on here like "MB doesn't spend the money" BS, then youre part of the problem.
If you mean actions like hiring Bill Tobin and stepping back from over-riding decision in the draft, paying good money to re-sign players that deserve it and perform, and not listening to the knee jerk reactions of the fans, then you are correct.

Bill Tobin has been garbage at the draft lately.

(10-29-2016, 06:57 PM)Millhouse Wrote: Bill Tobin has been garbage at the draft lately.

Go away with this stupidity.

(10-29-2016, 04:16 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Ultimately,  the disappointment of these teams has to fall on Marvin and ultimately, Mike. 

So you are going with the proof that MB doesn't want to win is because he hasn't fired ML yet? 

(10-29-2016, 08:06 PM)Beaker Wrote: Go away with this stupidity.

Ok garbage might have been said out of jest. 

But the drafts last few years have been underwhelming to say the least. 

(10-25-2016, 10:20 AM)Au165 Wrote: The Bengals have 6.6 million in cap space right now, but Joe Thomas has a 9.5 Million dollar cap hit so we'd have to clear 3 million in cap to even make it possible. Before someone starts throwing out names to cut, realize there are dead money issues associated with many of the vets that would not really clear as much cap as you'd expect. Financially it doesn't appear feasible or smart to do mid year if it requires changing up the rest of the team. Staley has a similar cap number which means he is going to create the same problem.

People like to think things are as easy as call them up and give them a pick. There are a lot of issues associated with trading guys mid season that make it a tough thing to do.

Screw rules, we have money!

(10-29-2016, 08:11 PM)Beaker Wrote: So you are going with the proof that MB doesn't want to win is because he hasn't fired ML yet? 

Maybe you didn't read my post? I said he wants to win...his way.

(10-29-2016, 03:34 AM)bengalsturntup926 Wrote: Oh yeah sure this isn't Madden can't just tell him to change position. Come off of it, that's why they say Cedric O is really playing out of position he played college at LT. Whitworth has also played guard.Rt is less harder to play then LT because of the pass rushers on the blind side. Whit can move to RT no doubt in my mind.but this is all for nothing because they are determined t make Cedric good win or lose, it's all about making him good.that's why our coaches suck from owner down to paul Alexander. And the way they talked in a article, Paul alexander is in charge of personnel on the o line.

Actually they don't want to give up on a high draft pick. Making him good is one "possible" outcome.

(10-29-2016, 06:55 PM)Millhouse Wrote: Unfortunately the Bengals don't trade for players. If anything they will do a trade for draft picks ala Carson or during the draft like they did for Zeitler by moving down. Even then that is very rare.

Bengals traded for Deltha ONeal, Brian Leonard, and Reggie Nelson.

And they traded Keith Rivers, Ochocinco, and Carson Palmer for picks.

They don't do it every year, but you can't say they never do it.

(10-29-2016, 11:30 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Maybe you didn't read my post? I said he wants to win...his way.

Then you agree with me...it's stupid to say MB doesn't want to win.

(10-29-2016, 08:30 PM)Millhouse Wrote: Ok garbage might have been said out of jest. 

But the drafts last few years have been underwhelming to say the least. 

Like Tobin and believe in him. 

But have not drafted well since Gruden left. 

People do not want to hear this, but it is true. 

(10-29-2016, 06:55 PM)Millhouse Wrote: Unfortunately the Bengals don't trade for players. If anything they will do a trade for draft picks ala Carson or during the draft like they did for Zeitler by moving down. Even then that is very rare.

and even then Carson forced the move. Have made a few others like Fred pointed out, but it is rare. 

Chad was a unique situation as well. 

(10-25-2016, 10:20 AM)Au165 Wrote: The Bengals have 6.6 million in cap space right now, but Joe Thomas has a 9.5 Million dollar cap hit so we'd have to clear 3 million in cap to even make it possible. Before someone starts throwing out names to cut, realize there are dead money issues associated with many of the vets that would not really clear as much cap as you'd expect. Financially it doesn't appear feasible or smart to do mid year if it requires changing up the rest of the team. Staley has a similar cap number which means he is going to create the same problem.

People like to think things are as easy as call them up and give them a pick. There are a lot of issues associated with trading guys mid season that make it a tough thing to do.

(10-25-2016, 04:40 PM)Bengal Dude Wrote: If we trade for Joe Thomas or Joe Staley, who is going to play RT?

You can't just flip Whit over to the right side. Thomas and Staley aren't moving over there.

These should have been the first two responses to the question.  Right tackle is the need, and you can't just assume that a LT can just step in to that spot and do well (hell, Jake and Ced were both LTs).  Then there is the need to fit in the aquired contract without screwing up the current and future cap situations.

Loyalty again cost the team today. They should've replaced Nugent after his dreadful preseason.

Now we're stuck with a 73.7% kicker.

(10-30-2016, 04:32 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Loyalty again cost the team today. They should've replaced Nugent after his dreadful preseason.

Now we're stuck with a 73.7% kicker.

Kicking across the league is horrible this year. There aren't replacements to be found either or else you'd see a ton of teams making changes. Janikowski shanks two yesterday to almost give the game away, the kid in Tampa has been a dumpster fire all year, Hopkins misses two yesterday against us, the Seattle and Arizona kickers both try to lose the game.

People talk about the lack of quality college players at certain positions, it seems like kicker can be added to that list too because the league as a whole has gotten bad.

(10-31-2016, 10:29 AM)Au165 Wrote: Kicking across the league is horrible this year. There aren't replacements to be found either or else you'd see a ton of teams making changes. Janikowski shanks two yesterday to almost give the game away, the kid in Tampa has been a dumpster fire all year, Hopkins misses two yesterday against us, the Seattle and Arizona kickers both try to lose the game.

People talk about the lack of quality college players at certain positions, it seems like kicker can be added to that list too because the league as a whole has gotten bad.

Can't say I totally disagree with your point about lack of talent available on the street at the moment, but there is a reason why Tampa and Oakland are sticking with their guys.

Janikowski is a Raiders legend who is likely just having a slight hiccup in an amazing career. The Tampa kid was a 2nd round pick. They're going to give him a long leash before giving up on him.

I just want to state the obvious here. Winning is not Mike browns #1 priority.

(10-31-2016, 10:28 PM)Vas Deferens Wrote: I just want to state the obvious here.  Winning is not Mike browns #1 priority.

Thank you.  If it was.....the staff would've been gutted in 2010.

(10-29-2016, 08:11 PM)Beaker Wrote: So you are going with the proof that MB doesn't want to win is because he hasn't fired ML yet? 

Oh there's no doubt Mike wants to win. But like Shake, myself, Wyche, Fan in Kettering, Sunset, and on and on have said many times.

He's determined it's going to be his way !!! He pays guys he likes regardless of if they're getting the job done or not, both players and coaches.

He won't pay Free Agents. He won't build an indoor facility. Won't honor former players and so on.

Winning, when it gets right down to it, takes a back seat to loyalty, having yes men as his staff, and HIS WAY.