(07-17-2015, 10:50 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: Don't get me wrong. I think Sanu is better than Hankerson. I just don't think that he's THAT much better than him. When they are both playing the #3 position they get about the same yards, and TDs. I think that the whole thing depends on how well White plays next year. If he plays like he normally does and gets +1000 yards (or close), and close to 10 TDs Atlanta will have a better trio, but if he stays on the decline I think that we have a slight edge over them IF Jones plays well next year.

You have to remember Jones might not come back at 100% either.

Well here's another thing that can change depending on how you rank them.

I do believe White and Hankerson could easily have more total yards than Sanu and Jones next year, but I don't think it will necessarily have to do with who is more talented as a #2/#3 duo. Matt Ryan is probably going to be throwing for a lot more yards than Andy because well, Jeremy Hill/Gio compared to uhhh...those guys in Atlanta that may run the ball sometimes, isn't really close to a fair comparison. IMO it's safe to say that ATL will be airing it out more than most teams in 2015.

I'm not trying to be a homer here, and I'll use a completely different team for my next example. Take the Redskins, a team that I believe has more talent at WR than the Bengals and a lot of other teams in the NFL right now. Those guys in ATL may have had bigger volume numbers than Garcon/Jackson/Roberts last season, but I think WAS is hands down one of the best groups of receiving talent in the league. I can't really discount Garcon, Jackson, and Roberts just because they had to catch passes from some combination of RGIII, Kirk Cousins, and Colt freakin' McCoy.

That's one of the reasons I must take into consideration more than just raw stats, although I understand we're on a message board and it's not so easy to argue with much more than this guy's stats and that guy's stats. Roddy White had over 900 yards and 7 TDs, so statistically it doesn't seem so bad, I just personally think he looked like a shell of himself doing so, and can't see him rebounding as a guy turning 34 in November that has certainly been on the decline.

Hard to tell. Wouldn't you need to account for the QB as well?

(07-17-2015, 10:30 AM)kevin Wrote: I can't compare them to any other team, since nobody knows really what we have at WR just yet.

What??  Our #1, #2, and #3 WRs have a combined 136 NFL games with Andy Dalton.  Is there another WR tandem on that list that has played that many games with the same QB on the same team?  I might actually wager that Dalton and our top 3 WRs have had more game time together than many on that list.

Er...right?  Either way, they aren't a mystery.

(07-17-2015, 11:37 AM)Nately120 Wrote: What??  Our #1, #2, and #3 WRs have a combined 136 NFL games with Andy Dalton.  Is there another WR tandem on that list that has played that many games with the same QB on the same team?  I might actually wager that Dalton and our top 3 WRs have had more game time together than many on that list.

Er...right?  Either way, they aren't a mystery.

If I get bored at work before someone else does the work, I may go and show the figures for each team on the list.

Games played in general or what? Do we have a specific snap count threshold? Like if a guy is on the field for 2 snaps, is that a "game played" with the QB??

(07-17-2015, 11:39 AM)djs7685 Wrote: If I get bored at work before someone else does the work, I may go and show the figures for each team on the list.

Games played in general or what? Do we have a specific snap count threshold? Like if a guy is on the field for 2 snaps, is that a "game played" with the QB??

I can see about 15 teams on that list that involve QB uncertainty, or injures, or big changes in the past season or going into this season, etc.  The fact that Dalton, AJ, Jones, and Sanu have spent their entire careers together makes them one of the least mysterious groups on the list...even when you factor in Jones missing all of last season.

(07-17-2015, 11:43 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I can see about 15 teams on that list that involve QB uncertainty, or injures, or big changes in the past season or going into this season, etc.  The fact that Dalton, AJ, Jones, and Sanu have spent their entire careers together makes them one of the least mysterious groups on the list...even when you factor in Jones missing all of last season.

Yeah I just started going through the list and realized that's going to be a pain in the ass to do the work for all the teams. These are very accurate statements though, a lot of these teams have had big recent changes, and I don't see many on the list that all 3 have spent their entire career with the same QB.

I think the bigger mystery here is how does MLJ come back from injury and how does Hue utilize the offense this season.

(07-17-2015, 11:50 AM)djs7685 Wrote: I think the bigger mystery here is how does MLJ come back from injury and how does Hue utilize the offense this season.

Ida know...I'm choosing to take the biggest dose of off-season hype and predict that we run Hill 45 times a game for a 3,600 yard season and about 24 fumbles.

(07-17-2015, 10:55 AM)spazz70 Wrote: 6-10..  With a healthy 2013 MLJ....top 5 maybe top 3.... Someone else said that MLJ was not even top 30...In 2013 MLJ was...

