(01-29-2017, 07:48 PM)muskiesfan Wrote: The only important things Hobson talks about are the things we should already be conditioned to;

1) The Bengals will draft BPA regardless of need. They will stick to THEIR board (***** joke) and draft who they want.
2) The available cap space for the Bengals that is reported by anyone other than the Bengals is an out and out lie.
3) The Bengals cannot afford to sign their own free agents or any first month free agents from around the league.
4) The Bengals keeping the largest sum for the rookie wage scale, injuries, and rollover as opposed to using it to actually try to win now is smart.

There are probably a couple of other things, but those are spot on every goddamn year. Another 1st round CB that won't see any real playing time until year 3 at the earliest wouldn't surprise me. Neither would drafting a 3-4 end or 3-4 OLB to be a project edge rusher in 4-3. They'll draft whoever their 3 scouts (too much credit?) were able to watch YouTube highlights of even though the players may not be a fit in our system.

The cap space is what it is. As soon as the final hard figures are announced, Hobson will slice and dice at least half of it for rollover, rookies, and injuries. You know that comes straight from the team. Plus, we're lucky if the team even starts "kicking tires" in the first 2-3 weeks of free agency. Who doesn't look forward to coming to town to be lowballed and taken to Wendy's?

Sorry. I'll go ahead and stop while the Bengals are behind. This year, the team will do the same shit they've been doing while trying to have Hobson tell us this is finally the year.

I'm going with this!

(01-29-2017, 07:48 PM)muskiesfan Wrote: The only important things Hobson talks about are the things we should already be conditioned to;

1) The Bengals will draft BPA regardless of need. They will stick to THEIR board (***** joke) and draft who they want.
2) The available cap space for the Bengals that is reported by anyone other than the Bengals is an out and out lie.
3) The Bengals cannot afford to sign their own free agents or any first month free agents from around the league.
4) The Bengals keeping the largest sum for the rookie wage scale, injuries, and rollover as opposed to using it to actually try to win now is smart.

There are probably a couple of other things, but those are spot on every goddamn year. Another 1st round CB that won't see any real playing time until year 3 at the earliest wouldn't surprise me. Neither would drafting a 3-4 end or 3-4 OLB to be a project edge rusher in 4-3. They'll draft whoever their 3 scouts (too much credit?) were able to watch YouTube highlights of even though the players may not be a fit in our system.

The cap space is what it is. As soon as the final hard figures are announced, Hobson will slice and dice at least half of it for rollover, rookies, and injuries. You know that comes straight from the team. Plus, we're lucky if the team even starts "kicking tires" in the first 2-3 weeks of free agency. Who doesn't look forward to coming to town to be lowballed and taken to Wendy's?

Sorry. I'll go ahead and stop while the Bengals are behind. This year, the team will do the same shit they've been doing while trying to have Hobson tell us this is finally the year.

(01-29-2017, 08:53 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote:

Awe, kitty!  

(01-28-2017, 02:06 PM)jj22 Wrote: I've wished for Hobs to be wrong many a offseasons. But he's always right in the end. Spot on on who we want to re-sign, and how the FO breaks down the cap to keep us only able to sign one key free agent, two if we're lucky. When it comes to understanding "model model". Hobs should be trusted.

This.

So in other words there is no REAL interest in winning a championship.

(01-28-2017, 01:53 PM)jj22 Wrote: I think Hobs is full of spin. But spin for the FO and a hint of things to come. I believe there's key notes to be taken out of his articles. Especially when it comes to offseason plans. Rather I agree or not.

Oh for sure.  That's the reason we act like Hobspin annoys us, but reading one of his articles gives us a little insight that I can't recall hearing with any of my other favorite teams.  They chose to prepare the fanbase through him to condition us to continue to buy into their product.  Yea we threaten to not renew or watch, and maybe a few do but maybe I'm alone on this one but I'm kinda happy this team doesn't have me tricked into being tempted to let them control me like they have when I was young, but that's another story.  

As for the team, the writing is on the wall I don't think we really need Hobspin to print it.  Cincy seems to sign their top players (CP, Ocho, Andy, Green, Geno, Dunlap and maybe Whit yet again) and tend to prioritize a cost per position.  We don't draft or sign a safety for corner money, same goes for guard/center with tackle money.  We can debate what that even means, but that's how they see it.  They'll let a player walk even for the sake of chemistry, and put the onus on the young drafted player to "do their job".  It doesn't matter if they can't see that planning on a young untested player to produce (Hunt, Williams, Ogbuehi, etc..) without a realistic backup plan is short sighted, there is a system.  What other team would even paint the picture of comp pick value vs what's available now? They've sold us not to trust a FA to fill a need, as good teams build thru the draft.  Only a sith speaks in absolutes, and Marvin serves Palpatine well. So unless there is a Jedi within the FO, we will see Zeitler walk and pray that Westerman and or Ogbuehi doesn't get Andy hurt....let alone actually make the playoffs.   

(01-30-2017, 12:52 AM)Joelist Wrote: So in other words there is no REAL interest in winning a championship.

