(03-22-2017, 05:27 PM)kevin Wrote: My word, AJ Green, Eifert, Bernard and Hill were injured most of the year.  Stop an think if we have a healthy Aj Green, Eifert, Hill and Bernard.   I know fans say injuries are part of the game, but losing Green and Eifert was huge plus Bernard injured and so Hill tried to play injured but kept getting knocked out of games.  Some better luck on injuries helps to turn that 6-9-1 into more wins.  THAT AND A KICKER THAT DOESN'T LOSE GAMES MISSING EXTRA POINTS.....Pro Bowl Dalton to Pro Bowl AJ Green and Pro Bowl Eifert and also LaFell and Boyd and Core.  Hill healthy scoring touchdowns.  This team could lead the NFL in points scored. Plus we still have the draft and Bengals want the LSU running back if he is there when they pick.  Bengals player director which is as close to a GM as we will get, says he wants the LSU RB. .......There is more going on here than adding a LB.  We did need a LB.  Getting this LB and getting Smith back on O Line makes drafting the LSU RB very possible. The hope is he comes on big like Elliot did for Dallas.

We won more games when they went out then we did fully healthy. Remember how healthy we were for the start of the year. We had no excuse to stink up September and October.

(03-20-2017, 04:58 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: The way I look at it...Whitworth was the only player who left that was unexpected. We knew Z was gone.

However, Minter was a surprise signing...and a very good one. Smith was a good move also that I talked about in another thread.

Our offensive line still needs a ton of work...but our defense should still be good and maybe great depending on the draft. (Foster or a good DE could put it over the top.)

You nailed it

(03-22-2017, 05:56 PM)jj22 Wrote: We won more games when they went out then we did fully healthy. Remember how healthy we were for the start of the year. We had no excuse to stink up September and October.

At New York on 9/11 but we won.  Then at Pittsburg and we lost.  Then home to play Super Bowl Champ Denver and we lost. Then came road games to New England and Dallas.  There is no possible way we start with a schedule like this. Most NFL teams would stink up September and October against such a schedule.  Plus we lost a home game thanks to London England game.  We didn't have Burfict. We didn't have Eifert.   We had lost Jones and Sanu.  Dalton had to learn Lafell and Boyd timing. Nugent stunk. 

Right there, no way we lose a home game or have a schedule that no team would want to be hit with like last year.  Plus I look for a kicker that makes extra points and we don't lose games that way....and Sanu and Jones gone but Dalton now has timing down to AJ Green, Eifert, Lafell, Boyd, Core, Erickson, Wright and I'm telling you this is the best group of pass catchers we have had since the Super Bowl teams of 1981 and 1988.  If we can get lucky and avoid major injuries, we flat out have too many pass catchers for a defense to cover. We can go deep, we can go short, we can go sideline, we can go in the middle, we can go end zone. We enter 2017 with the best combo of QBs and pass catchers since our Super Bowl years.  If we can block, we will go Super Bowl.  I said that about the 1988 team when most people thought we would stink that year.  I saw it early with the 1981 team.  It is nice to have more weapons than a defense can cover. Dalton has many pass catchers. Hopefully we can avoid major injuries as we had in 2016. 

(03-22-2017, 05:27 PM)kevin Wrote: My word, AJ Green, Eifert, Bernard and Hill were injured most of the year.  Stop an think if we have a healthy Aj Green, Eifert, Hill and Bernard.   I know fans say injuries are part of the game, but losing Green and Eifert was huge plus Bernard injured and so Hill tried to play injured but kept getting knocked out of games.  Some better luck on injuries helps to turn that 6-9-1 into more wins.  THAT AND A KICKER THAT DOESN'T LOSE GAMES MISSING EXTRA POINTS.....Pro Bowl Dalton to Pro Bowl AJ Green and Pro Bowl Eifert and also LaFell and Boyd and Core.  Hill healthy scoring touchdowns.  This team could lead the NFL in points scored. Plus we still have the draft and Bengals want the LSU running back if he is there when they pick.  Bengals player director which is as close to a GM as we will get, says he wants the LSU RB. .......There is more going on here than adding a LB.  We did need a LB.  Getting this LB and getting Smith back on O Line makes drafting the LSU RB very possible. The hope is he comes on big like Elliot did for Dallas.

We were 3-6-1 in the games Green and Gio played in. Injuries weren't the problem. Yes, Nugent missed some kicks, but if you watched all of last season and came to any conclusion other than "the offensive line is killing this team", you need to get your eyes checked.

(03-22-2017, 06:20 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: We were 3-6-1 in the games Green and Gio played in. Injuries weren't the problem. Yes, Nugent missed some kicks, but if you watched all of last season and came to any conclusion other than "the offensive line is killing this team", you need to get your eyes checked.

So then just maybe Zeitler should not be the highest paid guard in NFL history and just maybe the LA Rams over paid an aging Whitworth and just maybe not bringing back the entire 2016 O Line isn't a bad thing.  If as you say the O Line wasn't very good, then maybe moving Ced to LT and bringing back Andre Smith and drafting an O Lineman in one of the early rounds may just be what this team needs. ...I also hope you are not counting the game Green got injured on the first play. Yes you can say he played in it, but not really and it threw off the game plan huge.

