(04-08-2017, 11:03 PM)BenZoo2 Wrote: Wouldn't be ironic if the hang up on a Browns deal is pick 33, which the Browns give with 12 to get the jets 6th.  The jets then give 33 to us for aj

Don't be surprised if Texans make a play for AJM with pick #24

(04-08-2017, 11:15 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Don't be surprised if Texans make a play for AJM with pick #24

While it would be nice, I would guess the Texans would want more than just McCarron for a first round pick. Be looking at adding in at least one more pick.

I like McCarron, but I think we might be over-valuing him a little sometimes.

(04-08-2017, 11:51 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: While it would be nice, I would guess the Texans would want more than just McCarron for a first round pick. Be looking at adding in at least one more pick.

I like McCarron, but I think we might be over-valuing him a little sometimes.

Just a little?

(04-08-2017, 08:03 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: The argument comes down to some (not many) like me think he will be solid NFL starter once gets the reps and experience. But it appears the majority feel he is only a backup and can be no better than a backup. I understand and see both points of view. Time will tell who is correct as AJM will get his shot to start at some point in his career.

But my point is he has value to teams looking for a starter right now and I could caress less if he was never drafted, he is a NFL QB nw while others are still college wanna be QB's yet to take an NFL snap and are unknown as well. Look at the 2011 NFL list of QB's taken to see how hard it is for an NFL team to know and grab the right guy. If wrong, they wasted a pick in round 1.

I actually think McCarron could be a solid NFL starter, behind a good O-line.

Dude needs a lot of time as we saw in his few starts.

I get your point in a way, just think we need to get all we can while he still has value.

If Dalton goes down this year due to bad O-line play McCarron will only lose value unless the O-line magically improves.

Dalton has the 2nd quickest release in football, AJM has a very slow release and holds onto the ball.

(04-08-2017, 10:17 PM)phil413 Wrote: You may be too focused on AJM being a 5th rounder that hasn't played much.  It's more about what he means to the Browns.  Hue saw him firsthand.  If there is interest, they have to know Cincy values him enough to not give away especially to a rival.  When was the last time we had a young QB as an asset as well.

Cleveland can't fool themselves.  The league is QB starved, it's no longer just about looking for the next Favre and getting by with a Bobby Hebert or Steve Beurlein type...even those "bridge" guys are sparse now. So to a team like the Jets AJ would be an improvement and his field management could mean a lot to a young team.  To Cleveland it's even more.  They won't have the shot to get their QB as none are sanely able to be taken first, plus the Jets and someone leaping the Browns could nab them.  

So when they can't pry JG from NE, they have to deal with the fact that theyre shopping arounder and have only Kessler to build with.  If the thought of plugging in AJM into Hues offense isn't worth 33, they can wait til next year to start developing a QB.  They can call him a bridge if they want to, but it'll be an expensive bridge, it's going to be a great bridge tho, it's gonna b HUUUUGE, totally worth 33.  

Hey, get whatever we can get is my thought process. Don't wait until the guy has no value and is a FA.

We don't have to be desperate, but when someone offers a good deal don't pass it up for greener grass that might not be there...

(04-08-2017, 11:15 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Don't be surprised if Texans make a play for AJM with pick #24

That would change our draft prospects some for sure.

Really overwhelming to see the amount of people that think AJ is worth a first round pick. I'd take a second, and be happy with that. I don't see it.

(04-07-2017, 04:32 PM)Au165 Wrote: I'd take pick #52 this year for McCaron with a 3rd next year that could become a 2nd based on performance.

My idea of a good deal from most teams is a 2017 and conditional 2018 4th round pick. From the Browns I want both their 2nd round picks this year. Inside the division they need to pay until it hurts.

(04-08-2017, 11:15 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Don't be surprised if Texans make a play for AJM with pick #24

I seriously doubt they think he's that much better than Savage to be worth a 1st. 

(04-09-2017, 01:10 AM)WrongVerb Wrote: My idea of a good deal from most teams is a 2017 and conditional 2018 4th round pick. From the Browns I want both their 2nd round picks this year. Inside the division they need to pay until it hurts.

Browns have what? 11 picks this year? I could see us receiving two picks from them, but two 2nd rounders won't happen. I think we'd be lucky to get a 2nd and a 5th. VERY lucky.