Nope.  Just gonna hope these suspects, err, prospects turn into all-pros and maybe something falls into their laps.  You know how it goes around here.

My realistic (i.e. sad perspective of a jaded fan) hope is that this draft lays some groundwork.  Perhaps they will be able to get some guys that can provide support for the core of talent and bring about a resurgence in the Dalton-Green era.  I know there aren't any impact fas coming our way, and I know that we'll probably lose some good players.  Hopefully they can recapture some magic in April.  

On a positive note, the Ravens look to have regressed, and the Flacco deal is a huge albatross that is crippling that franchise.  The Steelers are seeing cracks in the foundation with Brown's antics and Big Ben entering the twilight of his career.  The window may have closed on the Bengals 2011-2015 rise to relative respectability, but another seems very likely to be opening.  

i guess the only question is: just how will Mike and Marvin **** this up?

anybody think that when Lewis said its going to be a completely different 2017 that might mean well actually bring in a top corner and lb? It's not probably but possible. Especially with the lack of fa we have next year.

(01-28-2017, 01:21 AM)J24 Wrote: 2.) if the Bengal don't trade AJ MC for anything from( if offered) a 3rd to a first their stupid and a comp pick shouldn't stop them from signing a decent backup.(seriously how the f would the front office be swayed by that)

One other point about AJM as a compensatory pick:  With 11 picks in this draft already, the Bengals would have difficulty creating space for 11 new players on the roster as it is....and there has to be a willing partner to package picks and move up for a higher selection.  I would hate to see all the later round picks shine in camp and preseason, try to get hidden on the PS, only to have them taken by other teams with no compensation.  

If the Bengals are able to get any trades for picks, it would make sense to push some as next year's selections.  The Texans first rounder in 2018?  Yes, please.  

here is what will happen next year

Bodine will be the center and will get killed every time we play a 3-4 defense.

we will lose twice to Steelers

Our running game will stink against upper level teams.

Pass pro will be awful against upper level teams

No pass rush against upper level teams

We will not make playoffs but if we do out in first game

No chance in the world of winning super bowl

No effort by front office to take steps to win super bowl

Marvin will get a 5 year  extension

At some point AJ Green and Gino will want out. Dalton should want out but he is too good a guy.

In 13 years Brown family will move team because Hamilton County taxpayers wont pay for another stadium for team that does not care about winning Super Bowl

Continuing to use Bodine as center and failure to fire Marvin and let a strong new head coach hire his own staff ( like every other top NFL team or top college team would do) says everything you need to know about this organization.

(01-30-2017, 09:33 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: One other point about AJM as a compensatory pick:  With 11 picks in this draft already, the Bengals would have difficulty creating space for 11 new players on the roster as it is....and there has to be a willing partner to package picks and move up for a higher selection.  I would hate to see all the later round picks shine in camp and preseason, try to get hidden on the PS, only to have them taken by other teams with no compensation.  

If the Bengals are able to get any trades for picks, it would make sense to push some as next year's selections.  The Texans first rounder in 2018?  Yes, please.  

I got an idea let's get rid of bad players like Rey Maluaga, Pat Sims, Russell bodine, Pacman Jones, not resign Margus Hunt,and not resign Domata Peko.  That's six new spots that just opened up. Secondly do you think that Bill Belicheck looks at his roster and says well we can't have anymore draft picks because our team is already to deep. I have never heard any coach say well we have to many good players here.

(01-30-2017, 12:48 PM)J24 Wrote: I got an idea let's get rid of bad players like Rey Maluaga, Pat Sims, Russell bodine, Pacman Jones, not resign Margus Hunt,and not resign Domata Peko.  That's six new spots that just opened up. Secondly do you think that Bill Belicheck looks at his roster and says well we can't have anymore draft picks because our team is already to deep. I have never heard any coach say well we have to many good players here.

Start the season without a starting Center?  Just venting, I guess.  

11 draft picks.  Do the math.  Even if they were to get rid of the players you suggest, that leaves five additional draft picks fighting for positions.  Who else goes?  This should be entertaining if nothing else.  

Are you sure that the players coming in would be upgrades?  You want to just give them the position instead of earning it?  Yeah, that worked out well with Bodine and Ogbuehi.  

As far as the Belicheck reference, he is one that loves to compile picks for later draft classes, so try again.

(01-28-2017, 05:02 AM)BoomerFan Wrote: I mean if we keep AJ this year and he walks next year and you still get the 3rd round comp pick, OK I see their argument. 

As for the other stuff, ideally we'd draft another Left Tackle this year to give Cedric Ogbuehi some competition. Whit may get re-signed but how long can he stay healthy and play without losing his A game? Maybe take a guy like Adam Bisnowaty in the 3rd. If Ced improves then that's fine too -- you now have an LT backup who can also play Guard. I doubt we'll go that way though. 

Do you really think that AJ is going to get a mega contract?  That's a large part of determining what round of comp pick that the team gets.