43 in yards...considering 32 starters that is pretty good for a number 2
9 in TDs...very good overall no matter what
43 in recepetions...again, with 32 nfl starters..pretty good for the number 2

While a healthy MLJ in 2013 was not in the statistical catergory of a starter he was one of the top #2 WRs in the league

Marvin Jones was 43rd in receiving yards in 2013. I like Marvin but I don't think he is one of the best #2s in the NFL. I realize he had 10 TDs in "13" but  judging a WR purely off TDS can be misleading somewhat.

I guess it's safe to say that most people feel our WR trio is 8-12th in the league.

(07-17-2015, 03:31 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: I guess it's safe to say that most people feel our WR trio is 8-12th in the league.

I think if 8-12 was an option it would be 100% other than the guy going ultra-homer-troll saying we're #1 or #2.

I voted 6-10. The way Mo dissapeared late last season, MLJ's injury and AJ's injury is why we slip.

If they all stay healthy and play up to their potential they could be one of the best trios though.

(07-17-2015, 09:50 AM)fredtoast Wrote: It is really hard to rank groups of three players.

how much weight do you give to the best guy?  How much does the worst guy pull them down?

I could see the Bengals anywhere from abut 6 to 12.  So I'll day 6-10.

This - I think of guys like Hankerson and Caldwell that aren't  any better than Sanu/ Wright.  I certainly think that if Jones stays healthy that Sanu and/ or Wright (who if healthy I think is going to be really good) are easily comparable if not better.

(07-17-2015, 03:56 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I voted 6-10. The way Mo dissapeared late last season, MLJ's injury and AJ's injury is why we slip.

If they all stay healthy and play up to their potential they could be one of the best trios though.

There are those who think that Mo disappeared last season because he was burned out and targeted as our only real receiver.   I don't know.  I've never felt he was money like Housh.  But with the other guys healthy he's better than a lot of teams' # 3.  And I'm hoping that Wright's injury is not as serious as I'm starting to be afraid is.  If it's not I think he will turn into our new # 3 before the season's out.

 
ATL- Julio Jones, Roddy White, Leonard Hankerson
CHI- Alshon Jeffrey, Kevin White, Eddie Royal
DEN- DeMaryius Thomas, Emmanual Sanders, Andre Caldwell
DET- Calvin Johnson, Golden Tate, Lance Moore
GBP- Jordy Nelson, Randall Cobb, DaVante Adams
IND- Andre Johnson, TY Hilton, Phillip Dorsett
NYG- Odell Beckham, Victor Cruz, Ruben Randle
PIT- Antonio Brown, Markus Wheaton, Martavis Bryant
WAS- Pierre Garcon, DeSean Jackson, Andre Roberts
TBB- Vince Jackson, Mike Evans, Louis Murphy

I would take all of these trio's over ours. I accidentally clicked on 6-10, but I have them at 11th.

(07-17-2015, 11:58 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Ida know...I'm choosing to take the biggest dose of off-season hype and predict that we run Hill 45 times a game for a 3,600 yard season and about 24 fumbles.

You're really hard on Hill about those 5 fumbles. Imo, it's too early to worry. Adrian Peterson had 20 fumbles in his first 3 seasons, including seasons with 9 and 7 fumbles. My point is that when a RB produces at a very high level (like Hill or Peterson), it earns him a little leeway with the fumbling. Any RB who gets 200+ carries is probably going to fumble at least 3 times. So complaining about a couple extra fumbles from Hill just seems like nitpicking about filet mignon.

I voted 11-16, but feel that an argument could be made to sneak the Bengals into 10th, but no higher. AJ is elite, Marvin Jones is talented but inconsistent, Sanu is a pedestrian talent. I look for Denarious Moore to steal some snaps from Sanu, and for James Wright to have 1-2 decent games this season. This is the year that Brandon Tate finally gets cut, and Alford takes over on special teams. I also think Jake Kumerow gets stashed on the PS.

(07-17-2015, 11:47 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: You're really hard on Hill about those 5 fumbles. Imo, it's too early to worry. Adrian Peterson had 20 fumbles in his first 3 seasons, including seasons with 9 and 7 fumbles. My point is that when a RB produces at a very high level (like Hill or Peterson), it earns him a little leeway with the fumbling. Any RB who gets 200+ carries is probably going to fumble at least 3 times. So complaining about a couple extra fumbles from Hill just seems like nitpicking about filet mignon.

He just needs to "let a little air out" and everything will be fine.

(07-18-2015, 11:43 AM)Interceptor Wrote: He just needs to "let a little air out" and everything will be fine.

Well it worked for Law Firm, so.