I like AJM but I struggle to see the immense value of him.

(04-09-2017, 03:21 AM)The Caped Crusader Wrote: Browns have what? 11 picks this year? I could see us receiving two picks from them, but two 2nd rounders won't happen. I think we'd be lucky to get a 2nd and a 5th. VERY lucky.


I like AJM but I struggle to see the immense value of him.

Id be fine with aj mccaron and one of our 6th rounders for their second and the first 5th round pick. Peraonally though i think aj mccarron for sheldon richardson and the jets second rounder is the most plausible out of them all.

Would give the Texans AJM and Pacman for that #24 pick.

(04-09-2017, 04:36 AM)Go Cards Wrote: Would give the Texans AJM and Pacman for that #24 pick.

Doubt the #1 defense in the league would want an aging CB that can't stay out of trouble (on & off the field).

(04-09-2017, 05:15 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Doubt the #1 defense in the league would want an aging CB that can't stay out of trouble (on & off the field).

True. They did manage to get quite a bit of production from JJ. But then again, despite his injuries, he was younger when they got him than Pac Man is now.

(04-08-2017, 07:40 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I ask again, does anyone honestly think that giving the Stains AJM for the 33rd pick of the draft will hurt us while we draft pass rushers to go along with Atkins, Dunlap and Billings? We will improve and AJM will be a stain on the field.

I believe it will hurt us if Dalton gets injured.

(04-08-2017, 12:17 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Not enough. It does not benefit us enough. We have a great backup QB who we know can win games if AD goes down for less than $750K a year for next 2 years. He has proven he can win games in the NFL and has upside for another NFL team with options of grabbing a 1st round draft choice who is unproven and that team has to pay them 5 times more than AJM to see if they pan out.

I think our fans are severely under valuing AJM due to him being a mid round pick. The Bengals made a great draft pick and no different than players like Geno Atkins, Wilson or others, he simply has outperformed his draft position. Jimmy G. same thing for the Pats.

I stick #1 pick or we keep him (and trade him next year) to back up our QB at least 1 more year. A veteran  back up QB would cost us more and may give us no confidence in their ability to win if AD went down.

I hear ya.  It is undoubtedly a risk...especially with the apparent starter at LT.

However, that first pick at Rd 2 is extremely valuable.  There are a lot of teams that will want to trade to it to get their guy at the beginning of day 2.  The Bengals could even package it with another pick and move back in to the first round to get a OT like Robinson if he is around, say #25?

More likely, however, is they could draft an impact player at DE or maybe a player like Njoku, TE, falls to the second round and is an immediate upgrade next to Eifert.  Regardless of the position group, that player would impact the team (provided they aren't a bust and they aren't injured, of course) next year.  AJM, while a great insurance policy, will likely just sit and watch.  Dalton has only missed extended action one time in his entire career, and it was a freak play.

If you offer me a player like Njoku, Cam Robinson, or Christian McCaffery vs. AJM sitting on the bench, I do it every day and twice on Sunday.  Plus, I like AJM and would like to see the guy get a chance.  

(04-09-2017, 09:58 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I hear ya.  It is undoubtedly a risk...especially with the apparent starter at LT.

However, that first pick at Rd 2 is extremely valuable.  There are a lot of teams that will want to trade to it to get their guy at the beginning of day 2.  The Bengals could even package it with another pick and move back in to the first round to get a OT like Robinson if he is around, say #25?

More likely, however, is they could draft an impact player at DE or maybe a player like Njoku, TE, falls to the second round and is an immediate upgrade next to Eifert.  Regardless of the position group, that player would impact the team (provided they aren't a bust and they aren't injured, of course) next year.  AJM, while a great insurance policy, will likely just sit and watch.  Dalton has only missed extended action one time in his entire career, and it was a freak play.

If you offer me a player like Njoku, Cam Robinson, or Christian McCaffery vs. AJM sitting on the bench, I do it every day and twice on Sunday.  Plus, I like AJM and would like to see the guy get a chance.  

