(04-18-2017, 07:30 AM)Striped4war Wrote: We had the exact same back in Burkhead.It would be a wasted pick in my eyes seeing is without a line to block no RB is gonna make a difference enough to warrant such a high pick.Not even Fournette who I would really really love to have on stripes.If we trade back I hope it's for Cam Robinson.Gio is gonna be Gio when he gets back healthy.Hill is in a contract year and even though I don't want him here after the playoff fumble ( I will never forgive him ) he will at least make the effort to be better instead of showboating and acting like a look at me clown.

Burkhead wasn't in McCaffery's league, plus they were very different kind of runners.

(04-18-2017, 09:38 AM)Au165 Wrote: Burkhead wasn't in McCaffery's league, plus they were very different kind of runners.

Not denying McCaffrey is a talent but seriously think our fans didn't realize what we had in Burkhead.All he needed was a chance and fair which he never got here.Watch what he does for the Pats this coming year.We should have never let him leave imo.

(04-18-2017, 09:44 AM)Striped4war Wrote: Not denying McCaffrey is a talent but seriously think our fans didn't realize what we had in Burkhead.All he needed was a chance and fair which he never got here.Watch what he does for the Pats this coming year.We should have never let him leave imo.

I actually think he won't do much in New England. Bill Belicheck always collects HBs then uses them in various roles but none ever become big time players. I am sure he will have a big game or two, but not sure he has the break out year people are expecting.

(04-18-2017, 09:52 AM)Au165 Wrote: I actually think he won't do much in New England. Bill Belicheck always collects HBs then uses them in various roles but none ever become big time players. I am sure he will have a big game or two, but not sure he has the break out year people are expecting.

This. And in all honesty, if you're that good you don't stay as the 3rd string HB...

(04-18-2017, 09:52 AM)Au165 Wrote: I actually think he won't do much in New England. Bill Belicheck always collects HBs then uses them in various roles but none ever become big time players. I am sure he will have a big game or two, but not sure he has the break out year people are expecting.

 They definitely are not loyal to backs as we are but I would almost guarantee his stats still outshine Hills at the end of this coming up year.It-shirt a wait and see sscenario for sure but I feel confident Hill isn't half the back Burkhead is.

(04-18-2017, 10:00 AM)Striped4war Wrote:  They definitely are not loyal to backs as we are but I would almost guarantee his stats still outshine Hills at the end of this coming up year.It-shirt a wait and see sscenario for sure but I feel confident Hill isn't half the back Burkhead is.

I don't know that either are truly top 15 starting back material. That is why I'd like to see a rookie come in that is built to handle 20-25 touches a game, but not a 1st round back.

(04-18-2017, 09:58 AM)rezolve11 Wrote: This. And in all honesty, if you're that good you don't stay as the 3rd string HB...

 I just think coaches get caught up in dimensions.Height ,size,weight,,etc.. How else do you think we got Geno in the 4th? A lot of talents never get to show there true talent because they never get the same fair shake as some.Its no secret if it wasn't for injuries Burfict would probably never got his chance to shine .Burkhead was undervalued here.That happens when yout draft 2 running backs high.Hill could have continued to stink it up but Burkhead would have never gotten his fair shake because Marvin has to justify why Hill is a second round pick.

(04-18-2017, 10:07 AM)Au165 Wrote: I don't know that either are truly top 15 starting back material. That is why I'd like to see a rookie come in that is built to handle 20-25 touches a game, but not a 1st round back.

Agreed completely here.

(04-18-2017, 10:08 AM)Striped4war Wrote:  I just think coaches get caught up in dimensions.Height ,size,weight,,etc.. How else do you think we got Geno in the 4th? A lot of talents never get to show there true talent because they never get the same fair shake as some.Its no secret if it wasn't for injuries Burfict would probably never got his chance to shine .Burkhead was undervalued here.That happens when yout draft 2 running backs high.Hill could have continued to stink it up but Burkhead would have never gotten his fair shake because Marvin has to justify why Hill is a second round pick.

I understand your thought process here, but I just don't know that I can fully agree with you. I'm sure they do a fair evaluation of all their players. I think it's very apparent that the Bengals don't care what the fans think. They are trying to build a winning football team the way they do it. So with that said, I'm more than sure they saw Burkhead in practices and never thought he should be starting in front of Hill. Hill has been trash and I'm ready to move on from him, but even if Burkhead does well in NE it doesn't prove that he is better than Hill. Everyone in NE is used to their strengths. They just do not misuse guys. If they see a weakness in an opposing defense that Burkhead can exploit, they will use him the entire game. He might get 3 touches the next week. You know what I'm saying?

(04-17-2017, 09:53 AM)Au165 Wrote: He had one of the best lines? False.  He struggled when they had turnover? False. People confuse draftable lineman with good lines. They run a pro style offense, so teams draft their lineman because they are more pro ready, similar to Wisconsin, but it doesn't mean they are good hence them not really doing much in the NFL besides DeCastro.

This makes no sense.  Based on this logic Vince Young was not a good college QB.

(04-17-2017, 09:53 AM)Au165 Wrote: The guy averaged 6.3 yards a carry this year in a power 5 conference!

And his backup averaged 7.1 on 111 carries.

