or how much most athletes/teams care in general.

I keep seeing people talking about discipline, character, fire, passion, etc. and I just dont think that stuff resonates with a lot of the athletes out there as much as it does with the fans.

Fans are emotionally invested in their teams. They look at the team as a representation of their city and themselves. Most of the athletes in pro sports never grew up cheering or rooting for the team they are currently on and dont share that passion that the fans have.

Sure, athletes are competitive and they want to win but I just dont think they share in that same passion about their team that the fans share. They try their hardest, get their check, and if they win...great, if they lose...they move on with their lives.

A friend of mine does some work for the Bengals and travels with them for most of their games. I asked him what it was like after the Dallas loss, how the mood was on the plane ride home after they got their butts kicked. He responded "just another game".

Obviously players would rather win games than lose games, but I dont think they lose too much sleep over it.

If this is true it explains a lot.

Brady and Bill B lose sleep when they lose.

Rose, Morgan and Bench lost sleep when they lost.

Jordan would not let anyone else sleep when he lost.

I think you may have hit on something here which explains the difference between the Bengals, the Pats, the Big red Machine and Jordan's Bulls.

When you a professional, in any endeavor, if you don't lose sleep whenever you lose- there is a big problem

(10-31-2016, 03:59 PM)bengals67 Wrote: If this is true it explains a lot.

Brady and Bill B lose sleep when they lose.

Rose, Morgan and Bench lost sleep when they lost.

Jordan would not let anyone else sleep when he lost.

I think you may have hit on something here which explains the difference between the Bengals, the Pats, the Big red Machine and Jordan's Bulls.

When you a professional, in any endeavor, if you don't lose sleep whenever you lose- there is a big problem

You're dead on. I really think thats what makes those players/teams great. A competitiveness and a willingness to do anything to try and win. That killer instinct. Watch a Patriots game and watch how pissed Bellichick and Brady get when someone on their team screws up. 

Do you think half the penalties the Bengals commit would fly in New England? Nope, you would be riding the pine right next to Steven Ridley after he fumbles. 

Did you catch his post game conference? Pretty uninspiring to say the least.

(10-31-2016, 04:26 PM)Hoofhearted Wrote: Did you catch his post game conference? Pretty uninspiring to say the least.

That's every Marvin PC.

Yeah well, if true (and i believe it to be true), that's just another knock on Marv.

(10-31-2016, 03:59 PM)bengals67 Wrote: If this is true it explains a lot.

Brady and Bill B lose sleep when they lose.

Rose, Morgan and Bench lost sleep when they lost.

Jordan would not let anyone else sleep when he lost.

I think you may have hit on something here which explains the difference between the Bengals, the Pats, the Big red Machine and Jordan's Bulls.

When you a professional, in any endeavor, if you don't lose sleep whenever you lose- there is a big problem

Absolutely! Well put.

Unfortunately, if the players are a reflection of their head coach, we are in serious trouble. 

(10-31-2016, 04:38 PM)Bengal Dude Wrote: That's every Marvin PC.

Yeah, this was unusually disappointing tho. 

“The best lesson learned today for our football team is you just got to keep playing, regardless literally of the situation, football game, where we are, what's going on - just keep playing, go to the next down and keep playing,”


I mean is that even a "best lesson" ? 


Usually it's we've got to play better, but this just sounds like a defeated man IMO.

(10-31-2016, 04:51 PM)Hoofhearted Wrote: Yeah, this was unusually disappointing tho. 

“The best lesson learned today for our football team is you just got to keep playing, regardless literally of the situation, football game, where we are, what's going on - just keep playing, go to the next down and keep playing,”


I mean is that even a "best lesson" ? 


Usually it's we've got to play better, but this just sounds like a defeated man IMO.

I used to watch Marvin's PCs. Then I just moved onto the transcripts. Now I read the little blurbs on Twitter posted by the beat writers.

It's seriously the same thing every week win/lose/draw.

After last season when we went 12-4 and couldn't even win a playoff game...5 times in a row...

It's The Myth of Sisyphus. The Bengals keep pushing that rock to the top of the mountain only to have it keep rolling down.

If you would have told me during our 10-game losing streak in 2010 that we'd still be complaining about Marvin Lewis in 2016 I would have screamed...and I don't mean in ecstasy.

Sometimes fans also forget it's their 9-5 and many players, in all sports, have taken that approach.

Years ago, most players had to have jobs in the off season to make ends meet, excluding the few superstars. Their attitude was, I'm playing a kids game and getting paid for it!! How great is that???

Now the minimum salary for NFL, MLB, NBA, and NHL, are all around the $500,000 mark.

Yet, 78% of NFL players go bankrupt 2 years after retirement, and 60% of NBA players 5 years after retirement.

(10-31-2016, 05:00 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: After last season when we went 12-4 and couldn't even win a playoff game...5 times in a row...

It's The Myth of Sisyphus. The Bengals keep pushing that rock to the top of the mountain only to have it keep rolling down.

Sisyphus was exactly my thought last year when Hill fumbled and Burfict and Jones lost their minds.

(10-31-2016, 03:59 PM)bengals67 Wrote: If this is true it explains a lot.

Brady and Bill B lose sleep when they lose.

Rose, Morgan and Bench lost sleep when they lost.

