I would have Rodgers 1, Brady 2, Ryan 3, Brees 4, Carr 5, then Luck thru Wilson as 6-10 order irrelevant.

Dalton is around that 12-14 ballpark imo, but I wouldnt have Cam or Winston above him. Heck Id put Bradford above him instead of those two actually.

(01-04-2017, 11:49 PM)Millhouse Wrote: I would have Rodgers 1, Brady 2, Ryan 3, Brees 4, Carr 5, then Luck thru Wilson as 6-10 order irrelevant.

Dalton is around that ballpark imo, but I wouldnt have Cam or Winston above him. Heck Id put Bradford above him instead of those two actually.

Bradford had one heck of a year, IMO. Especially considering the circumstances. I almost feel sorry for the guy. Rams, Chip Kelly, then the Vikings with all their current problems? He still has never had a good situation where you can really judge him.

(01-04-2017, 09:19 PM)bengalsturntup926 Wrote: He didn't have the tools?  Yeah right.  Cam Newton doesn't have a aj green or boyd, not even a gio

Newton has Benjamin, Ginn (fastest receiver in the NFL), Olsen (better than Eifert), a good OL, and a good running game..... Wtf are you talking about?

(01-05-2017, 12:12 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: Newton has Benjamin, Ginn (fastest receiver in the NFL), Olsen (better than Eifert), a good OL, and a good running game..... Wtf are you talking about?

Not sure how I forgot Benjamin. Kids a beast.

Cam completed 52% of his passes.

Alex Smith gets no respect; he should be much higher.

(01-05-2017, 12:38 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Alex Smith gets no respect; he should be much higher.

Agreed. He got slapped with the dreaded "game manager" label years ago and is pretty much disregarded every year. Alex was better than guys like Carson and Cam this year.

(01-04-2017, 09:20 PM)bengalsturntup926 Wrote: And if he don't have the tools, then why are so many people not wanting another receiver?

You know he was missing AJ and Eifert for a significant amount of the season right? 

(01-05-2017, 01:22 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: You know he was missing AJ and Eifert for a significant amount of the season right? 

That doesn't fit into the hate on Dalton theme around here though.

(01-05-2017, 12:41 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Agreed. He got slapped with the dreaded "game manager" label years ago and is pretty much disregarded every year. Alex was better than guys like Carson and Cam this year.

It's because his career high in yards is 3500 and his career high in TDs is 23. They aren't even in the same year. He only had one year where he had more than 3k yards when a 49er, and only 1 year where he had more than 20 TDs (his whole career). He's been in the league as long as Rodgers too. If you look up game manager in the football dictionary his picture is next to the description.

(01-05-2017, 12:14 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Not sure how I forgot Benjamin. Kids a beast.

What gets me is when people say that Dalton has had "the most talented team in the league" around him and then say Cam is carrying his team. Newton had Steve Smith, LaFell, Olsen, a really good run game, a great defense, a easy division, and a good OL when he came in the league.... Dalton had Green, Simpson, Gresham, a good OL, a good defense, a mediocre at best running game, and a really tough division. Yeah, Dalton had a good team around him but it's no where close to what people make it out to be (hell, the only years he had good receiving weapons was in 2013 and 2015 when Eifert and Jones decided not to get hurt). Newton has had a better team around him and people say that he's carrying it... Shit is crazy sometimes.

Andy didn't throw enough TD's.

(01-05-2017, 01:36 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: It's because his career high in yards is 3500 and his career high in TDs is 23. They aren't even in the same year. He only had one year where he had more than 3k yards when a 49er, and only 1 year where he had more than 20 TDs. He's been in the league as long as Rodgers too. If you look up game manager in the football dictionary his picture is next to the description.

Alex has been one of the most efficient QBs in the NFL over the last several years, game manager or not. He's a good one IMO. Don't mistake this as me saying he's a top 10 guy or anything silly. I just think a lot of teams would love to have that "game manager".

(01-05-2017, 02:16 AM)Atomic Orange Wrote: Andy didn't throw enough TD's.

Wilson had an almost identical season statistically and was ranked 10th.
Cam had one more TD and wasn't even close in any other category
Alex Smith had 3 fewer TDs and ranked one spot higher

I agree Dalton needs to throw more than 18 TDs, but low TD totals didn't stop Rosenthal from grading some of these guys highly. Yards, accuracy, and protecting the football should be huge factors as well. 

(01-05-2017, 02:17 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Alex has been one of the most efficient QBs in the NFL over the last several years, game manager or not.

He's a good one IMO. Don't mistake this as me saying he's a top 10 guy or anything silly. I just think a lot of teams would love to have that "game manager".

Sure, but he's not going to win games for you. He needs a defense and run game otherwise he's going to take a lot of Ls. Its not hard to be efficient when you rarely throw it down field and is dink and dunk. I think the only year he had more than 20 TDs most of them came from RBs, or at least a lot of them did. I don't think I would take Smith over most QBs in the league. The only up side with his is that he won't blow a game, unless you consider not being productive as blowing a game.

(01-05-2017, 02:28 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Wilson had an almost identical season statistically and was ranked 10th.
Cam had one more TD and wasn't even close in any other category
Alex Smith had 3 fewer TDs and ranked one spot higher

I agree Dalton needs to throw more than 18 TDs, but low TD totals didn't stop Rosenthal from grading some of these guys highly. Yards, accuracy, and protecting the football should be huge factors as well. 

Ah, then it's def the red hair then. And who he plays for.

(01-05-2017, 02:37 AM)Atomic Orange Wrote: Ah, then it's def the red hair then. And who he plays for.

Idk man, you pointed out lack of TDs and I showed you where lack of TDs (and in Cam's case - a terrible season) doesn't seem to be a huge factor. Maybe Rosenthal doesn't like Dalton? I mean, we are talking about a guy who created "the Dalton line" - where if you're QB was worse than Dalton, you needed to look for a new QB. He only begrudgingly gave Dalton credit last year. He's also a pretty well known Steelers homer who used to write for PFT.

Can we get a QB ranking from a former NFL player or coach? That'd be nice.

Here's one from another "expert" that ranks Dalton 13th for this season

http://fansided.com/2016/12/29/nfl-quarterback-rankings-week-17-2016/

"Dalton was really bad against Houston sans his lone touchdown throw. Still, he has nothing left around him. This is one of the better quarterbacks in the league."

(01-04-2017, 11:22 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Dalton needs to be about 5 higher on that list.

Andrew Luck at 5 is a joke.
Carson Palmer was terrible considering he had one of the best pass catching groups in the NFL.
Philip Rivers just threw 21 interceptions and had the 2nd lowest completion % of his career. Maybe his age caught up to him.
Jameis Winston wasn't very impressive.
Cam Newton was TURRIBLE.

I'd currently put Dalton in front of those 5.

- - - - - - -

Prescott and Mariota are kind of hard to rank because of how ridiculously good their run games were. (2nd and 3rd in rushing, respectively) I can't imagine they'd be nearly as good if they were actually relied upon and defenses didn't have to put 7-8 in the box to try to stop the run.

- - - - - - - -

12th would be roughly where I put Dalton, probably in roughly the same level as Carr/Stafford/Cousins.

solid post.. Im in the around 10 to 12 range myself

Dalton needs to be higher. He didn't have many touchdown throws this year which hurts him, but his completion percentage, yards, interception rate, and running for his life while throwing on the run were above average this year.

Rosenthal is a prat who needs to find a new line of work.