Also, keep in mind that a 3rd round comp pick is really a 4th round pick since it is AFTER the 32nd pick in the 3rd round.  I get so sick of Hobson talking about how great these picks are.  In reality a 4th round comp is really a 5th rounder.  So, to avoid signing free agents just to get these LATER round picks is a joke.

Trade him this year for a true 2nd or 3rd round pick.  We definitely could use the extra pick to fill a need.

(01-28-2017, 04:05 AM)Derrick Wrote: Look for the O line to still be pathetic in 2017.

Honestly, it didn't look that bad once Ced Ogbuehi was benched.  Even without Eifert and AJ, the running game steadily improved...that and more sexy.  

(01-31-2017, 03:03 AM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Do you really think that AJ is going to get a mega contract?  That's a large part of determining what round of comp pick that the team gets.

Also, keep in mind that a 3rd round comp pick is really a 4th round pick since it is AFTER the 32nd pick in the 3rd round.  I get so sick of Hobson talking about how great these picks are.  In reality a 4th round comp is really a 5th rounder.  So, to avoid signing free agents just to get these LATER round picks is a joke.

Trade him this year for a true 2nd or 3rd round pick.  We definitely could use the extra pick to fill a need.

U do realize we got guys like George Iloka, marvin Jones etc in these later rounds so they are good. 

(01-30-2017, 09:33 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: One other point about AJM as a compensatory pick:  With 11 picks in this draft already, the Bengals would have difficulty creating space for 11 new players on the roster as it is....and there has to be a willing partner to package picks and move up for a higher selection.  I would hate to see all the later round picks shine in camp and preseason, try to get hidden on the PS, only to have them taken by other teams with no compensation.  

If the Bengals are able to get any trades for picks, it would make sense to push some as next year's selections.  The Texans first rounder in 2018?  Yes, please.  

Exactly, the 4 extra picks should be viewed as tools to move around, and put ourselves in position for the prospects we want, not as 4 extra potential players. I mean trying to keep 11 total draft picks is almost impossible, you're gonna end up trying to stash a good amount on the PS who could get scooped up by other teams.

(01-30-2017, 12:48 PM)J24 Wrote: I got an idea let's get rid of bad players like Rey Maluaga, Pat Sims, Russell bodine, Pacman Jones, not resign Margus Hunt,and not resign Domata Peko.  That's six new spots that just opened up. Secondly do you think that Bill Belicheck looks at his roster and says well we can't have anymore draft picks because our team is already to deep. I have never heard any coach say well we have to many good players here.

But what about our precious veteran leadership?

(01-31-2017, 11:30 AM)yellowxdiscipline Wrote: Exactly, the 4 extra picks should be viewed as tools to move around, and put ourselves in position for the prospects we want, not as 4 extra potential players. I mean trying to keep 11 total draft picks is almost impossible, you're gonna end up trying to stash a good amount on the PS who could get scooped up by other teams.

The issue is we haven't been drafting a lot of guys who can start or contribute year 1. To keep all 11 picks...we'll likely need 3-4 that play a lot.

(01-28-2017, 01:21 AM)J24 Wrote: http://www.bengals.com/news/article-1/Hobsons-Choice-staying-grade-true/b2cc04b2-6093-4fc1-b224-a358f0e2c292

1.) Yes I can blame the team for drafting OG because he sucks.
2.) if the Bengal don't trade AJ MC for anything from( if offered) a 3rd to a first their stupid and a comp pick shouldn't stop them from signing a decent backup.(seriously how the f would the front office be swayed by that)
3.) don't expect us to sign Zeitler he didn't even mention it.

Have to get something out of AJM. Whatever we can get it is better than nothing.

As much as i was disappointed in Zeit's play last year, he is still a pretty solid Guard and we invested a first rounder
on the guy. I like Westerman but the safe play would be to bring back Zeitler and Whitworth. Rather than Kirkpatrick.

Our O-line was our main weakness last year, you don't just let it continue to crumble into the ground.

You bring back your main players and improve the weaknesses at C and RT.

(01-30-2017, 09:51 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: Start the season without a starting Center?  Just venting, I guess.  

11 draft picks.  Do the math.  Even if they were to get rid of the players you suggest, that leaves five additional draft picks fighting for positions.  Who else goes?  This should be entertaining if nothing else.  

Are you sure that the players coming in would be upgrades?  You want to just give them the position instead of earning it?  Yeah, that worked out well with Bodine and Ogbuehi.  

As far as the Belicheck reference, he is one that loves to compile picks for later draft classes, so try again.

(Easily?) replaceable players:
Rey Maualuga
Pat Sims
Cedric Peerman (if re-signed)
Russell Bodine
TJ Johnson (if re-signed)
Eric Winston (if re-signed)
Marquis Flowers
Clayton Fejedelem
Derron Smith
Margus Hunt (if re-signed)
DeShawn Williams
Add in backup QB if McCarron traded

There are plenty of opportunities to make the roster. Will all the drafted players make it? No. But the roster isn't "too deep" by any means.