(01-01-2017, 09:04 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Same move ???  sure Coughlin did very well at NY but to say we are in the same place for the last 14 years as we were before Marvin came is just factually wrong... 

Maybe it is time to move from Marvin, but his record as a winning coach overall with a franchise that puts him as a positive for Bengals over time not a negative

the goal is to win the Super bowl and we have not moved 1 step closer since marvin got here and that is a fact.

(01-01-2017, 11:06 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: the goal is to win the Super bowl and we have not moved 1 step closer since marvin got here and that is a fact.

Uh, no.  That is not a fact at all.

(01-02-2017, 11:33 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Uh, no.  That is not a fact at all.

I'm not counting 7 first round playoff losses in a row as steps towards the Super Bowl.  

Sorry.

(01-01-2017, 11:06 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: the goal is to win the Super bowl and we have not moved 1 step closer since marvin got here and that is a fact.

Talk about an extremist.  Were you in a coma through the 90's? Being that illogical doesn't enhance your opinions it breaks them.

I'm not endorsing Marvin but to say we haven't made 1 step closer since he has been here is ludicrous.

Get a grip on reality.

(01-02-2017, 02:06 PM)CageTheBengal Wrote: Talk about an extremist.  Were you in a coma through the 90's? Being that illogical doesn't enhance your opinions it breaks them.

I'm not endorsing Marvin but to say we haven't made 1 step closer since he has been here is ludicrous.

Get a grip on reality.

I'm not giving Marvin a free pass because of what happened 20 years ago.  

In case you didn't notice, we finished 6-9-1.  In what universe is that close to a Super Bowl?

I  could also say we've regressed from 1988 as well, since we made the Super Bowl that year.  What I am saying we have moved no closer to a Super Bowl than we were in 1991 when Wyche was coach.  

Has he coached teams with better records than some 90's, 80's, 70's & 60's Bengals teams?  Yes.  I will give you that.

(01-02-2017, 02:01 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: I'm not counting 7 first round playoff losses in a row as steps towards the Super Bowl.  

Sorry.

No need to apologize for being wrong.

Your opinion has no effect on reality.

(01-02-2017, 02:46 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: I'm not giving Marvin a free pass because of what happened 20 years ago.  

In case you didn't notice, we finished 6-9-1.  In what universe is that close to a Super Bowl?

I  could also say we've regressed from 1988 as well, since we made the Super Bowl that year.  What I am saying we have moved no closer to a Super Bowl than we were in 1991 when Wyche was coach.  

Has he coached teams with better records than some 90's, 80's, 70's & 60's Bengals teams?  Yes.  I will give you that.

If you don't make the playoffs for 15 consecutive years, then you hire a head coach and do make the playoffs, you are indeed, one step closer to the Super Bowl. 

(12-29-2016, 11:44 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Yes.  We should give up what we have been doing and try to be more like the Jaguars.  They haven't won more than 5 games in 7 years,  but who cares.  It is more fun to fire coaches than win games, right?

and both teams have the same amount of playoff wins 

(01-02-2017, 02:55 PM)fredtoast Wrote: No need to apologize for being wrong.

Your opinion has no effect on reality.

My opinion of progress and yours are just different.  You have supported Marvin year after year.  I have not.  We're fans with opinions and do not work for the team so we have no impact on the reality of the team's direction.  Very good observation.

(01-02-2017, 04:26 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: If you don't make the playoffs for 15 consecutive years, then you hire a head coach and do make the playoffs, you are indeed, one step closer to the Super Bowl. 

Similarly, if we win 7 games next year we will be a step closer than we were this year.  I meant that we have not taken a step forward to mean we have not won a playoff game in all the time he has been here, therefor have not progressed in our efforts to become Super Bowl champions.  

I can measure a regular season Win/Loss record just as well as the next guy.

(01-02-2017, 04:58 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: My opinion of progress and yours are just different.

Your opinion does not matter.  You can claim that in your opinion fire is cold, but that does not change reality.

14 years between last Super Bowl appearance and hiring Marvin....72-152... 321 win%... 11 losing seasons....1 playoff

14 years of Marvin.....118-103-3... 533 win%... 4 losing seasons.....7 playoffs


Everyone agrees we have not gone far enough, but you can not claim there has been no progress.  

(01-02-2017, 08:09 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Your opinion does not matter.  You can claim that in your opinion fire is cold, but that does not change reality.

14 years between last Super Bowl appearance and hiring Marvin....72-152... 321 win%... 11 losing seasons....1 playoff

14 years of Marvin.....118-103-3... 533 win%... 4 losing seasons.....7 playoffs


Everyone agrees we have not gone far enough, but you can not claim there has been no progress.  

I could give two shits about the 90's.  It's over, get over it.   Quit living in the past. 

14 years  and no playoff wins is unacceptable.  And that is reality whether you like it or not.

                            

(12-29-2016, 11:44 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Yes.  We should give up what we have been doing and try to be more like the Jaguars.  They haven't won more than 5 games in 7 years,  but who cares.  It is more fun to fire coaches than win games, right?

The classic Fred misdirection.  As for Coughlin, he's had far more Playoff success with the both the Jaguars and the Giants than Marvin has had in 15 years in Cincy.  Coughlin has won Playoff games wherever he's been, two Super Bowls, and is a guy who doesn't permit knucklehead behavior.  All of which is a major upgrade from Marvin.  The Jags have some talent.  Coughlin might get them over the top.