If we can block, and I think we can, We have the best QB and pass catchers since Super Bowl Bengals and a better defense than Super Bowl Bengals. This may be more of a Super Bowl year than a looking at the draft in October year.

(03-22-2017, 06:27 PM)kevin Wrote: 1. So then just maybe Zeitler should not be the highest paid guard in NFL history and just maybe the LA Rams over paid an aging Whitworth and just maybe not bringing back the entire 2016 O Line isn't a bad thing. 2.  If as you say the O Line wasn't very good, 3. then maybe moving Ced to LT and bringing back Andre Smith and drafting an O Lineman in one of the early rounds may just be what this team needs. ...4. I also hope you are not counting the game Green got injured on the first play. Yes you can say he played in it, but not really and it threw off the game plan huge.

If we can block, and I think we can, We have the best QB and pass catchers since Super Bowl Bengals and a better defense than Super Bowl Bengals. This may be more of a Super Bowl year than a looking at the draft in October year.

I don't even know where to start with this post.

1. I've never said I disagreed with letting Whit and Zeitler walk, but they weren't the problem and it's silly to suggest they were. Ogbuehi being the worst rated tackle in the NFL was the problem.

2. "If, as you say, the o-line wasn't very good..."? Really bro? What line were you watching?

3. Mixing up the o-line would be great...if that didn't entail keeping the worst parts (Ogbuehi and Bodine) and dumping what was clearly our 2 best parts. Bringing back Andre helped stop the bleeding, but I don't think any sane person will say we look better on paper right now.

3. You mentioned Green AND Gio. Gio played 10 games dude. If you only want to count 9 games, we went 3-5-1, which still proves that injuries weren't the issue. Hence why you're picking nits.

4. Agree that we have a good enough defense, QB and pass catchers. The coaching is a problem and the o-line is (at best) a giant question mark.

(03-20-2017, 04:58 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: The way I look at it...Whitworth was the only player who left that was unexpected. We knew Z was gone.

However, Minter was a surprise signing...and a very good one. Smith was a good move also that I talked about in another thread.

Our offensive line still needs a ton of work...but our defense should still be good and maybe great depending on the draft. (Foster or a good DE could put it over the top.)

Hobson says Z's agents were told when he was drafted that he wouldn't get a second contract here.  If this is true, why the hell would you tell a guy that?

(03-22-2017, 08:45 PM)McC Wrote: Hobson says Z's agents were told when he was drafted that he wouldn't get a second contract here.  If this is true, why the hell would you tell a guy that?

Well basically it's not because he can just cruise through his contract here, it's so he knows he has to play well enough other teams will want him....

(03-22-2017, 08:45 PM)McC Wrote: Hobson says Z's agents were told when he was drafted that he wouldn't get a second contract here.  If this is true, why the hell would you tell a guy that?

I took it more that Z's agent told him that the Bengals don't value guards so you'll most likely move on after your rookie deal. I will say that this Hobson's Choice was one of the most aggravating ones to read.

(03-20-2017, 09:12 AM)kevin Wrote: OK, we lost some fan favorites. Peoples take that this team is giving up and in rebuilding mode, no, I don't see that at all. If that was the case they would not resign Kirkpatrick and Lafell or bring back Andre Smith or sign Minter.  I also like that Minter is 26 as opposed to the ages of Harrison, Hawk and Dansby brought in way past their prime.  So I see a lot of positives as we head into the draft next month. Plus we have picks from last few years in training mode ready to become veterans. Bodine, Dennard, Ced, Fisher, Jackson, McCarron, Boyd, Core are among the draft picks developing into veterans. It is a huge jump from college to NFL.  With the players we have and the draft coming, the Bengals can score a lot but give up few points in 2017.  Bengals already said if the LSU RB is there when they pick, they will make him a Bengal.  Don't give up on a team with Dalton and all these pass catchers and Atkins and Dunlap on defense just yet.  

Those signings do ease the sting a bit, but the front office still let the most talented two get away.

(03-22-2017, 04:08 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I agree with both of you that Fournette is a better back than Hill, and is projected to be drafted much higher I just hope it's not by Cincinnati. My comparison was for the style of runner that they both are, the downhill more power back type of runner. We don't have an offense or an offensive line that plays into that style of running at all right now...especially on the offensive line side of things.

As for what happened to Hill, I think the issue is pretty simple, the line play and the fumbles have gotten to him mentally. It's not the talent that is gone, but the confidence. He's so focused on not fumbling that he's not running aggressively. Add in, that he's getting met in the backfield or there is just no clear hole for him to run at and he's lost. Burkhead came in confident with nothing to lose and just ran and made guys miss, that is the type of back this team is going to need right now to be successful. Be it Cook or Mixon, gotta get a guy that has that Barry Sanders like ability to make people miss as soon as you get the handoff. Fournette (like Hill) is much better when they get a few steps going, have momentum and their power to burst through.

Have to agree with all of this Murdock.

Cook, Mixon and McCaffrey all fit what we need much better than Fournette.

Just saying Fournette is not just a power back, dude is extremely fast for his size and can catch the ball out of the backfield.

I think he would be much better here than Hill has been the last few years and would be an upgrade.