(04-18-2017, 12:07 PM)fredtoast Wrote: This makes no sense.  Based on this logic Vince Young was not a good college QB.

I have no clue what this even means.

It is no secret lineman coming into the NFL the last couple years have not been good mainly because of the spread schemes being ran. The few teams that still run pro style blocking schemes have their guys drafted whether they are "good" or not. Ramczyk from Wisconsin is a perfect example of this right now. He is flying up draft boards because he played well enough in a pro style offense and the rest of the field is so bad someone has to be "the guy". You can be a really good guard in a spread scheme for example, maybe even one of the best, but it doesn't mean you will be drafted high because it's not necessarily a transferable skill set.

My point is very simple, simply because a couple lineman have been drafted from Stanford does not mean he was playing behind one of the best O lines, just one of the best equipped to translate to the NFL. He didn't struggle with the turnover either, so that point is not even really debatable.

(04-18-2017, 12:13 PM)fredtoast Wrote: And his backup averaged 7.1 on 111 carries.

I can go find 111 carries where he averaged more. Smaller sample size allows for bigger plays to have more impact. If we are doing that let's throw in

Fournette averaged 6.5, his backup 7.6
Dalvin Cook 6.1, back up 5.7
Kamarra 5.8, back up 6.4

Apparently no back should be drafted because their back ups are all just as good!

(04-18-2017, 12:13 PM)Au165 Wrote: I have no clue what this even means.

It means that just because a player does not excel in the NFL that does not mean he was not good in college.

We are not judging the Stanford O-line based on what they do in the NFL.  We are talking about how they perform in college.

(04-18-2017, 12:23 PM)fredtoast Wrote: It means that just because a player does not excel in the NFL that does not mean he was not good in college.

We are not judging the Stanford O-line based on what they do in the NFL.  We are talking about how they perform in college.

In that case then they aren't one of the best offensive line in college. I was giving the benefit of the doubt that he was using the fact they are drafted as the reason he was calling them "one of the best". What metric are we judging it by then? They gave up 20 sacks this year, putting them at 34th in that metric. They weren't top 50 in total tackles for loss allowed and Rushing yards per game they were 48th. So, someone should tell me how they had one of the best O lines in the country, I am not seeing it.

(04-16-2017, 01:59 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: I know this may not be very popular.

But if the defensive end Allen, OJ Howard, LF, and Thomas are all gone at number nine what do you think about trading down a few spots and taking McCaffrey?

McCaffrey seems like one of those running backs that can do just about anything. In addition he doesn't really need a good offensive line to cut it loose.

I would love it if we traded down and grabbed McCaffrey, heck i would be for taking him at 9 if those guys are all gone.

BPA baby and McCaffrey can do it all. With Gio's injury, this should be a thought. Same with Mixon and Dalvin Cook.

We need a RB somewhat early and McCaffrey will be a very good one in the NFL. Hard worker that doesn't have the off
field problems of Mixon and Cook. As a matter a fact McCaffrey is an outstanding individual.

allen and thomas are not scheme fits. stop talking about them. QB's will be taken in top 10 and guys will fall. I still think Hassan Reddick is the best pick we can take at 9. top 5 teams are bringing him in now and its pretty obvious this guy has superstar potential

(04-18-2017, 02:01 PM)Okeana Wrote: allen and thomas are not scheme fits.  stop talking about them.  QB's will be taken in top 10 and guys will fall.  I still think Hassan Reddick is the best pick we can take at 9.  top 5 teams are bringing him in now and its pretty obvious this guy has superstar potential

Thomas would fit. Allen is too talented too pass up plus he could kick inside and play downs outside which Bengals love.  Reddick is a stud.  Nevertheless, Eifert is made of china so Howard is an option.  I just think McCaffrey is a difference maker.  Don't think at 9 but definitely later if they trade AJM for 33.

(04-17-2017, 09:53 AM)Au165 Wrote: He had one of the best lines? False.  He struggled when they had turnover? False. People confuse draftable lineman with good lines. They run a pro style offense, so teams draft their lineman because they are more pro ready, similar to Wisconsin, but it doesn't mean they are good hence them not really doing much in the NFL besides DeCastro.

His yards per attempt were up this year and he scored more rushing TDs. The only decline for him this year was in usage not in production (253 carries to 337). I am going to say it since most people won't, if he was black he'd be a sure fire top 15 pick and no one would question it. The guy averaged 6.3 yards a carry this year in a power 5 conference! The same stigma black QBs had up until a couple years ago, white running backs still have. The only reason I am opposed to him for us is I don't think we will use him to his full potential, but the kid should be in the discussion with all the top backs, all he did was produce.

This!!......Throw in the NFL pedigree and I predict a very high probability of success at the next level.

(04-18-2017, 09:38 AM)Au165 Wrote: Burkhead wasn't in McCaffery's league, plus they were very different kind of runners.

 Just want to apologize for thinking.Burkhead was the same back as McCaffery.Please disregard everything I said earlier up until this point.I just watched something on the kid on Instagram illustrating how fast his feet were .It is amazing and I wish I could find a way everyone could see it. He's definitely got llightning feet.With that said I still liked Burkhead though.I had a soft spot for the guy.