(01-03-2017, 12:14 AM)2MinutesHate Wrote: I could give two shits about the 90's.  It's over, get over it.   Quit living in the past. 

You were the one who first brought up the change between before Marvin arrived and since we hired him.  How are we supposed to make that comparison without looking at the time before Marvin arrived?

First you think you can just make up whatever meaning you want for a word, and now you think we can compare two periods without mentioning one of those periods.


This is getting ridiculous.

(01-01-2017, 11:06 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: the goal is to win the Super bowl and we have not moved 1 step closer since marvin got here and that is a fact.

(01-02-2017, 11:33 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Uh, no.  That is not a fact at all.

One could validly argue, albeit with peculiar logic, that the Bengals actually took a step backwards during the Lewis regime than the 90's.  After all, the Bengals actually won a Playoff game in the 90's, and advanced to the Divisional round, which, theoretically had them 1 step closer to a Super Bowl than at any time under Lewis. The Bengals under Lewis have never advanced from the Wild Card round. Sure, the regular season winning percentage is better under Marvin, but the team has zero Playoff success to show for it.

At the end of the day, Marvin has had almost 15 years to get it done, which is an eternity for a professional head coach/manager. His accomplishments are lacking. An NFL record for most consecutive Playoff losses. A terrible record against Pittsburgh. A terrible Prime Time record. A tendency to play not to lose, and end up losing anyway. It's time for a new coach, and a new staff.

(01-02-2017, 04:58 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: My opinion of progress and yours are just different.  You have supported Marvin year after year.  I have not.  We're fans with opinions and do not work for the team so we have no impact on the reality of the team's direction.  Very good observation.


Similarly, if we win 7 games next year we will be a step closer than we were this year.  I meant that we have not taken a step forward to mean we have not won a playoff game in all the time he has been here, therefor have not progressed in our efforts to become Super Bowl champions.  

I can measure a regular season Win/Loss record just as well as the next guy.

It's not similar. Winning more games in a regular season doesn't matter if you don't make the playoffs. You can't win a super bowl unless you're in the playoffs. If you're not in the playoffs for 15 seasons, then you hire a coach and you are then in the playoffs at some point, you're a step closer. 

I'm not arguing for Marvin Lewis, just that your claim that the Bengals aren't closer than they were before, is wrong. They're just a step closer. His teams have never gone beyond that single step. 

(01-03-2017, 01:12 AM)t3r3e3 Wrote: One could validly argue, albeit with peculiar logic, that the Bengals actually took a step backwards during the Lewis regime than the 90's.  After all, the Bengals actually won a Playoff game in the 90's, and advanced to the Divisional round, which, theoretically had them 1 step closer to a Super Bowl than at any time under Lewis. The Bengals under Lewis have never advanced from the Wild Card round. Sure, the regular season winning percentage is better under Marvin, but the team has zero Playoff success to show for it.

At the end of the day, Marvin has had almost 15 years to get it done, which is an eternity for a professional head coach/manager.  His accomplishments are lacking.  An NFL record for most consecutive Playoff losses.  A terrible record against Pittsburgh.  A terrible Prime Time record.  A tendency to play not to lose, and end up losing anyway.  It's time for a new coach, and a new staff.

Exactly my point.  Well said.

(01-03-2017, 02:10 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: It's not similar. Winning more games in a regular season doesn't matter if you don't make the playoffs. You can't win a super bowl unless you're in the playoffs. If you're not in the playoffs for 15 seasons, then you hire a coach and you are then in the playoffs at some point, you're a step closer. 

I'm not arguing for Marvin Lewis, just that your claim that the Bengals aren't closer than they were before, is wrong. They're just a step closer. His teams have never gone beyond that single step. 

Give it up.  These drama queens have to exaggerate everything.  Everything has to be the "worst of all time" for them.

Anyone who does not think the Bengals made any progress under Marvin Lewis is just denying reality in order to cry out for more attention.

(01-03-2017, 12:14 AM)2MinutesHate Wrote: I could give two shits about the 90's.  It's over, get over it.   Quit living in the past. 

14 years  and no playoff wins is unacceptable.  And that is reality whether you like it or not.

                            

Amen, get so sick of the we could go back to/we're better than we were in the 90's ! Today's situation has zero to do with the 90's. 

Marvin can't get the job done - period. That's not going to change this coming season. Not with MB's bargain basement FA approach and his loyalty to these bum coaches like PA.

(01-03-2017, 01:04 AM)t3r3e3 Wrote: The classic Fred misdirection.  As for Coughlin, he's had far more Playoff success with the both the Jaguars and the Giants than Marvin has had in 15 years in Cincy.  Coughlin has won Playoff games wherever he's been, two Super Bowls, and is a guy who doesn't permit knucklehead behavior.  All of which is a major upgrade from Marvin.  The Jags have some talent.  Coughlin might get them over the top.

Yup.....but we "want to be like the Jaguars".....I'd rather be a "drama queen" than that goddamn dense.

(01-01-2017, 02:42 PM)jfkbengals Wrote: Jacksonville joined the NFL 4 years after our last playoff win, so...

Um......that was my point.