 I may be wrong, but all of those guys are likely gone by pick #25 (round 1). My point is we have all the cards with AJM. He makes less than $750K in 2017, we can also 1st round tender him for 3 million in 2018 so less than 2 million a year for a solid NFL backup minimum and could potentially be as good or better than guys that will be paid a lot more in the 2017 draft. The worst case scenario is we keep him in 2017 and let him go into FA in 2018 where very likely he signs for 10 million a year plus meaning 3rd round compensation. I understand he may not play one snap sitting the bench, but he also may be needed to bail us out in the event AD is injured.

Who do we trust on the roster right now other than AJM if Dalton is injured? I say no one which makes him more valuable than some want to admit. AJM played very well against a Denver defense on the road loaded with great pass rushers back in 2015 subbing for AD so he has shown he can do well against defenses albeit limited opportunity to show and thus prove it.

(04-09-2017, 12:36 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote:  I may be wrong, but all of those guys are likely gone by pick #25 (round 1). My point is we have all the cards with AJM. He makes less than $750K in 2017, we can also 1st round tender him for 3 million in 2018 so less than 2 million a year for a solid NFL backup minimum and could potentially be as good or better than guys that will be paid a lot more in the 2017 draft. The worst case scenario is we keep him in 2017 and let him go into FA in 2018 where very likely he signs for 10 million a year plus meaning 3rd round compensation. I understand he may not play one snap sitting the bench, but he also may be needed to bail us out in the event AD is injured.

Who do we trust on the roster right now other than AJM if Dalton is injured? I say no one which makes him more valuable than some want to admit. AJM played very well against a Denver defense on the road loaded with great pass rushers back in 2015 subbing for AD so he has shown he can do well against defenses albeit limited opportunity to show and thus prove it.

Lot of valid points. But this team may be facing a rebuilding year or two and could use all the potential picks they can get over a luxury.  

There is also the chance that Dalton and AJM get decimated behind this OL and he becomes worthless. 

He is way more replaceable than many others we have let go the last few years. 

(04-09-2017, 08:58 AM)fredtoast Wrote: I believe it will hurt us if Dalton gets injured.

Which has happened a total of 2 times?


His first game against Cleveland he missed a quarter or 2.

Then the freak thumb injury while he was playing linebacker.

Are you really that afraid he is going to get injured that you don't want to improve our starters by trading a bench rider? We are picking at #9 and you want to keep a luxury. There are other capable backups out there we can sign but how many backups do teams look at as a starter?

(04-09-2017, 12:36 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote:  I may be wrong, but all of those guys are likely gone by pick #25 (round 1). My point is we have all the cards with AJM. He makes less than $750K in 2017, we can also 1st round tender him for 3 million in 2018 so less than 2 million a year for a solid NFL backup minimum and could potentially be as good or better than guys that will be paid a lot more in the 2017 draft. The worst case scenario is we keep him in 2017 and let him go into FA in 2018 where very likely he signs for 10 million a year plus meaning 3rd round compensation. I understand he may not play one snap sitting the bench, but he also may be needed to bail us out in the event AD is injured.

Who do we trust on the roster right now other than AJM if Dalton is injured? I say no one which makes him more valuable than some want to admit. AJM played very well against a Denver defense on the road loaded with great pass rushers back in 2015 subbing for AD so he has shown he can do well against defenses albeit limited opportunity to show and thus prove it.

As far as the backup QB goes, look up Driscoll's college career.  The Bengals felt strongly enough about him to keep him on the roster the entire season.  He was able to learn the offense last year, and will get more experience this year as a part of our OTAs.  

I'm not saying he is McCarron, but he also never had the supporting offensive cast that McCarron did, either.  I like the guy.  

True, Njoku, Cam Robinson, and McCafferty may all be gone at #33, but someone of Pro Bowl Caliber talent will be sitting there...I guarantee it.  And that player contributing is worth much more than AJM on the bench.  

(04-09-2017, 01:10 PM)CageTheBengal Wrote: Are you really that afraid he is going to get injured that you don't want to improve our starters by trading a bench rider? 

Only a minority of second round picks are starters.  I think it was only 10 of 32 last year.

And QB is the modt important position on the team.  So the back up QB is much more important than back ups at other positions.

Look, if the Bengals get a second round pick for McCarron, I'd be fine with that.  But I don't see the success of the team hanging on an extra second round pick, so I won't be upset if we do not trade him.