Jordan would not let anyone else sleep when he lost.

I think you may have hit on something here which explains the difference between the Bengals, the Pats, the Big red Machine and Jordan's Bulls.

When you a professional, in any endeavor, if you don't lose sleep whenever you lose- there is a big problem

This is what separates legends from the rest

(10-31-2016, 04:49 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: Absolutely! Well put.

Unfortunately, if the players are a reflection of their head coach, we are in serious trouble. 

Jordan-Phil Jackson  
Rose,Bench,Perez-Sparky Anderson
Brady-Bellichick
Bengals-Marvin Lewis

Which one seems out of place? I think Marvin's a really nice guy...too nice. I think it bothers him and he really doesn't know how to express his emotions on the field or display his disgust to his players and hold them accountable. Which is why it may be past
time to find a coach who CAN motivate them to do their jobs through whatever means or at the very least get them excited about winning and trying to do something more than just show up each week.

   On another thought (I think it was a nightmare I had after watching the Jags play) Gus Bradley fits the bill of about what we would hire. He has an incredible Marvin-like knack for not inspiring players, he's gonna be cheap, and he's darn sure gonna be available. But that's a nightmare on Halloween for everyone to mull over. :paul:

Professionals do take their crafts seriously. You'd have to think all NFL players are doing exactly what they wanted in life, so they should be taking it seriously. I don't know anyone who found "their job" and was working for "money". You will bleed sweat for something you love. There is a spottable difference between those who love what they do and those earning a paycheck. The Bengals don't care about that difference, they keep everyone.

If you want to be a legend you have to have talent and work ethic. Work ethic can overcome some talent, but talent cannot overcome work ethic. Those who work hard can overcome talent. The legends have the work ethic to match their natural talent. Who could have been a legend on our team? Geno Atkins, Gio Bernard, and AJ Green. There is nobody else that has the talent level. Andy Dalton appears to have the work ethic but he's pushing his talent to the max and it's not close to Geno/Gio/AJ.

Regardless, who bleeds sweat on our team? AJ Green, Andy Dalton, Giovani Bernard. Who on the Defense? Atkins gets double teamed, so it's hard to tell, I'm guessing he does too. Anyone else? Doubt it. Adam Jones is old.

You better figure out if you want to be legendary early on in life, 20s and early 30s are for cementing those habits. 

(10-31-2016, 03:42 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: or how much most athletes/teams care in general.

I keep seeing people talking about discipline, character, fire, passion, etc. and I just dont think that stuff resonates with a lot of the athletes out there as much as it does with the fans.

Fans are emotionally invested in their teams. They look at the team as a representation of their city and themselves. Most of the athletes in pro sports never grew up cheering or rooting for the team they are currently on and dont share that passion that the fans have.

Sure, athletes are competitive and they want to win but I just dont think they share in that same passion about their team that the fans share. They try their hardest, get their check, and if they win...great, if they lose...they move on with their lives.

A friend of mine does some work for the Bengals and travels with them for most of their games. I asked him what it was like after the Dallas loss, how the mood was on the plane ride home after they got their butts kicked. He responded "just another game".

Obviously players would rather win games than lose games, but I dont think they lose too much sleep over it.

This starts at the very top and snowballs downhill.

Mike Brown wants to win but under his conditions, loyalty, money, his retaining full power are first priorities. 

Marvin Lewis fully knows he has no true level of success to achieve. No threshold he has to stay above, and that trickles down to all the other coaches. 

Which in turn trickles down to the players. The culture is totally the polar opposite of winning. There's no true accountability here which totally destroys discipline.

This team (HC, staff, Players, everybody) broke in pieces with Pittsburgh playoff train wreck and will not recover with out major changes.

We need the players who are truly showing passion (Green, Dalton, Whitworth, A. Jones, Kirkpatrick, Atkins, Dunlap, Bernard) to hold their teammates accountable. I really hope they do.

(10-31-2016, 04:49 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: Absolutely! Well put.

Unfortunately, if the players are a reflection of their head coach, we are in serious trouble. 

We ARE in serious trouble!!!

(10-31-2016, 07:32 PM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: Professionals do take their crafts seriously. You'd have to think all NFL players are doing exactly what they wanted in life, so they should be taking it seriously. I don't know anyone who found "their job" and was working for "money". You will bleed sweat for something you love. There is a spottable difference between those who love what they do and those earning a paycheck. The Bengals don't care about that difference, they keep everyone.

If you want to be a legend you have to have talent and work ethic. Work ethic can overcome some talent, but talent cannot overcome work ethic. Those who work hard can overcome talent. The legends have the work ethic to match their natural talent. Who could have been a legend on our team? Geno Atkins, Gio Bernard, and AJ Green. There is nobody else that has the talent level. Andy Dalton appears to have the work ethic but he's pushing his talent to the max and it's not close to Geno/Gio/AJ.

Regardless, who bleeds sweat on our team? AJ Green, Andy Dalton, Giovani Bernard. Who on the Defense? Atkins gets double teamed, so it's hard to tell, I'm guessing he does too. Anyone else? Doubt it. Adam Jones is old.

You better figure out if you want to be legendary early on in life, 20s and early 30s are for cementing those habits. 

This may account for the noticeable drop off of some key players this year. They see that working hard gets the same rewards as players not working hard. So why work hard.